Post-Game Talk: Literally shooting yourself in the foot

It's possible for the other guys out there to have screwed up badly too. But the play by Skinner is otherworldly bizarre and bad, and that's thinking with complete reason today and having watched multiple viewings.
All I’m saying is if you asked me if I’d rather have Smith take a shot on Skinner from where he was in that screenshot or miss the net from the goal line I’d take the latter every time.

It’s just bad luck that we turned it into an own goal.
 
I find that argument a cop out too. Skinner has plenty of arguments against him but it's clear scapegoating if we are blaming him for the mistakes of the skaters in front of him too.

I could understand if the problems that led to the loss were that we were too conservative and defensive and that put us on our heels all night. Thats not what happened though. So, the team doesn't have enough faith in their goalie, and that causes Dmen and forwards to pinch for offense on a 2-0 lead, and allow odd man breaks the other way? Nah, the team had poor decision making and just weren't bailed out this time.

Even on that last goal, the blame is split many ways. And yeah, there is blame on Skinner too, but we let Smith walk in there with seconds to go so we could gamble for the winner
Its not a copout. You're not in the position of having had to work twice as hard as opponents over the course of around 3years now because you have a clown #1 in net.

It would be like watching a Baseball club with the worst pitchers in the MLB and blaming the lack of success on batters not getting enough runs and home runs.

After a long period of time humans associate painful stimuli and learn to anticipate the worst. Human pain and processing is hardwired to avoidance of pain and it shaping behavior. Look up the paradox of "Learned Helplessness" for interesting reading.

They're aren't two players on the planet that want the cup more than McD or Drai or who have been playing harder than anybody for it. They would've had 1-2 cups by now without subpar goaltending.
 
One way to look at it from a positive, the team can play much better then they did tonight. I am hoping Drai is not nursing another injury. Everyone is this time of year. He just looks off right now. I expect a big game from him Monday night. Hopefully Pickard is gtg
 
Imagine being so eager to blame our best player all season for a loss, just to absolve one of our worst players for one bad goal when he already allowed two bad goals in the game and was unquestionably the biggest reason why the team lost last night.

Imagine being that clueless of a human being and that shitty and disloyal of a fan. We win this game with Pickard. We literally are incapable of winning a single playoff game with Stu.

And we know Drai can be better. No one has a clue what the heck Skinner is gonna do at any given moment. His running out of the net is primary source of panic for Drai and the whole group on that last play. Skinner unaware he has 2 teammates and no one else in the slot also leads him to chipping that pass from behind the net in the air so no one on our team could grab it. He’s just a complete disaster.
 
lol, what??? The puck ended up in a vacated net- that is the definition of it not working. He commits to a shot, fully sells out. Right then Skinner is screwed because he has zero ability to push side to side. Smith just walks around him and it’s in.
Yes, it ended up in the net because of an own goal. Skinner forced a shot wide that had a 0% chance to go in otherwise. He can’t account for Draisaitl putting it in lol.

You can’t just ignore that part.
 
I find that argument a cop out too. Skinner has plenty of arguments against him but it's clear scapegoating if we are blaming him for the mistakes of the skaters in front of him too.

I could understand if the problems that led to the loss were that we were too conservative and defensive and that put us on our heels all night. Thats not what happened though. So, the team doesn't have enough faith in their goalie, and that causes Dmen and forwards to pinch for offense on a 2-0 lead, and allow odd man breaks the other way? Nah, the team had poor decision making and just weren't bailed out this time.

Even on that last goal, the blame is split many ways. And yeah, there is blame on Skinner too, but we let Smith walk in there with seconds to go so we could gamble for the winner
We had players that played poorly and made bad decisions throughout the game. No one is denying that. But at the end of the day, you need a goalie who can bail you out of some of them, makes for a championship team. Your response is the completely cop out and not acknowledging that he is a problem in the net.

And Smith didn't "walk in there". He was far to the side with a second or so left. No chance to do anything other than shoot from a terrible angle. All Skinner had to do was stay in the net and play his angle and position. If it was any other goalie, you could look the other way as a one off. But Skinner comes into the game with the reputation of being unable to make saves in the biggest moments, and has the stats overall to prove it. The goal that occurred in game 1 could only happen to Skinner, let's face it. Almost expected at this point.
 
