Confirmed with Link: Leafs don't sign D Jani Hakanpaa to a 2 years, $1.5M AAV

[Gilmour1996]

I would have given him a deadline to get his ass to TO for tests, otherwise he can bugger off so we can make our contingency plans. How much longer is this going to go on for? Or is there some reason why docs want to wait a bit longer after his arthroscopic surgery (ie. healing, swelling to subside) before they can do the tests?

 

[Namikaze Minato]

I would have given him a deadline to get his ass to TO for tests, otherwise he can bugger off so we can make our contingency plans. How much longer is this going to go on for? Or is there some reason why docs want to wait a bit longer after his arthroscopic surgery (ie. healing, swelling to subside) before they can do the tests?

What if, 1 week after your dumbass deadline, it turns out he is fine and signs with somebody else because you tried to rush his recovery when he wasn't ready?

Also why dont you think they have a contingency plan already in place?

 

[Byron Bitz]

What if, 1 week after your dumbass deadline, it turns out he is fine and signs with somebody else because you tried to rush his recovery when he wasn't ready?

Also why dont you think they have a contingency plan already in place?

Do we need a contingency plan?
Rielly-Tanev
McCabe-OEL
Benoit-Liljegren
Rifai
Timmins
Myers
Niemela

 

[Namikaze Minato]

Do we need a contingency plan?
Rielly-Tanev
McCabe-OEL
Benoit-Liljegren
Rifai
Timmins
Myers
Niemela

I assume the contingency plan would be for the extra 1.5 million in cap dollars but I also like the look of our defence more with Hakanpaa.

 

[Gilmour1996]

I assume the contingency plan would be for the extra 1.5 million in cap dollars but I also like the look of our defence more with Hakanpaa.

Yes, the contingency plan is to use the cap space for forward help, taking on salary when moving Robertson and others. You snooze, you lose.

 

[Gilmour1996]

Do we need a contingency plan?
Rielly-Tanev
McCabe-OEL
Benoit-Liljegren
Rifai
Timmins
Myers
Niemela

I didn't say the contingency plan was to replace Hakanpaa with a different defenceman. They need help up front. We lost Bert and now Robertson wants out.

 

[notbias]

I didn't say the contingency plan was to replace Hakanpaa with a different defenceman. They need help up front. We lost Bert and now Robertson wants out.

Bert didn't contribute much, Robertson was in and out of the lineup... I think $1.5 million is a waste on Hakanpaa when Benoit is here, so I will be happier if he doesn't sign, but the losses up front are minimal for what they contributed, although I agree that they should spend there.

 

[crump]

Remember Timmins’ great pre- season. I think he has a lot to offer. Needs to be given a chance again.

 

[ACC1224]

Remember Timmins’ great pre- season. I think he has a lot to offer. Needs to be given a chance again.

He needs to stay healthy and get a good run of games in to really see what they have there. I don’t think they’ll give up on him until that happens.

 

[TMLBlueandWhite]

1. I'm sure that part of the "terms" of the NHL SPC are that it must be registered / approved with the league to be considered valid. Otherwise, a team could sign a 17-year deal and then the player gets to sue the team when the league invalidates it.

2. Think about the logisitcs of July 1 for a moment. Money is flying around. Teams are on average, signing 3-4 players each. Players, located all over the world, agreeing to these things.

It's likely, that very few actual contracts are signed on July 1st, but rather, "handshake" agreements are made over the phone, and the actual paperwork dealt with in the day or two after when the player can get to a printer, etc. It's why you often hear "Player X has agreed to terms"

Teams also get a "medical exam" as part of the signing process... which would almost certianly allow them to back out of a contract. Not all of these guys can get in to see a team doctor on July 1. Hakanpaa presumably lives in Dallas or Finland.... Toronto's Doctor presumably lives in Toronto.

As for how this plays out, I think it's obvious that the Leafs want Hakanpaa, and there's some organizational belief that they can fix his knee. At some point over the summer, they'll get him in for a battery of tests / experts... and figure out whether they're going to put pen to paper and register the contract, or let him pursue his career with another organization.

Your first point doesn't carry any weight because there are term limits on length of contract teams must adhere too.

You can sugarcoat this any way you want. That it was a contingent signing depending on Hakanpaa passing a physical. To me it sounds like the Leafs didn't do their due diligence and signed a player with known medical conditions that might prevent him from even playing again.

They tied up a contract spot and $1.5M in cap space they don't have while they wait for it to get sorted out as a result.

 

[RoadWarrior]

If you're an agent and don't call up Treliving to rip him off you're not doing your job.

It boggles my mind he signed a guy so injured he might never play for the team. It's pretty hard to defend this. Treliving left Calgary a mess and proved here already his acquisitions remain questionable at best.

When they fired Dubas the Leafs cut off the foot in attempt to save the leg.

