Player Discussion Leo Carlsson

[SmokeyDuck]

I dont know why Cronin even needs to be mentioned in this. If he figured something(s) out with some of the best players in the world that was holding him back, thats really all that needs to be said.

Cronin and beeker want more well rounded guys, so the focus has been on weaknesses. Hes improved a lot in those areas, similar to Zegras. Then gets the added benefit of going and playing with the best of his countrymen and figured out some of the smaller things that possibly led to allowing his strengths to shine and getting over the hump.

People try to sneak that Cronin hate into every comment they can lol. That being said I think Carlsson is turning into a well rounded player, just not as fast as people want. He just got over the 40 percent mark on faceoffs, and is currently at a +3, playing on our top line against top players. Also he's only 20.

 

[Leonardo87]

People try to sneak that Cronin hate into every comment they can lol. That being said I think Carlsson is turning into a well rounded player, just not as fast as people want. He just got over the 40 percent mark on faceoffs, and is currently at a +3, playing on our top line against top players. Also he's only 20.

Leo has improved this season. His production is on par to what he did last year, with a couple of more goals to boot, but with much less ice time. Averaged just over 18 mins a game last year, this year he is just under 16 mins.

Putrid team PP has really hurt his production, like everyone else on this team. Actually has more ES points this year than last year at the same 55 game mark.

 

[Hey234]

Leo has improved this season. His production is on par to what he did last year, with a couple of more goals to boot, but with much less ice time. Averaged just over 18 mins a game last year, this year he is just under 16 mins.

Putrid team PP has really hurt his production, like everyone else on this team. Actually has more ES points this year than last year at the same 55 game mark.

I do think this point needs to be stated more. The abysmal special teams really affects player stats. If the Ducks had league average special teams, they would probably be in a wild card spot and players like Carlsson would have more points. It's astonishing how bad the PP is and how much it impacts overall team success.

 

[Deuce22]

I do think this point needs to be stated more. The abysmal special teams really affects player stats. If the Ducks had league average special teams, they would probably be in a wild card spot and players like Carlsson would have more points. It's astonishing how bad the PP is and how much it impacts overall team success.

Also why it’s questionable to be comparing our young players to others based on point totals.

 

[ohcomeonref]

Also why it’s questionable to be comparing our young players to others based on point totals.

Our young guys are part of our special teams so it's not really unreasonable imo.

 

[Deuce22]

Our young guys are part of our special teams so it's not really unreasonable imo.

Vets getting far more PP time than guys like Leo, Cutter, and young D. Not to mention the PP coaching/plan is substandard.

 

[Kalv]

Just got a career high 30 points, on pace for 39.

As for the Famtilli debate, with CBJ scoring more, he is also their 4th leading scorer where Leo is not close to that IIRC. Although he's catching up now. But at times I find Leo's game as lackluster. My concern is growing that beefing up will not solve all problems for his game.
He should still be a good player tho.

 

[Rasp]

Just got a career high 30 points, on pace for 39.

As for the Famtilli debate, with CBJ scoring more, he is also their 4th leading scorer where Leo is not close to that IIRC. Although he's catching up now. But at times I find Leo's game as lackluster. My concern is growing that beefing up will not solve all problems for his game.
He should still be a good player tho.

We need to bring in an experienced goal scorer for him to play with. Better linemates and some more size will help him a lot

 

[anezthes]

15 points in the last 15 games while averaging ~15 minutes.

 

[HanSolo]

What's promising is he still has room for improvement. It seems like his confidence is back on track but we still see him making timing errors. Like the sequence where we had four different players attempt zone entries on a single powerplay shift and each on failed. Leo's failed attempt came from a proper crossing of the blue line but he put the puck a little too far ahead of him and didn't proceed with enough speed to pull the puck back in before he got converged on by two defenders. If he had just timed the play differently he could have corraled it into himself, shielded the puck off with his body and chip dumped or passed off to another entering player.

I feel like these mistakes will improve with time but something can be said for three other Ducks trying to carry the puck in with aggressive defense from Nashville and failing similarly. Seems Clune was trying something new but they didn't drill how to beat a two man puck press.

 

[Leonardo87]

Watching the TNT broadcast last game, before HF Armageddon, was going to note that the announcers were comparing him to Barkov. I know the comparisons have been made before but was cool to see some of the pro commentators mention the comparison.

