TSN: Laine cleared to return from Player Assistance Program

[Xoggz22]

How do you know this is the lowest value he'll have? How do you know he'll increase his value?

A valid question. Obviously no one would know the answer, but if there was one direction you would expect his value to go it would be up from where it currently stands. There are "ifs" involved with that, of course, but reading this thread he's already been deemed a total loss. So...based on the thread and his current low value, when someone looks at his skillset, it would be logical to assume that coming out of the program with a drive to play, returning to the ice and shooting the puck and not having the injury bad luck, his value would only go up. He's 26 and his elite shot hasn't left him. He's improved his all around game (although I get there are several on here that are still stuck with 19 year old Laine in WPG) and he's been a great teammate in Columbus. That, to me, would seem to suggest placing money on his value going up...but only if he isn't traded, opens camp with the CBJ and looks like he's moving and playing like the elite player he was expected to be.

He may not get there but I'd put my money on his value going up. Just an opinion. I do think your questions are valid.

 

[Marioesque]

How do you know this is the lowest value he'll have? How do you know he'll increase his value?

It's more likely. When he plays he is very good, so if he plays It's going to raise his value because the "questions" some might have about him would be answered.

 

[Dr Quincy]

A valid question. Obviously no one would know the answer, but if there was one direction you would expect his value to go it would be up from where it currently stands. There are "ifs" involved with that, of course, but reading this thread he's already been deemed a total loss. So...based on the thread and his current low value, when someone looks at his skillset, it would be logical to assume that coming out of the program with a drive to play, returning to the ice and shooting the puck and not having the injury bad luck, his value would only go up. He's 26 and his elite shot hasn't left him. He's improved his all around game (although I get there are several on here that are still stuck with 19 year old Laine in WPG) and he's been a great teammate in Columbus. That, to me, would seem to suggest placing money on his value going up...but only if he isn't traded, opens camp with the CBJ and looks like he's moving and playing like the elite player he was expected to be.

He may not get there but I'd put my money on his value going up. Just an opinion. I do think your questions are valid.

I don't think he has zero value. I'm sure there are teams that would offer a decent asset, but probably not what CBJ fans are hoping for. I do think it's a bad idea to sell low, so there's definitely a legit strategy of waiting and seeing what happens.

But I do feel some here are cavalierly saying "Oh we just will wait until his value goes up." But what if he gets injured again.... which isn't a huge stretch to imagine. Or ends up back in the mental health program.

I'm just saying there's risk for every decision and there's zero certainty that offers will be better later on. It's just a matter of weighing what the real offers are (no the ones here) and how they feel he is physically and mentally, and how he'll be physically and mentally if he's still in Columbus in January. Sure, it makes total sense to say "It's in his own best interest to play really well if he wants to get dealt." But mental health hardly ever falls into the "People make rationale choices with their own self-interest and well-being in mind"

It's more likely. When he plays he is very good, so if he plays It's going to raise his value because the "questions" some might have about him would be answered.

see above... I'm not sure it's more likely at all, it may be, but the "if" in your 2nd clause is a big one

 

[Tasteless Beaver]

No one here really knows the details and extent of the problems in Winnipeg, and even if someone knew, they wouldn't tell us on a public forum. What we do know is that trading Laine seemed to fix nothing. But honestly that doesn't tell us all that much about Laine and whether he was a "problem" or not, all it really tells us there were problems that had nothing to do with Laine.

Laine never publicly demanded a trade from Winnipeg, it was when it seemed they couldn't agree on an extension that his agent hinted at it publicly (edit: as in, "maybe it would be best"), I don't know what happened behind closed doors but he never "quit" on that team. He had a decent 19-20 season where he showed no signs of "quitting" on the team and his only game in 20-21 as a Jet he was everywhere, putting up the numbers and throwing his body around until he got injured. Compare that to players who actually quit on their teams, "the shift" and things like that. I get it some fans are salty just from a player wanting out, but there's a big difference between being a pro about it (which Laine was) and "quitting".

As to the situation with CBJ, keep in mind no one knew about the trade request until the CBJ management revealed it months and months after the fact. So he didn't demand anything in public, there was not even a hint at it.

Wanting out of two teams in a row is not a great look, but it is what it is, hyperboling it with quitting and making stuff up ("publicly demands out") is just dishonest.

I still don’t buy that Laine asked for a trade either, as referenced by the reporter statements that Laine “still holds Winnipeg in very high regard”. I don’t think he saw it coming, and seemed shell shocked in Columbus immediately after. Until absolutely proven otherwise, to me Laine never asked for a trade out of Winnipeg, and his agent’s comment is a negotiating tactic at best. He’s not a quitter.

 

[CannonFire1]

I don't think he has zero value. I'm sure there are teams that would offer a decent asset, but probably not what CBJ fans are hoping for. I do think it's a bad idea to sell low, so there's definitely a legit strategy of waiting and seeing what happens.