Only to attach a boat anchor where the foot once was. Treliving signing Hakanpaa as a priority is a bigger letdown than the last time I got naked. Nothing exciting happened then either.

It's stuff like this that shows just how incompetent Treliving is at his job.

This is almost as bad as Dubas trading for an injured Foligno. Maybe worse because the precedent was already set. Nothing is more humiliating than to see idiots succeed where we have failed.

Fortunately that isn't a concern for the fans of Leafs Nation.

…and your access to Haakinpaa’s medical records come from where?

 

[Gaberd2608]

Your first point doesn't carry any weight because there are term limits on length of contract teams must adhere too.

You can sugarcoat this any way you want. That it was a contingent signing depending on Hakanpaa passing a physical. To me it sounds like the Leafs didn't do their due diligence and signed a player with known medical conditions that might prevent him from even playing again.

They tied up a contract spot and $1.5M in cap space they don't have while they wait for it to get sorted out as a result.

If he can play he is an upgrade on defence. If he doesnt we get capspace. Who are we signing that we need this $1.5 million to make happen?

The Leafs havent actually made an announcement of the signing that I am aware of so hard to get pissy.

 

[Mess]

Your first point doesn't carry any weight because there are term limits on length of contract teams must adhere too.

You can sugarcoat this any way you want. That it was a contingent signing depending on Hakanpaa passing a physical. To me it sounds like the Leafs didn't do their due diligence and signed a player with known medical conditions that might prevent him from even playing again.

They tied up a contract spot and $1.5M in cap space they don't have while they wait for it to get sorted out as a result.

FYI .. A player needs to pass a physical before the contract can be made valid.

Where is the rush?... Leafs have until training camp in September to see how this plays out. If they decide to move forward they place Hakanpaa on LTIR to start the year and the $1.5 mil is off the books and replaceable by another healthy player. like Connor Timmins @ $1.1 mill. The 2 year contract might suggest that Leafs realize it might be some time before they get him back out there healthy.

According to reports Leafs haven't actually tied up a contract spot because they haven't officially filed the contract with the NHL yet, they only have the players name on signed piece of paper.

Hakanpaa suffered a knee injury in March and required season-ending arthroscopic surgery. While Toronto's doctors are confident Hakanpaa will be ready to play this fall, it is likely the deal isn't made official until they meet with him in person. It's possible he won't be cleared to play, though unlikley, given the fact that Leafs GM Brad Treliving has already publicly mentioned Hakanpaa as being a part of the team. On the off-chance that he isn't able to play the deal is voided.

 

[seanlinden]

Your first point doesn't carry any weight because there are term limits on length of contract teams must adhere too.

You can sugarcoat this any way you want. That it was a contingent signing depending on Hakanpaa passing a physical. To me it sounds like the Leafs didn't do their due diligence and signed a player with known medical conditions that might prevent him from even playing again.

They tied up a contract spot and $1.5M in cap space they don't have while they wait for it to get sorted out as a result.

I think it's important to clarify legal rights under tort law, and league-rights. If the Leafs & Hakanpaa put pen to paper, then Hakanpaa may have rights under the law, but those will not neccessarily translate to the NHL, given that "registering" contracts with the league is a requirement of NHL SPCs.

Ultimately, it was a july 1 deal. Do you really think that all these guys have physicals on July 1? no. They might get a hold of a medical file, but things move quickly. You make agreements in principle based on the information available to you, and deal with the formalities in the coming days.

Yes, they've lost a bit of "flexibility", but theoretically, not as much as you think. If you include Hakanpaa, they have Rielly, Tanev, OEL, Liljegren, McCabe, Benoit, Hakanpaa, Timmins, Mermis and Myers all on one-way deals. They're not going to carry 10 defencemen.

If Hakanpaa does end up "in" the fold, it likely means they're going to push Timmins out. If Hakanpaa doesn't end up in, it's likely Timmins may hang on. At the end of the day, I believe its a $400k difference between the two.

 

[TMLBlueandWhite]

…and your access to Haakinpaa’s medical records come from where?

You really don't think a team would request a player's medical records beforw signing him?

FYI .. A player needs to pass a physical before the contract can be made valid.

Where is the rush?... Leafs have until training camp in September to see how this plays out. If they decide to move forward they place Hakanpaa on LTIR to start the year and the $1.5 mil is off the books and replaceable by another healthy player. like Connor Timmins @ $1.1 mill. The 2 year contract might suggest that Leafs realize it might be some time before they get him back out there healthy.

According to reports Leafs haven't actually tied up a contract spot because they haven't officially filed the contract with the NHL yet, they only have the players name on signed piece of paper.

I don't understamd why they felt the need to rush into sign him to begin with given his medical history.

Why wait a year, paying him $1.5M on LTIR to not play, instead of rushing to sign him. They could have just as easily signed someone healrhy who would be ready to start the year. Wait until Hakanpaa was ready to go and then sign him to a one year show me deal.

