Confirmed with Link: (LAK-WSH) Carl Hagelin (50% retained) traded for 2019 3rd, Conditional 2020 6th

[KINGS17]

Disagree. It was Quick playing out of his mind. Nothing more or less.

It was obvious we were outmatched.

I tend to agree, and I think Quick was the source of the faint blip.

 

[KingsFan7824]

Why so complicated for a possible 6th round pick next year?

Because Washington doesn't want to give up another pick on top of the one they gave up. Unless they have some more actual success on the ice. Every team wants more talent in the pipeline every year.

They already didn't have their 5th and 6th rd pick this year from trades last year. You look at what Hagelin has been traded for during his career, and that Blake managed to get this potential 6th next year, in addition to the actual 3rd this year, is pretty good.

 

[King'sPawn]

Kept a defensive core that was #1 in the league, last year, not sure how that can be viewed as a negative, but some people are.
Brought in Kovalchuk, that was a 50/50 but spent no assets while presumably adding to scoring,
Not sure what core was built for grinding board play, Kopitar, Carter, Toffoli, Kempe, Brown, Iafallo, Kovalchuk, are all SKILLED players who can play north and south,

Why do people think players can only play one style of game?

I actually don't mind the Kovalchuk move. I just listed it for completion's sake.

They kept a defensive corps who spent years playing one way. I don't care how good anyone is, but it's going to take time for people to adjust. Blake expected everyone to. That's a problem.

Players can certainly adjust and play certain ways, but they do suffer if it's not suited to their strengths. And it will take time. Especially with athletes who rely on routines.

 

[GoldenBearHockey]

I actually don't mind the Kovalchuk move. I just listed it for completion's sake.

They kept a defensive corps who spent years playing one way. I don't care how good anyone is, but it's going to take time for people to adjust. Blake expected everyone to. That's a problem.

Players can certainly adjust and play certain ways, but they do suffer if it's not suited to their strengths. And it will take time. Especially with athletes who rely on routines.

Agreed, it takes time, but they kept a defensive core that was top in the league for how long?

All I am saying is that it is absolutely asinine to expect a GM to look at 2017-2018 at that defense and how it produced and go....yea, we sucked, I need to blow this up because our DEFENSE sucked.... that's incomprehensible.

 

[KingsFan7824]

Funny thing, I would have kept Pearson over Toffoli going into this season, and was hoping the Kings would have been able to pitch Toffoli for a higher pick.

There are times where people DO unfairly judge action or inaction based on unreasonable expectations. However, that's not the case here. Blake had a full evaluation season where the players got the coach they wanted, and they were swept in the first round while scoring all of 2 goals.

Going into the season, he:
- brought in Kovalchuk
- kept a defensive, conservative coach and told him to open it up
- kept a core that was built for grinding, board play and told them to open it up
- made no major core changes until November, where one player was moved for a faster player... and there were apparently no plans to keep the faster player which would fit into his paradigm.

Blake absolutely deserves criticism for not making more changes to the coaching or player personnel to build towards how he expects his team to be. Like the players, he just said the words that everyone needs to play better but has done very little to work on himself.

I don't think it's apathy, but when it's been nothing but words since 2017, the message of expecting everyone else to take it upon themself is visible with the on-ice product we see now.

Why do people call Stevens a defensive/conservative coach? Kopitar had his career season at 30 years of age under him. Brown became an offensive player again. The couple years he coached the Flyers, they were in the top 5 or so in GF, in both seasons. The Kings, last year, averaged more goals per game than they had since 05-06.

 

[BigKing]

My post was overly positive yes, yours is overly negative. Truth is in the middle.
Do you think this team is honestly as bad this year as they have been this year? Brown is proving it was more than a 1 year "last gasp". Kopitar is not going to put up career numbers every year but he not going to be as bad as he has been this year either. Carter was largely not available last year so one could have easily thought him alone should increase LA's scoring however LA also brought in Kovalchuk. Carter I am very concerned about moving forward.

Is Brown proving it? I hope it wasn't a last gasp but he's not showing it to me that it wasn't.

The real question is "Do you think they were really as good as they were last year?" because they were already bad the year before and, as mentioned, hadn't done anything of real note since 2014. Of course, that was a Cup so that buys you some slack but 2017 should have been the end of said slack.

Believing everything good from 2018 would continue and the prior years were the anomaly is to not think critically. It looks at standings without looking at the underlying numbers and roster history and simply says "Need more goals, sign former big-time goal scorer. PROFIT!"

That is my main issue with Blake at this point. He has been a painfully mediocre GM when he was sold as a "Got to get this rising star now before everyone else gets him". Now, his choices so far--or lack thereof--led to this current season so he is now going with this "future" approach, something I wholeheartedly support. I hope he is dedicated to it and pulls off some good moves while also starting to hit on draft picks since the Kings haven't been doing that for far too long.