But I do feel some here are cavalierly saying "Oh we just will wait until his value goes up." But what if he gets injured again.... which isn't a huge stretch to imagine. Or ends up back in the mental health program.

I'm just saying there's risk for every decision and there's zero certainty that offers will be better later on. It's just a matter of weighing what the real offers are (no the ones here) and how they feel he is physically and mentally, and how he'll be physically and mentally if he's still in Columbus in January. Sure, it makes total sense to say "It's in his own best interest to play really well if he wants to get dealt." But mental health hardly ever falls into the "People make rationale choices with their own self-interest and well-being in mind"


see above... I'm not sure it's more likely at all, it may be, but the "if" in your 2nd clause is a big one

This is stated well. Every business decision involves risk, and every business owner / manager has a different risk tolerance. Those who never take any risks are unlikely to reap the biggest rewards. We just need to reach the tipping point where 1 GM determines the potential reward to their team exceeds the asking price (with risk baked in).

 

[Marioesque]

But I do feel some here are cavalierly saying "Oh we just will wait until his value goes up." But what if he gets injured again.... which isn't a huge stretch to imagine. Or ends up back in the mental health program.

Injuries can happen to anyone at any time. That's hockey and you have to factor this in with everyone. It's not like Laine has a chronic nagging problem that he keeps re-injuring so I don't see the risk of injury higher than any other player. He's had his share for sure, but I don't expect a Rasmus Andersson head shot every time he steps on the ice. He's not more prone to those than others, maybe he's more of a target for cheap shots because he's a top end player but that's about it.

When Laine is playing fully recovered he's always been a beast so it's easy to expect that to continue. The last time he played was 7 months ago and he had a goal and +2 in 7 minutes of ice time against Leafs, before he got slew footed and crashed awkwardly into the boards at high speed, and then the leaf player who slew footed him landed on him at high speed and he got pinned between board and player crashing into him.

I just don't foresee those things continuously happening, even though they have been pretty standard with him for years. It's still variance, he might go for 5 years without injuries and when he's not injured or just recovering from injury, he's elite. CBJ knows this.

 

[Dr Quincy]

Injuries can happen to anyone at any time. That's hockey and you have to factor this in with everyone. It's not like Laine has a chronic nagging problem that he keeps re-injuring so I don't see the risk of injury higher than any other player. He's had his share for sure, but I don't expect a Rasmus Andersson head shot every time he steps on the ice. He's not more prone to those than others, maybe he's more of a target for cheap shots because he's a top end player but that's about it.

When Laine is playing fully recovered he's always been a beast so it's easy to expect that to continue. The last time he played was 7 months ago and he had a goal and +2 in 7 minutes of ice time against Leafs, before he got slew footed and crashed awkwardly into the boards at high speed, and then the leaf player who slew footed him landed on him at high speed and he got pinned between board and player crashing into him.

I just don't foresee those things continuously happening, even though they have been pretty standard with him for years. It's still variance, he might go for 5 years without injuries and when he's not injured or just recovering from injury, he's elite. CBJ knows this.

He's had at least 2 diagnosed concussions, and yes that means he's more likely to get another. Look at the hit that ultimately ended Marc Savard's career. It was barely anything, so it doesn't need to be a freak accident or a cheap shot or slew foot.

Bottom line: You can keep saying "When Laine is playing fully recovered" and "he might go 5 years without injuries" all you want, but the trade market isn't going to reflect that. Those may be your expectations, but you're not the one dealing the assets, using the cap space and paying the salary. So teams the offers that the real GMs give and the real GM will have to consider aren't going to reflect this unreasonable optimisim.

 

[Marioesque]

He's had at least 2 diagnosed concussions, and yes that means he's more likely to get another. Look at the hit that ultimately ended Marc Savard's career. It was barely anything, so it doesn't need to be a freak accident or a cheap shot or slew foot.

Bottom line: You can keep saying "When Laine is playing fully recovered" and "he might go 5 years without injuries" all you want, but the trade market isn't going to reflect that. Those may be your expectations, but you're not the one dealing the assets, using the cap space and paying the salary. So teams the offers that the real GMs give and the real GM will have to consider aren't going to reflect this unreasonable optimisim.

Oh yes he has had 2 concussions, that is true. There are lots of those in NHL unfortunately.

The ones dealing with assets know just as well as I do that injuries are variance, they also know what Laine can bring when healthy. So their assessment isn't going to be the same as HFboards haters either. A rational GM can't point to "hey he's had bad luck with injuries" as a reason to knock down price unreasonably. It's not a HFboards discussion where some feel that "bad luck" is a thing and can be attached to a person, instead of it being variance.

