Rumor: Kypreos: Ryan Spooner is being shopped; Vancouver might be a fit

[EastonBlues22]

Spooner is no 60+ point player...that's an above average 1st line forward nowadays.

Even if you think he has the talent to be at that level consistently (and I don't think he does), he'll never play the minutes to make it happen because NHL coaches (all of them) tend to care a lot more about defense than fans.

No potential trade partner is going to value him that way.

 

[Absurdity]

Are defenseman the primary need for Boston right now?

With the way Carlo has been playing, and McAvoy potentially making the jump next year if he's not called up late in the season, I don't think so. Chara has been playing well albeit he's not who he once was. He's said he wants to continue playing after his current deal is over. The Bruins also have Krug signed for the next 3 seasons. Zboril, Lauzon, and/or Lindgren should be ready to make the Bruins in the next 1-3 seasons. So overall, I think the Bruins are in a good position defensively. Their offense has been more of a problem this season. The rumors surrounding Spooner mention packaging him for a top 6 forward for that reason. However, it doesn't look like anything will happen soon. Vatrano is almost healthy and after a few games in Providence he will probably be playing LW next to Krejci, and the Bruins will probably assess their forward situation from there.

 

[WhalerTurnedBruin55]

With the way Carlo has been playing, and McAvoy potentially making the jump next year if he's not called up late in the season, I don't think so. Chara has been playing well albeit he's not who he once was. He's said he wants to continue playing after his current deal is over. The Bruins also have Krug signed for the next 3 seasons. Zboril, Lauzon, and/or Lindgren should be ready to make the Bruins in the next 1-3 seasons. So overall, I think the Bruins are in a good position defensively. Their offense has been more of a problem this season. The rumors surrounding Spooner mention packaging him for a top 6 forward for that reason. However, it doesn't look like anything will happen soon. Vatrano is almost healthy and after a few games in Providence he will probably be playing LW next to Krejci, and the Bruins will probably assess their forward situation from there.

If the Bruins can still acquire a potential top 4 defenseman (LD), I take that and run. With Chara aging, even if the acquired player is a currently a bottom pair, if he has room to grow, I'd take that over a winger at the moment.

 

[wintersej]

Spooner is no 60+ point player...that's an above average 1st line forward nowadays.

Even if you think he has the talent to be at that level consistently (and I don't think he does), he'll never play the minutes to make it happen because NHL coaches (all of them) tend to care a lot more about defense than fans.

No potential trade partner is going to value him that way.

So 24 year old centers can't learn to play a more complete game? Marc Savard? I don't understand the logic that someone who scored 49 points with Hayes and Beleksey in 15 minutes a game couldn't get 10 more points playing with real players in more minutes. Those 49 points weren't secondary assist noise, but real points.

OBVIOUSLY, he needs to get better defensively to be the high end #2C he can be to earn the minutes (and with more minutes, better linemates). Is he guaranteed to do that? No. But, you saying he will never make it happen is just as ridiculous as someone guaranteeing he will.

 

[EastonBlues22]

So 24 year old centers can't learn to play a more complete game? Marc Savard? I don't understand the logic that someone who scored 49 points with Hayes and Beleksey in 15 minutes a game couldn't get 10 more points playing with real players in more minutes. Those 49 points weren't secondary assist noise, but real points.

OBVIOUSLY, he needs to get better defensively to be the high end #2C he can be to earn the minutes (and with more minutes, better linemates). Is he guaranteed to do that? No. But, you saying he will never make it happen is just as ridiculous as someone guaranteeing he will.

Sure, he could. Yakupov could put it all together and become a top 6 player, too. Heck, he's almost two full years younger than Spooner.

The salient point is that nobody is going to value either asset that way until they actually start doing those things, now that they've amply proven that they can't.

It's not like the only thing holding them back has been effort or maturity/experience. There are real problems to their games that they've actively been working on, and in spite of that, they still aren't performing at anywhere near the level that they need to be to get the sort of minutes their talent ostensibly "deserves."

Spooner is, what, a month or so away from being 25? The typical prime years range for forwards is their age 24-27 seasons. Raise your hand if you think he's going to be a #1 center next year or the year after, because that's what a 60+ point center is. Look at the centers who scored 60+ points last year. Do you honestly believe that the only thing preventing Spooner from joining that list is better defense?

If he hasn't done it by the end of the traditional prime years, then the chances of it ever happening only go down from there.

 

[wintersej]

Sure, he could. Yakupov could put it all together and become a top 6 player, too. Heck, he's almost two full years younger than Spooner.

The salient point is that nobody is going to value either asset that way until they actually start doing those things, now that they've amply proven that they can't.