 

[Reveille1984]

I think the consensus was always that Fantilli was more "NHL ready" just due to his build and natural goal scoring ability, where as Carlsson would be more of a project. So it's not really surprising that Fantilli is pulling away a bit this year (though not by a huge margin). Carlsson also has more special teams points than Fantilli, so that argument doesn't really make sense.

The biggest difference honestly is that Carlsson just doesn't shoot the puck enough and is naturally more of a distributor. He has almost 70 less SOG than Fantilli this season which is pretty insane. I think as he: 1.) works with better linemates 2.) gains strength and stamina and 3.) gains more confidence in his shot he'll naturally become a good if not elite 1C.

 

[robbieboy3686]

I think the consensus was always that Fantilli was more "NHL ready" just due to his build and natural goal scoring ability, where as Carlsson would be more of a project. So it's not really surprising that Fantilli is pulling away a bit this year (though not by a huge margin). Carlsson also has more special teams points than Fantilli, so that argument doesn't really make sense.

The biggest difference honestly is that Carlsson just doesn't shoot the puck enough and is naturally more of a distributor. He has almost 70 less SOG than Fantilli this season which is pretty insane. I think as he: 1.) works with better linemates 2.) gains strength and stamina and 3.) gains more confidence in his shot he'll naturally become a good if not elite 1C.

He needs to fing shoot the puck more . Period

 

[CrazyDuck4u]

He needs to fing shoot the puck more . Period

He also is horrible at utilizing the space he creates for himself with his speed. Like he always backs up guys only to turn into the defensemen. I just don't get it..

 

[robbieboy3686]

He also is horrible at utilizing the space he creates for himself with his speed. Like he always backs up guys only to turn into the defensemen. I just don't get it..

It’s almost lazy and lacks willpower. But many will say it’s his age. Let’s hope it’s the latter

 

[HanSolo]

It’s almost lazy and lacks willpower. But many will say it’s his age. Let’s hope it’s the latter

Well. Lack of experience, size/strength and guidance--be it from the coaches or teammates or both--probably factors in a lot.

 

[Reveille1984]

Well. Lack of experience, size/strength and guidance--be it from the coaches or teammates or both--probably factors in a lot.

Yeah, I highly doubt it's out of laziness or anything like that. He just isn't an aggressive offensive forward that naturally has a nose for the goal, similar to Zegras. He's always looking for the best pass or creative play and kind of shoots as a last resort. Unfortunately that extra pass usually ends up on the stick of someone like Killorn and the play dies.

I honestly also think he second guesses himself a lot due to getting smacked around a bit in the NHL. He takes some hard hits for a guy his size and puts himself into dangerous positions, but again that's mainly an experience thing. In the SHL where the rinks are bigger and the play is less physical, he probably wasn't getting physically punished as much for bad positioning.

 

[robbieboy3686]

Yeah, I highly doubt it's out of laziness or anything like that. He just isn't an aggressive offensive forward that naturally has a nose for the goal, similar to Zegras. He's always looking for the best pass or creative play and kind of shoots as a last resort. Unfortunately that extra pass usually ends up on the stick of someone like Killorn and the play dies.

I honestly also think he second guesses himself a lot due to getting smacked around a bit in the NHL. He takes some hard hits for a guy his size and puts himself into dangerous positions, but again that's mainly an experience thing. In the SHL where the rinks are bigger and the play is less physical, he probably wasn't getting physically punished as much for bad positioning.

Verbeek was adamant last season with Leo that Leo needed to put on a bunch of weight in the off-season. And Leo said that wasn’t needed for himself

 

[ScarTroy]

Verbeek was adamant last season with Leo that Leo needed to put on a bunch of weight in the off-season. And Leo said that wasn’t needed for himself

He said he needed to listen to his body, and he’s right he can’t overdo it and injure himself. Verbeek can be right in saying Leo needs to build mass, while also have a somewhat unrealistic goal. Leo seems like the kind of guy that puts in the necessary work, so if he said he thought he was overdoing it, then I believe him.

 

[Mr Rogers]

I think it'll come out over time who was more reasonable about last summer. Right now i don't really have an opinion. If Leo doesn't look much stronger again next year, i'll be more inclined to believe he's just not working enough to get himself closer to where Verbeek wants him to be.

