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Leafs Advanced Stats 2014/15

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CalgaryLeaf*

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For you advanced stats guru's here's a place to discuss how a particular player performed by the numbers each game.

For example is there an advanced stat for play in the defensive zone?

This could be an educational opportunity as well...In other words do the advanced stats match the eyeball test?
 
CalgaryLeaf said:
For you advanced stats guru's here's a place to discuss how a particular player performed by the numbers each game.

For example is there an advanced stat for play in the defensive zone?

This could be an educational opportunity as well...In other words do the advanced stats match the eyeball test?
Click to expand...

What exactly does this mean?
 
2013-2014 Season Fenwick: 42.73
2014-2015 Fenwick Through 3: 45.55

2013-2014 Season Corsi: 43.63
2014-2014 Corsi through 3: 46.99

Both stats showing slight improvement early, even with the stinker against Pittsburgh. Hopefully those numbers continue to climb.
 
Just to add, Lupul was our best player by Corsi last night, and has been solid for the first 3 games. But I think we all know how good he can be when he's not injured.

Here's to hoping he can put together a healthy season, because if he does, our team is much better
 
ALEXJD93 said:
What exactly does this mean?
Click to expand...

Exactly what it sounds like.

For example in football they have defensive stats for the "red Zone"...Those stats however are team stats.

I wonder if they have stats for play in the defensive zone?
 
King Joffrey said:
Just to add, Lupul was our best player by Corsi last night, and has been solid for the first 3 games. But I think we all know how good he can be when he's not injured.

Here's to hoping he can put together a healthy season, because if he does, our team is much better
Click to expand...

Yup, him and Kadri have been excellent with whomever they've played with so far, especially Winnik.
 
CalgaryLeaf said:
Exactly what it sounds like.

For example in football they have defensive stats for the "red Zone"...Those stats however are team stats.

I wonder if they have stats for play in the defensive zone?
Click to expand...

Kind of?

There's thing like zone exits you can look at, overall Corsi% will tell you how much time a player is spending in his own zone

Nothing I can think of that is similar to "red zone" statistics

Edit: That said, if they nhl could use the SportsVu cameras the way the NBA does it could drastically improve looking at different zones
 
King Joffrey said:
Just to add, Lupul was our best player by Corsi last night, and has been solid for the first 3 games. But I think we all know how good he can be when he's not injured.

Here's to hoping he can put together a healthy season, because if he does, our team is much better
Click to expand...

Yes Lupul certainly passes the eye test...Good to see that the corsi confirms this. Lupul always plays better when he is somewhat agitated...He has a bit of a mean streak. As always,he needs to stay healthy.
 
ALEXJD93 said:
Kind of?

There's thing like zone exits you can look at, overall Corsi% will tell you how much time a player is spending in his own zone

Nothing I can think of that is similar to "red zone" statistics

Edit: That said, if they nhl could use the SportsVu cameras the way the NBA does it could drastically improve looking at different zones
Click to expand...

Do they have stats for giveaways in the defensive zone?...or one on one battles won along the boards?
 
CalgaryLeaf said:
Do they have stats for giveaways in the defensive zone?...or one on one battles won along the boards?
Click to expand...

You can look at "giveaways" as an overall stat but mind you they aren't very accurate and skilled players generally have more turnovers.

If you have a higher Corsi For % than that means that you likely win more one on one battles, this is an example where you'd look at the data and then go back and look at the tape
 
CalgaryLeaf said:
Do they have stats for giveaways in the defensive zone?...or one on one battles won along the boards?
Click to expand...

Those stats haven't been found to be useful yet.

For instance, a guy like Andrew MacDonald will win a lot of boards battles. However, he'll also give up a lot of zone entries (meaning it's really easy for opposing forwards to gain the blueline against him).

As a result, he ends up stuck in his zone too often. Are his board battles worth that much if he ends up battling in his zone way more than he should?
 
Guy Boucher said:
Those stats haven't been found to be useful yet.

For instance, a guy like Andrew MacDonald will win a lot of boards battles. However, he'll also give up a lot of zone entries (meaning it's really easy for opposing forwards to gain the blueline against him).

As a result, he ends up stuck in his zone too often. Are his board battles worth that much if he ends up battling in his zone way more than he should?
Click to expand...

Yup, he also can't move the puck, so even if he does win the battle, it's less likely that he will be able to make a play out of the zone. He's an example of a "defensive defencemen" who is just absolutely dreadful in possessing the puck
 
What is the premiere (free) site for advanced stats?..http://stats.hockeyanalysis.com/ looks good but they don't have 2014/15 stats listed.

