Post-Game Talk: Leafs lose 4-2

[TheGreenTBer]

Sandin is softer than baby shit. He fit right in that's for sure

He's soft, small and not a good skater.

 

[yubbers]

Sadly, Keefe is just too big an obstacle to overcome. Another year burned due to Dubas.

The gift that keeps on giving.

Extending him.. Is on Tre though. Sigh

 

[Evilhomer]

I know they have been alternating most of the season, but I would be riding the goalie that gives me the best chance. I don't think that is Ullmark.

Who knows. It would be odd for them to use a rotation in games 1-3 and then suddenly abandon it just because they won a one goal game, especially when the odds favour Toronto winning game 4.

 

[Dekes For Days]

Pretty much everything needs to be better. That's a game we should have won, but we pretty much did all of the things on the list of ways to throw away a game.

 

[ACC1224]

Anyone else agree with the thought that the tide of the game changed when Domi hit the Goalie between whistles?

 

[Tak7]

Now factor into that Leafs Cap structure and having 1/2 your spending on only 4 forwards and how much that impacts your teams winning chances if you score 2 or few goals in 8 of your last 9 playoff games with a lineup full of $11 mil players?

That forces you to win games 2-1 or less almost forcing your Goalie to give up 1 or less goals and so its also not surprising with Leafs goaltending that they have lost 6 of those 9 games.

When your goalie give you < .900 sv% and your skaters provide 2 or less goals per game offense how realistic is it to expect a long playoff run and why 1 and done is the most likely outcome each year.

Yep.

You can understand a leaky defense or subpar goaltending within the context of their cap structure, but the one thing that should never happen with this team is a lack of offense at this time of year.

Yet, here we are.

 

[TMLegend]

They 100% have. But that's what happens when you spend roughly half your cap on 4 players. Sacrifices elsewhere have to be made. So it's not as simple as putting a Rask/Price/Bob/Vasi on the Leafs when all those are big dollar players. Can't have it all, and Dubas made the Leafs bed with the roster construction

I don't disagree at all. Then it would seem it's fairly evident the Leafs roster construction is inherently flawed. We have a team that struggles to score in the playoffs, and instead of shoring up the backend we bring in scrub goaltenders like Campbell and Samsonov and bang our heads against the wall when it doesn't work.

Sounds like we got it ass backwards here.

 

[Torontonian]

Now factor into that Leafs Cap structure and having 1/2 your spending on only 4 forwards and how much that impacts your teams winning chances if you score 2 or few goals in 8 of your last 9 playoff games with a lineup full of $11 mil players?

That forces you to win games 2-1 or less almost forcing your Goalie to give up 1 or less goals and so its also not surprising with Leafs goaltending that they have lost 6 of those 9 games.

When your goalie give you < .900 sv% and your skaters provide 2 or less goals per game offense how realistic is it to expect a long playoff run and why 1 and done is the most likely outcome each year.

In saying that, last night game is a perfect example of a game you have to win 2-1 in the playoffs. Again, we can keep talking about lack of goals, but Toronto provided enough offence and provided good d-zone play to win that game. Just your goaltender gives up a goal from the top of the crease shortside, and lets a rebound out off of his glove in the middle of the slot. That's the difference, and that's always will be the difference.

Swayman nor Ullmark have not given freebies goals up that should be stopped. In both Toronto two losses, Samsonov has given up goals that you need and expect to be saved. You won't win a cup, let alone a series when you spot the other team free goals without them working for it.

 

[57 Years No Cup]

And despite that - and that fact that he's largely got a free ride form the press for repeated playoff failures - there are *still* people in this very thread that think the issue might be that Marner can't handle the pressure of this market.

This is a great market to be a "star player"; the media is owned by the team and most of them are bordrer line cheerleaders and apologists.

Marner's issues have nothing to do with the market or the media or pressure. His issue is he is buttery soft and believes his level of talent somehow precludes him from some of the more undesirable elements of the game, namely the physical play and paying a price to go to the highly contested areas on the ice.

He simply won't do it, and when the playoffs roll around, that isn't optional. You either pay the toll, or you go home early.

 

[Suntouchable13]

Maybe they should have gone all in on Joe Woll. It’s not like rookie goalies never caught fire in the playoffs before. You’re probably gonna ditch Sammy in the summer anyway, so his feelings don’t matter.

 

[Mess]

Didn't watch.

So curious as to Knies injury? 12:46 ice time.

Happen during the game, or an accumulation of the hits he's been taking?

Interesting note Knies was tossing his weight around all night credited with 6 hits..

After the 2nd period the hits total were Boston 52 - Leafs 48 and they pointed out that was the most combined hits after 2 periods by 2 teams in the past 6 years.