 

[bicboi64]

Hoping all the best for Laine. I don't think he has negative value at all considering the term he has left.

I'd move Norris for him if CBJ would take him.

 

[NitroF]

I don't know the guy and if he is a reliable source but still...

https://x.com/i/web/status/1819095932006203429

 

[gojetsgo]

I don't know the guy and if he is a reliable source but still...

https://x.com/i/web/status/1819095932006203429

but still what? it's a random twitter account

 

[Double-Shift Lasse]

I don't think he has zero value. I'm sure there are teams that would offer a decent asset, but probably not what CBJ fans are hoping for. I do think it's a bad idea to sell low, so there's definitely a legit strategy of waiting and seeing what happens.

Depending on what you mean by “decent asset” it might just be what CBJ fans are hoping for, at this point.

 

[NitroF]

but still what? it's a random twitter account

Might spark some discussions?
Might enlighten me about this dude's credibility? (You are saying he has none? I believe you.)

I wouldn't have started a thread with an unverified source though.

 

[All Mighty]

Might spark some discussions?
Might enlighten me about this dude's credibility? (You are saying he has none? I believe you.)

I wouldn't have started a thread with an unverified source though.

This is his Twitter bio FYI. I'll let you decide if he sounds legit or not.

 

[The Hockey Tonk Man]

He's had a 65 point pace since joining the Jackets.

Look at Johnny Hockey’s stats w/ Columbus….

Hope Laine can stay healthy, find his form again & move on from whatever had him in the players assistance. Leagues better with him playing in it

 

[Jimmybarndoor2]

Might spark some discussions?
Might enlighten me about this dude's credibility? (You are saying he has none? I believe you.)

I wouldn't have started a thread with an unverified source though.

Did you go to the twitter site?
I did not find any Laine discussion on the last 50 posts

of note
Sabres close on 5 new players
Rangers close on getting rid of 3 and adding 3

Trades imminent

 

[NitroF]

No I did not run a backgound check. I was excited by the fact that this trade rumour (or proposal really) was not, in appearence, coming from a habs fan and was looking for some reactions from both fanbases. Sorry for interrupting the regular progam with some random clickbait fake insider.

 

[Jimmybarndoor2]

Blue Jackets GM: Only one team has expressed interest in Patrik Laine

Late last month, Blue Jackets winger Patrik Laine exited the NHL/NHLPA Player Assistance Program which allows for there to be contact between Laine and Columbus. With a known desire for a change of scenery, the team has granted permission for the winger to talk to other teams as well.

www.yardbarker.com

 

[Andy Dufresne]

Oh yes he has had 2 concussions, that is true. There are lots of those in NHL unfortunately.

The ones dealing with assets know just as well as I do that injuries are variance, they also know what Laine can bring when healthy. So their assessment isn't going to be the same as HFboards haters either. A rational GM can't point to "hey he's had bad luck with injuries" as a reason to knock down price unreasonably. It's not a HFboards discussion where some feel that "bad luck" is a thing and can be attached to a person, instead of it being variance.

You have heard of Sami Salo right?

They would be best off keeping him and hope he plays his trade value back up IMO. If he's healthy and lighting it up, and still wants out, mid season their return will be infinitely better.
It's not like he's in any position to make ultamatems right now.

 

[Marioesque]

You have heard of Sami Salo right?

They would be best off keeping him and hope he plays his trade value back up IMO. If he's healthy and lighting it up, and still wants out, mid season their return will be infinitely better.
It's not like he's in any position to make ultamatems right now.

Yes hs even got bit by kyy, how the F do you manage that?

He's not making demands as far as we know?

Laine is a great hockey player in all aspects. He has one aspect that's #1 in the world.

I wish he ends up in a situation where an equally talented hockey player in general (Aho, Barkov, maybe Fantilli) creates enough space on their own to open up shooting opportunities for Laine. He’s the most dangerous shot inside the offensive zone, he's scored from everywhere in it.

That's how you get the best from him. Create room, let him shoot. He has not had that often. When Wheeler was out to start the 16-17 season (rookie) He did score like 3 hat tricks in his first 14 games or something like that.

He's scored 18 goals a month. 5 goals in one game, 5 shots..100% accuracy.




I've been watching hockey for 35 years. There's no better shot, nobody who can do that damage from outside the slot.

They pointed this out when Laine won the playoff MVP at 17 years old in Finnish league. His shooting percentage from outside the slot was as good as other players from the slot.

This has been true in NHL as well. There's no other player with as many snipes from outside the slot than him. Semin had a few goals that are similar to Laines wristers but that's it. Laine's whole reel is just picking corners from distances that nobody else hits regularly.

I once saw this comparison of shooters who scored goals from way far out, 35 feet etc. Brett Burns was #2 with like 8% and Patty was like 17%.