I do agree that the teams were pretty even last night. I'd even say the same about game 2, and all the easy tap ins we missed flattered Vegas a bit. So out of two roughly even games we had a split, with one goal margins. By any measure, the outcomes we had should be expected. The 2-1 series score matches the play on the ice. It seems to me like the goaltending duel isn't the major reason we lost a game. It's just a shame we can't take advantage of Hill's sub standard play as much, but what happens when we have to face a confident Otteinger or Hellebuyck? So imo this is a chance for our skaters to have the pressure on them too. We had flashes of greatness in game 1 but haven't had the answer to their adjustments since then
Yeah I agree. We need to stop looking for the long breakout pass all the time. Vegas has adjusted to that and we can't keep having our forwards blow the zone looking for a stretch pass at centre. They're getting their sticks in lanes.

That said I'm ok with a 2-1 lead. I do think we would have had a better chance to win last night with Pickard in. Didn't love any of the goals Stu let in, and would be willing to give him a break on one or two of them if he hadn't been complete dog water all season/playoffs long.
 
So the Oilers lose by one goal and Skinner is responsible for two going in, since, in your words, "he needs to make those." Take away one of those goals and it's a tie game. Take away the other goal and...we win. So, by your logic, shouldn't Skinner be held responsible "first and foremost" for the loss?

You've proven that you exercise absolutely no logic when it comes to game evaluation. Look no further than game 7 .

However, goals 1 and 2 could have been played better by Stu...but the bigger concern on both is how is a player left alone alone in the crease....and how does a 1 on 2 turn into a breakaway?

Lastly, the picture Tyler posted...1 player doing the starfish. Another facing away from the play, and the player furthest from the puck is the only one clued in.

The Oilers were horrific tonite on D, and the 9mil assistant captain was pure garbage.

That loss was not 100% on the goalie which I know you can't even remotely wrap your head around

That game was on the D...and Stu. And the GWG....was 1000% on Drai
 
I'm not saying that Stu had a good game overall, he definitely didn't and I'm hoping Pickard can come back in. But anyone who thinks turning this shooting opportunity into a shot that literally had 0% of going in if not for an own goal is a bad play is thinking emotionally instead of logically. I'm more concerned about how we turned a 2 on 4 into this kind of defensive fire drill.

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Obviously Skinner did not turn this into a "shot that literally had 0% chance of going in"

Do you post thoughts this carelessly on purpose? Right now you're reminding me of Spector.
 
I find that argument a cop out too. Skinner has plenty of arguments against him but it's clear scapegoating if we are blaming him for the mistakes of the skaters in front of him too.

There's no scapegoating Skinner here. The team hasn't won a single game with him and net and won every single game without him. Literally the only change to our roster other than removing Jeff Skinner after game one was putting Skinner back in net.

Sure, the players in front of him made mistakes, they made mistakes last game too, but we had a competent goalie who did his job and that has almost been the sole difference between this team winning games and losing games.

Again, it bears repeating: this team hasn't lost a game without Skinner. This team has only lost games WITH Skinner. Skinner has the worst save percentage and GSAx per 60 of any goalie to play at least one full game in these playoffs. It can't possibly be any more obvious that he is our single biggest liability. By far. That's not hyperbole.
 
Yes, it ended up in the net because of an own goal. Skinner forced a shot wide that had a 0% chance to go in otherwise. He can’t account for Draisaitl putting it in lol.

You can’t just ignore that part.
He didn’t force a shot wide- he allowed a shot to a wide open net, 6 inches from the goal line. Are you Skinner intentionally didn’t stop the puck because he was directing it to go wide? Do you honestly believe the expectation from Skinner is no player is ever in the crease the puck could deflect off of? Skinner failed on multiple fronts- he sold out to the shot with seconds left. He then couldn’t push off effectively to stop a shot towards the net. You know that blue area- that’s the crease Skinner is supposed to be in.
 
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What a moron. A) the shot wasn’t going wide- it was going through the crease, a few inches from the goal line, with no goalie in the net. If Ranford said “am I supposed to be in my net for all shots?” It would be a more apt quote
Smith had no other option but to shoot from a bad angle, based on where he was and the time remaining. All Skinner had to do was hold the net and cover the angle. But instead, he loses his mind and charges wildly out, with no concept of time and space.
 
Honestly disgusting how much water our media carry for Skinner. Yet guys like Spector have relentlessly run other players out of town like Petry and tried to with Bouch for a long time.
You have to secretly hate the Oilers team to go to bat this hard for the one player that is negating success here more than any other. Its basic contempt of the team that they are supporting Skinner alone so ardently. Of course Drai is target #1 for the media. I bet he didn't have a good postgame either talking to the press. ;)
 
The ending of that game was honestly expected, if Skinner can find a way to lose us a game in the most embarrassing fashion possible he will find a way. What does shock me are the people who line up to defend this guy over and over and over again. He has one good game out of 20 because we give up a total of 5 shots and we get the "TOLD YA SO!" nonsense from his fanboys. Unsure what anyone sees in this guy as an NHL goalie. Honestly no clue other than his size.

