Confirmed with Link: Leafs fire goaltending coach Steve Briere

[Dayjobdave]

It will be interesting to see who they bring in to run the goaltending department

 

[rocketman588]

I highlighted the logical fallacy in your argument.

Here's the thing. We now have players from dozens of countries, whereas back then 95% were Canadians, and Canada was not winning every Olympic gold medal or World Championship. So that means several things.

A) It wasn't the pinnacle of competition as it didn't include all the worlds best players, just mostly Canada's best. Which is like the "house league" comment that got this all started. It's not incorrect in applicability.
B) The atomizing occurs when you imply that the competition level of the individual players predominantly from 1 out of 200 countries (that wasn't always the best) is equivalent in the context of having players from many dozens of countries in a 32 team league vs a single country 6 team league.
C) Absolutely, being in a 6 team league doesn't render past accomplishments moot. It does render them entirely non-equivalent however. It is now up to the individual to decide for themselves if winning a cup in 1962 was similarly or more difficult than in 2022.

Canada didn't send actual teams to the Olympics.

We sent college or the Allen cup winners

In best on best hockey from 72/91 Canada won 4 tournaments and lost one to a team that played year round together.

The soviet national team (cska) also got outshot 43-16 against the flyers in a 4-1 loss and tied the Habs while getting Outshot massively.

Canada didn't win Olympics and world championships because professionals weren't allowed to play

Additionally before the late 60s the soviets didn't have that good of a hockey program.

Saying "Canada didn't win the Olympics" from the 70s-91 is stupid because we weren't allowed to send our best to the games

The soviets lost to a team of college kids in 80 as well.

I'll put it this way you let team Canada play year round as the leafs and then play the equivalent of echl dudes wed smack down the Olympic tournament in a way that they couldn't even have dreamed of.

This is a stupid take and shows a lack of understanding of hockey history. We didn't even send a team to the Olympics a couple times

 

[ITM]

I highlighted the logical fallacy in your argument.

Here's the thing. We now have players from dozens of countries, whereas back then 95% were Canadians, and Canada was not winning every Olympic gold medal or World Championship. So that means several things.

A) It wasn't the pinnacle of competition as it didn't include all the worlds best players, just mostly Canada's best. Which is like the "house league" comment that got this all started. It's not incorrect in applicability.
B) The atomizing occurs when you imply that the competition level of the individual players predominantly from 1 out of 200 countries (that wasn't always the best) is equivalent in the context of having players from many dozens of countries in a 32 team league vs a single country 6 team league.
C) Absolutely, being in a 6 team league doesn't render past accomplishments moot. It does render them entirely non-equivalent however. It is now up to the individual to decide for themselves if winning a cup in 1962 was similarly or more difficult than in 2022.

I don't see the fallacy. On the contrary...

A) It is and was the pinnacle of competition because the pinnacle of competition isn't defined by the nationalities represented but the teams in the NHL Stanley Cup Finals - the pinnacle of hockey itself.

If Tampa wins without Point and Kucherov and Vasilevskiy, Tampa wins. Martin Lapointe isn't routinely mentioned as a great Red Wing on those great Red Wings teams, but he is a Red Wing on those great Red Wings teams and his value as a champion is equivocal with Point, Kucherov and Vasilevskiy.

B) Consideration of the game's best has never been from a pool of 200 countries; It is if you value the Olympics or The Canada Cup above The Stanley Cup. You validate that model and any one like it and you undercut your claim until the best that's ever been produced by every country is represented. It's perpetually self-refuting. The league is great as a whole, past, present and future entirely and absolutely in each championship won in it's particular time.

C) Respectfully, you're missing the point. Gretzky has said McDavid is this or that degree above himself commensurate with the game's evolution. He's also said Gordie How is the best player to play the game. When you diminish the objective value of past championships that's the reduction of objectively absolute accomplishments into lesser, subjective parts...and they're not.

If a person says, if the 1934 Chicago Black Hawks took the ice against the 2015 Chicago Blackhawks they would lose, that would be a preposterous comparison. Begin with the era's equipment and the scenario ends. If that's the essence of your claim, I don't think anyone in their right mind disputes that but moreover...really considers it a valid comparison in the same way anyone might consider a race between Jim Clark's Lotus 38 and whatever Helio Castroneves won the 2021 Indy 500 with.

But in the industry, Jim Clark remains a byword for excellence in this or any other era. He isn't marginalized and his accomplishments aren't diminished as subjectively less because his equipment is/was objectively less

 

[keonsbitterness]

If anything it was probably a bit harder to play in the 6 team league when almost all 6 teams had 4 great lines and were packed with talent. Think about all the top canadians and Americans today spread out over just 6 teams...it would be like Leafs vs TB vs Florida vs boston every single matchup.

Three lines, not four. Rosters were 16 skaters instead of the current 18.

What does any of this nonsense have to do with the ex goalie coach?

It's coming......wait for it......any minute......

 

[Niagara Bill]

Half your games then were against nobody teams. Look at the record of a 9th place team in 2022 vs a 5th place team in a 6 team league.

Pretty sure you will see the total destruction of your argument.

What does era toughness have to do with anything?


You beat 5 other teams to win it all. 3 if you include playoffs.

I gave it it's due respect. I'm proud but not stupid.

Awe to see Mitchy pouring asphalt.
5th and 9th place stats is for losers.
You obviously are not a Leaf fan. You discount every cup win we have had. We shall all remember that one.
Every era has pros and cons. This is an era were a first year expansion team can virtually win a cup. An era where aluminum and composite sticks make players look superhuman.

 

[Dekes For Days]

Dubas literally took all comers into his office for bullshit like ice time complaints.

Not sure where you got this idea from in the first place, but also not sure why you'd think it's a bad or rare thing for management to have an open dialogue with their players anyway. That doesn't counter anything I said.

 

[The Masters]

Hire a good one. This should be an area of focus. No more screwing around with the most important position in the game.

 

[JT AM da real deal]

Folks not much has changed in 100 years with respect to formula for how teams work .. 80% of success of a team (incl its tenders) is drafting/recruitment/development and 20% is based on coaching .. my point is don't overemphasize da importance of coaching it is basically fitness/core strength and positioning fine tuning in crease/mental/confidence in pro hockey .. Dryden, Smith, Roy, Brodeur would have been successful with a turtle as a coach .. advantages in drafting/recruiting Quebec born players exclusively for Habs (league rules) for lions share of their Cup wins is primary reason they won so many Cups .. Leafs did not get that advantage in Ontario

 

[hockeywiz542]

 

[ShaneFalco]

Of course they'll go on to have excellent goaltending now

 

[Nineteen67]

 

[BackPassChampions]

Does Sanford have any prior coaching experience?

 

[vpasla1]

Does Sanford have any prior coaching experience?

He was with Vancouver's affiliate.

 

[cc]

Sanford was credited for helping out Spencer Martin a lot to the point where he is now the Canucks backup. He likely knows a lot about Clark's training and development secrets as they reportedly communicated quite often.

 

[Da Cool Rula]

Of course they'll go on to have excellent goaltending now

Gonna fix Grubs