There was a stretch in the game early where it was getting a little dull and nothing happening then Benoit unload on Pastrnak and Reaves immediately smash into and another Bruin sending him flying and and intensity went from 0 to 60.

This is so physical a series with our Leafs finally pushing back (which I'm loving personally as REAL hockey) that you should catch a game because you would be proud of how the Leafs are engaged it would remind you of old time hockey, This isn't Dubas Figure skaters on display any more as Leafs lead by Reaves have a real identity again and Treliving's big, mean and mobile defense lead by additions Simon Benoit, Joel Edmundson & Ilya Lyubushkin are really making things tough in for the Bruins,

This has been a black and blue series and I would be surprised if more and more players go MIA due to bruises of the physical play.

 

[darrylsittler27]

All great questions. Do you go back with Samsonnov now? The game isnt his fault but Boston has his number and there was at least one goal he should have had. I think Keefe comes back with Samsonov and goes down 3 to 1 heading into Boston. I dont think we can win this series with Samsonov, I`m sorry but goaltenders affect how teams play and when you dont get those big saves you wont win.

 

[Clark4Ever]

Special teams and goaltending, the two biggest things in the playoffs are costing us this series. Both need to be addressed in the off season with a new coach and a new goaltender.

Agreed. Even if we advance, there's little hope that we can beat Florida because of the crucial factors you mentioned.

 

[therealkoho]

I think you're having an argument with yourself

I felt like I was high on LSD after reading that post

 

[Jozay]

Keefe should make large changes to the PP. Domi for Marner, and maybe swap Tavares for Robertson and put him on the wall.

Need more shooting threats out there.

 

[Gallagbi]

Maybe they should have gone all in on Joe Woll. It’s not like rookie goalies never caught fire in the playoffs before. You’re probably gonna ditch Sammy in the summer anyway, so his feelings don’t matter.

Feels like they wanted to but he played his way out of that after the injury

 

[LeafSteel]

Anyone else agree with the thought that the tide of the game changed when Domi hit the Goalie between whistles?

Memories of his dad taking out Niedermeyer all those years ago.

 

[Al14]

Its subtle but I see refs overlook a lot of calls against the Leafs but look at the timing on that Tavares call. Im sorry but the Leafs have to overcome factor x..the refs every year.

Exactly right. However, it can be as bad for the other Canadian teams too.

Before I retired, I had several business meetings in Western Canada, Calgary and Vancouver to be specific.

While I was in Calgary, I was lucky to be invited to attend a Calgary Flames seasons ticket renewal luncheon. I watched the flames morning practice and then went to the luncheon.

Several season ticket holders went to the podium to ask what was being done by management to convey to the NHL about the refereeing bias shown in favor of American based teams against their beloved Flames.

Their GM of the time, Darryl Sutter, replied that communication to the NHL on the topic was done on a regular basis with little showing for it.

After this response, another Flames regular season tickets fan got up and said that these supposed messages were obviously not getting through to the NHL. He also that if the Toronto Maple Leafs weren't conveying the same referee bias, all would be pointless for the Flames to do so. His final statement was 'I will not be renewing my seasons tickets because I can no longer tolerate the way my Flames are being treated by the NHL officiating.'

He got a standing ovation by a few other fans. I was too chicken to mention to the others at my table that I was a Toronto Maple Leafs fan. They all though I was a Sens fan since I was from Ottawa.

Although it was just a business meeting in Vancouver, during a break, the people I was attending with got on the subject of hockey. They asked me what I though of the NHL refereeing being biased against the Canucks. I said as a hockey fan, and minor league coach at that time, I thought there were issues.

I simply said that what happened to Gilmour, and the non-call on Gretzky for high sticking him, was a travesty when Gretzky wasn't thrown out of the game as the rules specified. I further said that the Kings were gifted an appearance in the SC final with help from Kerry Fraser.

In no way shape or form did the NHL want 2 Canadian teams competing for the Stanley Cup. As we all know, the Habs won the Stanley Cup. Some 31 years later, no other Canadian team has won a Stanley Cup.

Just look at what happened to the Canucks in 2011. The fix was in during this series too. It wasn't quite right for the fans to riot, however I wish that NHL refereeing were more accountable to the fans, especially the ones paying the BIG BUCKS for seasons tickets.

I'm sure that some American based teams suffer from similar refereeing issues. It only looks more obvious to me because I watch the majority of Leaf games.

 

[likecheese]

Never going to win anything with this pk. Kampf and McCabe on the 2nd Bs goal, lolololol, wtf are they doing? McCabe (again) just runs off and vacates the net when the other d is already engaged in the corner and Kampf stands there like a lamppost. Is this coaching or just braindead players that can't be taught?