It was important to the future of this franchise for last season to either be the start of a retool/rebuild or for Blake's evaluation to be correct. It was important due to the big term/dollars going out to #11/8 so a wasted season is extremely detrimental. Right now, it was a waste but Blake can salvage some of it with good results from this past draft. It will also be a huge help if he stumbles his way into a Top 2 pick this season while trying to be a contender since he will not be able to regain the trade value on certain players that he squandered by assessing the roster incorrectly.

To be fair, some of Lombardi's best moves were him stumbling into something or not getting what he wanted. If this season leads to Hughes, the TOR 1st and all these other kicks-at-the-can in the draft, then Blake will have mostly stumbled into making up for all of his mistakes so far. I truly and sincerely hope it happens.

 

[King'sPawn]

Agreed, it takes time, but they kept a defensive core that was top in the league for how long?

All I am saying is that it is absolutely asinine to expect a GM to look at 2017-2018 at that defense and how it produced and go....yea, we sucked, I need to blow this up because our DEFENSE sucked.... that's incomprehensible.

I wasn't expecting Blake to blow it up. I think it's fair to criticize Blake either because:
1. He didn't think it would take time for a systematic change while keeping virtually everyone
2. He did think it would take time to adjust and still expected the playoffs, in a league with little margin for error
3. He knew it would take time to adjust and didn't think the playoffs was attainable, but made no changes to restructure his team to meet his vision, which would include selling pieces before this disaster of a season.

Did anyone think the season would be THIS bad? I don't think so. But I think it's fair to criticize Blake's decision-making since the offseason when he had a whole season prior to evaluate and plan as a GM.

 

[YP44]

Is Brown proving it? I hope it wasn't a last gasp but he's not showing it to me that it wasn't.

The real question is "Do you think they were really as good as they were last year?" because they were already bad the year before and, as mentioned, hadn't done anything of real note since 2014. Of course, that was a Cup so that buys you some slack but 2017 should have been the end of said slack.

Believing everything good from 2018 would continue and the prior years were the anomaly is to not think critically. It looks at standings without looking at the underlying numbers and roster history and simply says "Need more goals, sign former big-time goal scorer. PROFIT!"

That is my main issue with Blake at this point. He has been a painfully mediocre GM when he was sold as a "Got to get this rising star now before everyone else gets him". Now, his choices so far--or lack thereof--led to this current season so he is now going with this "future" approach, something I wholeheartedly support. I hope he is dedicated to it and pulls off some good moves while also starting to hit on draft picks since the Kings haven't been doing that for far too long.

It was important to the future of this franchise for last season to either be the start of a retool/rebuild or for Blake's evaluation to be correct. It was important due to the big term/dollars going out to #11/8 so a wasted season is extremely detrimental. Right now, it was a waste but Blake can salvage some of it with good results from this past draft. It will also be a huge help if he stumbles his way into a Top 2 pick this season while trying to be a contender since he will not be able to regain the trade value on certain players that he squandered by assessing the roster incorrectly.

To be fair, some of Lombardi's best moves were him stumbling into something or not getting what he wanted. If this season leads to Hughes, the TOR 1st and all these other kicks-at-the-can in the draft, then Blake will have mostly stumbled into making up for all of his mistakes so far. I truly and sincerely hope it happens.

If we are going back to the 2015 season that year was fully derailed by off ice shit (f*** you Voynov). 2016 the team got in despite obviously feuding with coach (as soon as Sutter was locked out of the room something should have been done). 2017 team fully gave up on coach. 2018 team was rejuvenated, Kopitar and Doughty played unreal and dragged team in. This year I still think the team is better than the results, not contenders by any means but there are some good pieces still on LA and they should at worst be a in the hunt for a playoff spot.

As for the re-tool/rebuild needing to start last year. I think LA has had 2 solid drafts in a row now and help is on the way. Vilardi's health could delay things and push this back a year but most were thrilled he fell to LA at the time. LA has another solid draft this year and things could be better.

 

[GoldenBearHockey]

I wasn't expecting Blake to blow it up. I think it's fair to criticize Blake either because:
1. He didn't think it would take time for a systematic change while keeping virtually everyone
2. He did think it would take time to adjust and still expected the playoffs, in a league with little margin for error
3. He knew it would take time to adjust and didn't think the playoffs was attainable, but made no changes to restructure his team to meet his vision, which would include selling pieces before this disaster of a season.

Did anyone think the season would be THIS bad? I don't think so. But I think it's fair to criticize Blake's decision-making since the offseason when he had a whole season prior to evaluate and plan as a GM.

Let's assume it's #2, because #1 is just....idiotic, meaning he would have to be a complete idiot and not know the NHL to think that, and it's clear that's not the case, and #3, could be 50/50, maybe it is #3 but found prices to be abysmal in the off-season etc?

I tend to stick with #2, and if that's the reason to criticize a GM in major sports....I dunno....

 

[King'sPawn]

Let's assume it's #2, because #1 is just....idiotic, meaning he would have to be a complete idiot and not know the NHL to think that, and it's clear that's not the case, and #3, could be 50/50, maybe it is #3 but found prices to be abysmal in the off-season etc?