What i will say is that Leo doesn't really look much stronger/faster this year than last, he seemed quicker early in the year but that didn't seem to really last in the ensuing months.

 

[zegrassyknoll]

It’s almost lazy and lacks willpower. But many will say it’s his age. Let’s hope it’s the latter

Don't forget that he tosses his head back sometimes when he misses a shot. He should be traded for that alone

 

[zegrassyknoll]

A common sentiment I read here is people wanting Leo to "take over games" like Getzlaf. Getz took over games by slowing them down which is like the opposite play style of Leo.

I don't want him to play anything like Getzlaf tbh. With his skating ability I would much rather have him be a player that relentlessly attacks the net like MacKinnon and controls possession through movement vs. strength.

Sure he can get a little tougher, and he will naturally as he ages, but people expecting him to be a type of player he's not are just going to be disappointed.

 

[HanSolo]

Yeah, I highly doubt it's out of laziness or anything like that. He just isn't an aggressive offensive forward that naturally has a nose for the goal, similar to Zegras. He's always looking for the best pass or creative play and kind of shoots as a last resort. Unfortunately that extra pass usually ends up on the stick of someone like Killorn and the play dies.

I honestly also think he second guesses himself a lot due to getting smacked around a bit in the NHL. He takes some hard hits for a guy his size and puts himself into dangerous positions, but again that's mainly an experience thing. In the SHL where the rinks are bigger and the play is less physical, he probably wasn't getting physically punished as much for bad positioning.

I think that's probably part of it but he seems sensitive to his own mistakes and those his linemates make. Part of the impression that he lacks confidence is he probably second guesses his passes and deke attempts out of fear of making mistakes.

 

[JAHV]

A common sentiment I read here is people wanting Leo to "take over games" like Getzlaf. Getz took over games by slowing them down which is like the opposite play style of Leo.

I don't want him to play anything like Getzlaf tbh. With his skating ability I would much rather have him be a player that relentlessly attacks the net like MacKinnon and controls possession through movement vs. strength.

Sure he can get a little tougher, and he will naturally as he ages, but people expecting him to be a type of player he's not are just going to be disappointed.

I have said the bolded numerous times. It has nothing to do with style of play. Getzlaf is the last player the Ducks had who could truly take over games. Yes, you're right, he did it with puck possession, vision, and an ability to physically wear down opposing defensemen until they just gave him the puck so he would stop hitting them. Paul Kariya and Teemu Selanne could also take over games. They did it with speed and scoring ability; if they were on the ice, the other team always had to be worried about what they would do if they got to a loose puck. Scott Niedermayer could take over games with his relentless hounding of the puck and his ability to always be in the right place to neutralize a scoring chance.

Leo Carlsson might employ some of those elements, or none. I don't really care. This team is in desperate need of a guy who, when the rest of the team is struggling, just says, "Alright boys, I've got this." I don't expect him to be doing it every game, or even most games. I'd just like to see it to know he has it in him. We've seen some shifts where there are glimpses of it. It's been kind of teased. But as a Ducks fan, I've been waiting for eight years to see someone get to that level, and I want it.

None of this is meant to imply that Carlsson is disappointing to me. He's not. Getzlaf wasn't at this level at age 20, so it's not fair to put that on Carlsson. I'm just expressing hope that Carlsson becomes the man here and we get to see those special occasions where he enters a higher level of hockey.

 

[Wheatens]

I don't think adding mass is the cure all for Leo that people think it will be. To my eyes he appears to struggle with balance via standing too tall/upright and his flexibility seems less than ideal. I notice both of these things usually when he isn't in motion, so at face offs for instance he can appear somewhat awkward and upright. It has also shown up when he has whiffed at pucks this season. It could also be him not being fully comfortable with his body after shooting up to 6'3", and that his coordination is still not there or fully in synch. Whatever the case is, Leo adding weight/mass will not fix those issues, he needs to become comfortable lowering his centre of mass and assuming better body positions. He can still become stronger whilst working on that for sure, and hopefully he does some exercises along those lines. For example, instead of traditional squats, Leo could do pistol squats, Bulgarian split squats, Cossack squats etc... He would still become stronger but would also work on the stability, flexibility and mobility through his lower half.
The biggest thing for Leo is that he is still just 20 years old! He has a long runway. Patience is a virtue and all that.