 

[fahad203]

some teams find ways to win, some finds ways to lose.

 

[BrannigansLaw]

Miserable loss given the timing and nature of their shit goals. This one stings more than Game 1 since we played much better.

The 1-1 goal in particular is so infuriating.

 

[rumman]

Why would anyone switch out their goalie who has recorded 2 wins in a series and leads the playoffs in SV% and GA/g?

In fact Swayman has won his last 5 straight games against Leafs and not surrendered more than 2 goals against in any game.

This seams like a no brainer the Leafs will need to beat Swayman for their next win. IMO

I have no idea, sounds like a foolish move to me……..

 

[BrannigansLaw]

Anyone else agree with the thought that the tide of the game changed when Domi hit the Goalie between whistles?

Maybe. It changed for sure when Sammy decided to channel Patrick Lalime on the 1-1 goal. Especially with the ratchand antics right before it.

I think in general our guys have this image of the big bad Bruins still ingrained in their heads and are trying to impose themselves physically. I love it but you gotta play the game too and not get caught up in all that. This Bruins team isn’t tough at all like the 2010 teams

 

[darrylsittler27]

Exactly right. However, it can be as bad for the other Canadian teams too.

Before I retired, I had several business meetings in Western Canada, Calgary and Vancouver to be specific.

While I was in Calgary, I was lucky to be invited to attend a Calgary Flames seasons ticket renewal luncheon. I watched the flames morning practice and then went to the luncheon.

Several season ticket holders went to the podium to ask what was being done by management to convey to the NHL about the refereeing bias shown in favor of American based teams against their beloved Flames.

Their GM of the time, Darryl Sutter, replied that communication to the NHL on the topic was done on a regular basis with little showing for it.

After this response, another Flames regular season tickets fan got up and said that these supposed messages were obviously not getting through to the NHL. He also that if the Toronto Maple Leafs weren't conveying the same referee bias, all would be pointless for the Flames to do so. His final statement was 'I will not be renewing my seasons tickets because I can no longer tolerate the way my Flames are being treated by the NHL officiating.'

He got a standing ovation by a few other fans. I was too chicken to mention to the others at my table that I was a Toronto Maple Leafs fan. They all though I was a Sens fan since I was from Ottawa.

Although it was just a business meeting in Vancouver, during a break, the people I was attending with got on the subject of hockey. They asked me what I though of the NHL refereeing being biased against the Canucks. I said as a hockey fan, and minor league coach at that time, I thought there were issues.

I simply said that what happened to Gilmour, and the non-call on Gretzky for high sticking him, was a travesty when Gretzky wasn't thrown out of the game as the rules specified. I further said that the Kings were gifted an appearance in the SC final with help from Kerry Fraser.

In no way shape or form did the NHL want 2 Canadian teams competing for the Stanley Cup. As we all know, the Habs won the Stanley Cup. Some 31 years later, no other Canadian team has won a Stanley Cup.

Just look at what happened to the Canucks in 2011. The fix was in during this series too. It wasn't quite right for the fans to riot, however I wish that NHL refereeing were more accountable to the fans, especially the ones paying the BIG BUCKS for seasons tickets.

I'm sure that some American based teams suffer from similar refereeing issues. It only looks more obvious to me because I watch the majority of Leaf games.

The fans are alone and for NHL managment to say they cant see it or do anything is a farce. That being said, I truly believe if the leafs lose this one fast many fans next year will reconsider if they can afford to pay that much for abuse.

 

[Mess]

Yep.

You can understand a leaky defense or subpar goaltending within the context of their cap structure, but the one thing that should never happen with this team is a lack of offense at this time of year.

Yet, here we are.

Now I know this opinion of mine will be controversial because of the love of some fans of that current core 4, which are built for "entertainment purposes" allowed by the nature of the regular season style of play where filling the net is much easier against lower level talent or more carefree games. .

The playoffs are a different animal where time and space and physicality are ramped up exponentially, and so those same core 4 players that thrive during the regular seasons, struggle under the new playoff style of play, because teams have the Kryptonite via style and system and intimidation nullifying offense talent and skill.

I have labelled this as "Regular Season Warriors, but Paper Tigers come the playoffs". to help explain why our star players thrive during the regular season and then struggle to deliver when the going gets tough and there is no tough to get going.

Max Domi and Tyler Bertuzzi have been just as effective or more in the playoffs than any of our Core 4 forwards and likely why Bertuzzi -- Matthews -- Domi trio have really be leading the charge so far.