Movement/Agility: Trash
Skating: Abysmal
Hockey IQ: Negative
Ability to Handle Pressure: Panic Attack
Saving pucks shot at his chest protector: Passable
 
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Listening to Skinner’s post game again- not only does he not take accountability - he is blaming his team. “I gave them a chance to win” meaning the loss is not his fault- it’s the teams. He has done this before- earlier in the season when the team lost to Florida and he was shit- he blamed the team. He most definitely reads his own press clippings and has settled into “it’s not my fault” mentality. This is as good as he will ever be.
 
We had players that played poorly and made bad decisions throughout the game. No one is denying that. But at the end of the day, you need a goalie who can bail you out of some of them, makes for a championship team. Your response is the completely cop out and not acknowledging that he is a problem in the net.

And Smith didn't "walk in there". He was far to the side with a second or so left. No chance to do anything other than shoot from a terrible angle. All Skinner had to do was stay in the net and play his angle and position. If it was any other goalie, you could look the other way as a one off. But Skinner comes into the game with the reputation of being unable to make saves in the biggest moments, and has the stats overall to prove it. The goal that occurred in game 1 could only happen to Skinner, let's face it. Almost expected at this point.
If Skinner can't make that stop off Reilly from that sort of angle unscreened he shouldn't even be in the league. whoops.
 
You have to secretly hate the Oilers team to go to bat this hard for the one player that is negating success here more than any other. It’s basic contempt of the team that they are supporting Skinner alone so ardently. Of course Drai is target #1 for the media. I bet he didn't have a good postgame either talking to the press. ;)
McDavid and Drai are always the number one target. Media here have no idea how the game is played. None.
 
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Oh 100% Stu sucks. A couple goals tonite he needs to make those.

However, stepping up on the shot was the right play.

On that goal Vegas was allowed to walk in on him on both posts.

Emotionally people hate Skinner...logically they should be hating Nurse for that game first and foremost
I thought Nurse was one of our best dmen and was pretty good last night overall. I don't hate Skinner. I just think he's a shitty goalie.
 
Listening to Skinner’s post game again- not only does he not take accountability - he is blaming his team. “I gave them a chance to win” meaning the loss is not his fault- it’s the teams. He has done this before- earlier in the season when the team lost to Florida and he was shit- he blamed the team. He most definitely reads his own press clippings and has settled into “it’s not my fault” mentality. This is as good as he will ever be.
He's too much of a dope to even realize the semantics of what he's saying. Thats giving him more credit than one should that he even thought about it.

But it was my read. If you say you gave your team a chance to win, and that you were comfortable with your own game then doesn't it logically follow you are blaming something else?

Although Skinner did blame bad luck, bad bounces and astrology as well. (I'm being sarcastic)

On the surface it seems Skinner is blaming others rather than himself. But his level of analysis is bereft of tertiary thoughts on what he's saying.
 
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If Skinner can't make that stop off Reilly from that sort of angle unscreened he shouldn't even be in the league. whoops.
Steve Valiquette, former goalie and goalie analytics guru (works for Clear Sight Analytics) said Stuart is a non-NHL goalie on rush chances. He has issues judging speed of the skater, his space, and timing. This was a perfect example. Skinner races out, then he screws himself because he misjudged the players speed, mis-timed the shot, and really ended up being a pylon that Smith skated around
 
There's no scapegoating Skinner here. The team hasn't won a single game with him and net and won every single game without him. Literally the only change to our roster other than removing Jeff Skinner after game one was putting Skinner back in net.

Sure, the players in front of him made mistakes, they made mistakes last game too, but we had a competent goalie who did his job and that has almost been the sole difference between this team winning games and losing games.

Again, it bears repeating: this team hasn't lost a game without Skinner. This team has only lost games WITH Skinner. Skinner has the worst save percentage and GSAx per 60 of any goalie to play at least one full game in these playoffs. It can't possibly be any more obvious that he is our single biggest liability. By far. That's not hyperbole.
A stat like Pickard's record is one destined to be a product of small sample size, and it even did depend on Hill giving up too many goals as well. And no, I'm not saying Skinner was as good as Pickard. I think if Pickard was in net we would have won. What I'm saying is that if we go up against an actual good goalie then we are going to be in big trouble unless we clean up our play, which was bad in front of Pickard too
 

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