Yeah he has been injured, he can be injured again no doubt. But he's also the best shot in the league, and an overall great player with no glaring weaknesses if you don't consider random injuries as one.

If you guys know how great Seabass Aho is, you'd want to understand that Patty is at least the same level. And the shot is well above.

It's funny how much he has always outperformed his draft rival in head to head matchups. Since 16 to today. There's other OT goals I'm leaving out.



Recent. Look who's legs he shoots between to end the game


Draw your own conclusions. If you have a better shooting montage of someone better at it, please present. I have watched through all the competition in my time and there's none. None.

 

[Royale With Cheese]

Damn, that was vintage Laine. That was an epic game and comeback to watch back then.

 

[RC51]

Laine will be traded soon and WHY? think back to prior trades. how does the seller drive up the price?
set an ask very high then see what happens who might be interest and the offers. refuse all offers. wait to see if someone ups the ante. still dont accept anything. offers cool off a bit then start leaking the names of teams that have asked about or made an offer, keep adding to the list of teams offering even if not true after its all rumors. declare that a new team has outbid everyone just the create to ignite a trade frenzy for your player. take the final best offer before everyone gets mad at you and everyone takes their offers OFF THE TABLE and black list you from future trade calls.

 

[Tasteless Beaver]

Laine will be traded soon and WHY? think back to prior trades. how does the seller drive up the price?
set an ask very high then see what happens who might be interest and the offers. refuse all offers. wait to see if someone ups the ante. still dont accept anything. offers cool off a bit then start leaking the names of teams that have asked about or made an offer, keep adding to the list of teams offering even if not true after its all rumors. declare that a new team has outbid everyone just the create to ignite a trade frenzy for your player. take the final best offer before everyone gets mad at you and everyone takes their offers OFF THE TABLE and black list you from future trade calls.

Is this a satire post? I honestly can't tell.

 

[timekeep]

I still don’t buy that Laine asked for a trade either, as referenced by the reporter statements that Laine “still holds Winnipeg in very high regard”. I don’t think he saw it coming, and seemed shell shocked in Columbus immediately after. Until absolutely proven otherwise, to me Laine never asked for a trade out of Winnipeg, and his agent’s comment is a negotiating tactic at best. He’s not a quitter.

You are probably correct that he didn't ask for a trade, but he wanted to be playing with certain players but didn't want to back or fore check. Chevy didn't want to pay him 8-9 M either. It was a good trade at the time and I doubt CBJ gets the return that the Jets got for PLD.

 

[cotopaxi]

Yes hs even got bit by kyy, how the F do you manage that?

He's not making demands as far as we know?

Laine is a great hockey player in all aspects. He has one aspect that's #1 in the world.

I wish he ends up in a situation where an equally talented hockey player in general (Aho, Barkov, maybe Fantilli) creates enough space on their own to open up shooting opportunities for Laine. He’s the most dangerous shot inside the offensive zone, he's scored from everywhere in it.

That's how you get the best from him. Create room, let him shoot. He has not had that often. When Wheeler was out to start the 16-17 season (rookie) He did score like 3 hat tricks in his first 14 games or something like that.

He's scored 18 goals a month. 5 goals in one game, 5 shots..100% accuracy.




I've been watching hockey for 35 years. There's no better shot, nobody who can do that damage from outside the slot.

They pointed this out when Laine won the playoff MVP at 17 years old in Finnish league. His shooting percentage from outside the slot was as good as other players from the slot.

This has been true in NHL as well. There's no other player with as many snipes from outside the slot than him. Semin had a few goals that are similar to Laines wristers but that's it. Laine's whole reel is just picking corners from distances that nobody else hits regularly.

I once saw this comparison of shooters who scored goals from way far out, 35 feet etc. Brett Burns was #2 with like 8% and Patty was like 17%.

Yeah he has been injured, he can be injured again no doubt. But he's also the best shot in the league, and an overall great player with no glaring weaknesses if you don't consider random injuries as one.

If you guys know how great Seabass Aho is, you'd want to understand that Patty is at least the same level. And the shot is well above.

It's funny how much he has always outperformed his draft rival in head to head matchups. Since 16 to today. There's other OT goals I'm leaving out.



Recent. Look who's legs he shoots between to end the game


Draw your own conclusions. If you have a better shooting montage of someone better at it, please present. I have watched through all the competition in my time and there's none. None.

I think I could easily name 20 NHL players that are a bigger threat to score a goal with their shot than current Laine. Saying that Laine is the best shot in the League was probably correct like 7 years ago, but for the last few seasons, absolutely not even close.

Lol, for the past two seasons Laine wasn't even the best shooter on his team, maybe not even second best. (Marchenko, Chinakov) His shot quality has plummeted heavily from his glory days in Winnipeg and as sad it is to say, I don't think it's very realistic to assume he gets that thing going again.