It's about time that I followed this stuff...It took me years to climb aboard the baseball advanced stats and now I can't live without them....lol
 
King Joffrey said:
2013-2014 Season Fenwick: 42.73
2014-2015 Fenwick Through 3: 45.55

2013-2014 Season Corsi: 43.63
2014-2014 Corsi through 3: 46.99

Both stats showing slight improvement early, even with the stinker against Pittsburgh. Hopefully those numbers continue to climb.
Click to expand...

One day, The NHL will track zone time. And when that day comes we can do away with these stats.

Fenwick and Corsi are flawed stats to track possession.

I look at offensive , neutral and defensive zone time relative to defensive zone starts, opposed to shots directed at the net.

For example The Santa line has had a lot of Offensive zone time in their first 3 games. Their game is cycling and controlling the boards. Corsi or Fenwick does not measure this. To me this is more important than a low % shot directed at the net where possession is given up.

I would guess, The Santa line has been our best Offensive zone time line this season, yet they only average just under 4 shots on goal a game this season. Not reflective to their play thus far this season.
 
So it looks like most of you guys follow Corsi% more than anything else?

What the heck is Dubas looking at?..It has to be a lot more than just Corsi%.
 
Interactif said:
One day, The NHL will track zone time. And when that day comes we can do away with these stats.

Fenwick and Corsi are flawed stats to track possession.

I look at offensive zone time, as opposed to shots directed at the net. For example The Santa line has had a lot of Offensive zone time in their first 3 games. Their game is cycling and controlling the boards. Corsi or Fenwick does not measure this. To me this is more important than a low % shot directed at the net.

I would guess, The Santa line has been our best Offensive zone time line this season, the only average just under 4 shots on goal a game this season. Not reflective to their play thus far this season.
Click to expand...

That line has been excellent in Corsi and Fenwick as well.....

Not to mention you don't create that many scoring chances while cycling along the boards, one reason why the LA Kings had trouble scoring early in the year last season

And to your point about low percentage shots at the net, look at the last two goals of the Leafs-Habs opener, both soft flicks of the puck on the net that took a deflection.

If you haven't noticed, that stuff happens quite often
 
ALEXJD93 said:
That line has been excellent in Corsi and Fenwick as well.....

Not to mention you don't create that many scoring chances while cycling along the boards, one reason why the LA Kings had trouble scoring early in the year last season

And to your point about low percentage shots at the net, look at the last two goals of the Leafs-Habs opener, both soft flicks of the puck on the net that took a deflection.

If you haven't noticed, that stuff happens quite often
Click to expand...

That might be useful if you are defending Crosby's line...Give them less time in your own end.
 
ALEXJD93 said:
That line has been excellent in Corsi and Fenwick as well.....

Not to mention you don't create that many scoring chances while cycling along the boards, one reason why the LA Kings had trouble scoring early in the year last season

And to your point about low percentage shots at the net, look at the last two goals of the Leafs-Habs opener, both soft flicks of the puck on the net that took a deflection.

If you haven't noticed, that stuff happens quite often
Click to expand...

Does it measure zone time? I want definitive stats, not guess work.
 
CalgaryLeaf said:
That might be useful if you are defending Crosby's line...Give them less time in your own end.
Click to expand...

It's obviously useful, but cycling without getting any shots means you won't be scoring any goals. That line has been excellent up to this point, both analytically and in actual time of possession.
 
The puck has been in the offensive zone a lot more this year compared to last. Good sign
 
ALEXJD93 said:
It's obviously useful, but cycling without getting any shots means you won't be scoring any goals. That line has been excellent up to this point, both analytically and in actual time of possession.
Click to expand...

Again, directing shots at a net means you are volunterily giving up possession of the puck.

The fact that corsi is used as possession for the puck is contrary to the term possession.

Some of us want definitive stats that track zone time, cycling the puck is maintaining possession not giving it up. Corsi-Fenwick do NOT measure either.
 
Interactif said:
Again, directing shots at a net means you are volunterily giving up possession of the puck.

The fact that corsi is used as possession for the puck is contrary to the term possession.

Some of us want definitive stats that track zone time, cycling the puck is maintaining possession not giving it up. Corsi-Fenwick do neither.
Click to expand...

You realize if you don't shoot at the net then you can't score a goal, right... ?

Not to mention rebounds will be available, and offensive zone faceoffs if the goalie freezes the puck

If you want these stats, get out your stopclock and measure it, you'll then probably find that they correlate pretty highly with Corsi and moreso Fenwick over the long term

Edit: If you had to guess, what team you do think would be the best at "definitive time of possesion"?
 
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