Signing a guy to a two ywar deal because you are worried you aren't gonna get the first year out of him doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me.

I think it's important to clarify legal rights under tort law, and league-rights. If the Leafs & Hakanpaa put pen to paper, then Hakanpaa may have rights under the law, but those will not neccessarily translate to the NHL, given that "registering" contracts with the league is a requirement of NHL SPCs.

Ultimately, it was a july 1 deal. Do you really think that all these guys have physicals on July 1? no. They might get a hold of a medical file, but things move quickly. You make agreements in principle based on the information available to you, and deal with the formalities in the coming days.

Yes, they've lost a bit of "flexibility", but theoretically, not as much as you think. If you include Hakanpaa, they have Rielly, Tanev, OEL, Liljegren, McCabe, Benoit, Hakanpaa, Timmins, Mermis and Myers all on one-way deals. They're not going to carry 10 defencemen.

If Hakanpaa does end up "in" the fold, it likely means they're going to push Timmins out. If Hakanpaa doesn't end up in, it's likely Timmins may hang on. At the end of the day, I believe its a $400k difference between the two.

To me it looks lime he's taking a shot in the dark on a player with very limited upside.

 

[Leaf Fans]

Your first point doesn't carry any weight because there are term limits on length of contract teams must adhere too.

You can sugarcoat this any way you want. That it was a contingent signing depending on Hakanpaa passing a physical. To me it sounds like the Leafs didn't do their due diligence and signed a player with known medical conditions that might prevent him from even playing again.

They tied up a contract spot and $1.5M in cap space they don't have while they wait for it to get sorted out as a result.

It sounds to me that the Leafs are doing their due diligence.

 

[TMLBlueandWhite]

It sounds to me that the Leafs are doing their due diligence.

Because they were forced into it.

It's entirely possible Hakanpaa's condition worsened in the day or two after they signed him. Like another poster said, things move fast. Seems more likely they rushed to sign him to a two ywar deal without knowing the full extent of his injury.

At minimum this "acquisition" seems questionable at best.

 

[Mess]

I don't understamd why they felt the need to rush into sign him to begin with given his medical history.

Why wait a year, paying him $1.5M on LTIR to not play, instead of rushing to sign him. They could have just as easily signed someone healrhy who would be ready to start the year. Wait until Hakanpaa was ready to go and then sign him to a one year show me deal.

Signing a guy to a two ywar deal because you are worried you aren't gonna get the first year out of him doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me.

We already have a full house at present he is depth only, until healthy enough to play and displace someone.

Rielly --- Tanev
McCabe -- OLE
Benoit --- Liljegren
Timmons

X - Hakanpaa

When healthy this guy is a beast and so not Leafs a verbal commitment and signed contract sitting there when he is ready.

 

[Leaf Fans]

Because they were forced into it.

It's entirely possible Hakanpaa's condition worsened in the day or two after they signed him. Like another poster said, things move fast. Seems more likely they rushed to sign him to a two ywar deal without knowing the full extent of his injury.

At minimum this "acquisition" seems questionable at best.

Yeah, there are a lot of possibilities.

 

[LeafParade]

Can they LTIR him immediately or that a problem for the league?

 

[LeafsOHLRangers98]

We already have a full house at present he is depth only, until healthy enough to play and displace someone.

Rielly --- Tanev
McCabe -- OLE
Benoit --- Liljegren
Timmons

X - Hakanpaa

When healthy this guy is a beast and so not Leafs a verbal commitment and signed contract sitting there when he is ready.

He's still our 7th best defensemen when healthy. He could maybe push Benoit out if he does not continue to play well following his progression last year, but if we lose him you could always sign a Tinordi for a buriable amount.

 

[TMLBlueandWhite]

Can they LTIR him immediately or that a problem for the league?

If the league ratifies the contract they will have no choice but to allow him be put on LTIR or look stupid for approving the deal.

Lol at that though Brad.

 

[Mess]

Can they LTIR him immediately or that a problem for the league?

There is no reason nor need to LTIR anyone in the offseason as there is no salary cap in place where placing a player on injured reserve would benefit the team.

Besides during the summer there is a 10% overage slush fund where you can exceed the upper limit by.. ie $89 mil cap = + $8.9 mil extra summer spending allowable above that limit.

Once training camp arrives and players report for physicals it will be determined in Hak can play or what his status is and then Leafs can decide to proceed or void the deal. This is when LTIR would then apply and come off the Leafs salary cap calculation to become cap compliant.

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

Remember Timmins’ great pre- season. I think he has a lot to offer. Needs to be given a chance again.

He got his chance he blew it.

 

[DarkKnight]

He's still our 7th best defensemen when healthy. He could maybe push Benoit out if he does not continue to play well following his progression last year, but if we lose him you could always sign a Tinordi for a buriable amount.

I love how we always just pencil in Lil, the guy who three playoffs in a row has lost his spot. Ringer.