I tend to stick with #2, and if that's the reason to criticize a GM in major sports....I dunno....

I genuinely think it's #2 as well. I just think it was unrealistic that a team who was swept in the first round would last year would struggle with wholesale change and still make the playoffs.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

Why do people call Stevens a defensive/conservative coach? Kopitar had his career season at 30 years of age under him. Brown became an offensive player again. The couple years he coached the Flyers, they were in the top 5 or so in GF, in both seasons. The Kings, last year, averaged more goals per game than they had since 05-06.

He's more conservative than defensive. His systems are passive. They're taking up space, not aggressively forechecking. They emphasize control, like Sutter did.

Is Brown proving it? I hope it wasn't a last gasp but he's not showing it to me that it wasn't.
.

I think you're being fooled by him missing some games and by looking slower lately. Even with that, he's scoring at a 20 goal, 55 point pace even despite the tire fire around him, so yeah, I think he's got something left.

 

[BigKing]

I also believed a coaching change would work and it did: temporarily. To believe it was permanent is to believe 2018 Kopitar is the norm, Brown is a 30 goal scorer again and every young player progresses and nobody regresses.

I was fine with an evaluation season for Blake while actually sitting in the big chair. He watched it and decided to go all-in on these guys. He was wrong and deserves the criticism for it. He will now be judged on how he gets out of it. So far, so good with the Muzzin deal and the small Thompson/Hagelin ones but, just like I'm not getting on my knees for him because he has drafted prospects that haven't proven anything yet, I'm not going to say he has hit home runs. That being said, I like the return on Muzzin even if the only tangible result is if Grundstrom becomes a good 3rd line player and they miss on the 1st.

 

[BigKing]

He's more conservative than defensive. His systems are passive. They're taking up space, not aggressively forechecking. They emphasize control, like Sutter did.




I think you're being fooled by him missing some games and by looking slower lately. Even with that, he's scoring at a 20 goal, 55 point pace even despite the tire fire around him, so yeah, I think he's got something left.

Even with the missed time, he isn't playing as well as he did last season, pace be damned.

Love the guy though. Hopefully he has a good amount in the tank when this team is competitive again.

 

[GoldenBearHockey]

I genuinely think it's #2 as well. I just think it was unrealistic that a team who was swept in the first round would last year would struggle with wholesale change and still make the playoffs.

But it wasn't wholesale changes it's not like they were changing things on the defensive side of the red line, they weren't, it's the transition game, and the offensive side that they were being asked to change....I don't think it was unrealistic at all to expect your #1 defense, to keep being, your #1 defense, while at the same time, asking your forwards, who you just added a dangerous shot, to produce more.

 

[Pandaman11]

Carl, we hardly knew ye

A 3rd round pick isn't bad

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

Even with the missed time, he isn't playing as well as he did last season, pace be damned.

Love the guy though. Hopefully he has a good amount in the tank when this team is competitive again.

Well, he's certainly not playing as heavy, I'm just pointing out why I don't feel it's his 'last gasp' either. He's one of the only ones producing at a normal rate this year. If he's preserving his body the rest of this season, this will be about the only time I don't blame him, because he's played like a running back for this team for long past a normal RB's expiration date. I'm with you. I love the dude for his dedication here through Avery and Sutter and all of it and I'm glad he got to be the C to raise the two Cups because he's certainly the one that's bled the most for LA

 

[KingCanadain1976]

I think Blake did what he could with Brodzinski returning from injury freeing a roster spot up I am willing to bet the extra picks will be used to move up to get someone I highly doubt we pick all 10 picks

 

[bouncesonly]

Title says 50% retained. Tweets mention nothing of salary. Is the "50% retained" short hand for Washington's condition or are the Kings seriously retaining 50% of Haglin's salary cap?

edit: nevermind, main board says 50% salary retained. Guess it's not a big deal since he's UFA at the end of the season.

 

[Winger23]

Title says 50% retained. Tweets mention nothing of salary. Is the "50% retained" short hand for Washington's condition or are the Kings seriously retaining 50% of Haglin's salary cap?

Its only for the rest of the season so it really doesnt affect the cap much going forward.

 

[damacles1156]

A late third is about all you can expect to get for Hags.

 

[SlimCharles]

I was expecting a 3rd round pick. The conditional 6th is a decent little add on. Hopefully the Caps can make it past 2 rounds, but if not it's only a 6th.

 

[The Tikkanen]

Gotta keep using the slow and steady approach and play a heavy game. They've been having tons of success playing this way over the past few years, as demonstrated by their single playoff game victory in five years.

Heavy game and fill out the roster with good in the locker room guys is the blue print for a lottery pick.

 

[tny760]

oh wrong thread

 

[tny760]

wrong thread

 

[Herby]

Remember when Fox would try and justify Pearson's spot in the lineup by trying to say how great he was at screening the goalie.