It's not like the only thing holding them back has been effort or maturity/experience. There are real problems to their games that they've actively been working on, and in spite of that, they still aren't performing at anywhere near the level that they need to be to get the sort of minutes their talent ostensibly "deserves."

Spooner is, what, a month or so away from being 25? The typical prime years range for forwards is their age 24-27 seasons. Raise your hand if you think he's going to be a #1 center next year or the year after, because that's what a 60+ point center is. Look at the centers who scored 60+ points last year. Do you honestly believe that the only thing preventing Spooner from joining that list is better defense?

If he hasn't done it by the end of the traditional prime years, then the chances of it ever happening only go down from there.

Of course, no one is going to value him as someone who already has 60 points. If he was a 60 point guy making 950k that wasn't even arbitration eligible next year the ask would be through the roof.

Do you honestly believe that the only thing preventing Spooner from joining that list is better defense?

Yes. Amongst forwards, he is a guy who finished 36th in assists and 13th in primary assists last year. At 5 on 5 he was 24th and 9th. Shoot, if he was playing with real linemates last year, he could have secondary assisted his way to 60 points.

He was 149th in TOI. Because of his defense. Despite racking up those points, his line was always a possession nightmare. With less TOI comes lesser linemates. Lesser linemates are not what a playmaking C needs to score points.

And let's be clear. He didn't and hasn't deserved more minutes. In a game dominated by puck possession, he is a decided minus on that front.

He is a fast guy with very good vision and a very good pass. He has a hard but not that accurate shot. He isn't some amazing dangler to beat you one on one, but he is confident with the puck. With the puck on his stick with space (not time, just space) he can zip Marc Savard like passes all over the zone. It's a huge tease as he is somewhere in between Savard and Janney in that skill.

But, he is less than crap on 50/50 pucks...or even on pucks he should get to first. He is soft and shies away from contact.

Spooner is never ever going to be able out strength people in puck battles. But, he can play smarter and read the play better in his own zone. And at least put effort into puck battles. Maybe you still lose 60% of them... but that's better than 80% of them. If he can do that and earn 2nd liner minutes and linemates, him being able to hit 60ish points isn't crazy at all.

But, right now he is soft as soft can be. Is that something that can change? Is he a wake up call trade away from reaching his potential? Or is he a woulda shoulda? Could he thrive in a system that tries to out speed people rather than out grind them like the Bruins?

I don't have the answers to that. What I do know is that right now he is an offensive middle sixer. He has the skill to be an offensive top sixer. Time is not on his side and time has not run out.

 

[Sens Rule]

Of course, no one is going to value him as someone who already has 60 points. If he was a 60 point guy making 950k that wasn't even arbitration eligible next year the ask would be through the roof.

Yes. Amongst forwards, he is a guy who finished 36th in assists and 13th in primary assists last year. At 5 on 5 he was 24th and 9th. Shoot, if he was playing with real linemates last year, he could have secondary assisted his way to 60 points.

He was 149th in TOI. Because of his defense. Despite racking up those points, his line was always a possession nightmare. With less TOI comes lesser linemates. Lesser linemates are not what a playmaking C needs to score points.

And let's be clear. He didn't and hasn't deserved more minutes. In a game dominated by puck possession, he is a decided minus on that front.

He is a fast guy with very good vision and a very good pass. He has a hard but not that accurate shot. He isn't some amazing dangler to beat you one on one, but he is confident with the puck. With the puck on his stick with space (not time, just space) he can zip Marc Savard like passes all over the zone. It's a huge tease as he is somewhere in between Savard and Janney in that skill.

But, he is less than crap on 50/50 pucks...or even on pucks he should get to first. He is soft and shies away from contact.

Spooner is never ever going to be able out strength people in puck battles. But, he can play smarter and read the play better in his own zone. And at least put effort into puck battles. Maybe you still lose 60% of them... but that's better than 80% of them. If he can do that and earn 2nd liner minutes and linemates, him being able to hit 60ish points isn't crazy at all.

But, right now he is soft as soft can be. Is that something that can change? Is he a wake up call trade away from reaching his potential? Or is he a woulda shoulda? Could he thrive in a system that tries to out speed people rather than out grind them like the Bruins?

I don't have the answers to that. What I do know is that right now he is an offensive middle sixer. He has the skill to be an offensive top sixer. Time is not on his side and time has not run out.

With that description I wouldn't mind Ottawa getting him and playing him at centre between Pageau and Smith. Playing with two natural centres who are intense competitors takes pressure off him for faceoffs and puck retrieval. Pageau got 19 goals last year and Smith 25 goals but this year they have struggled offensively. With a top playmaker centering them on offence perhaps they can thrive like they did with Stone on their line last season. And with two top defensive linemates that flaw in Spooners game is mitigated.

Would Boston take Ottawa's first and a second tier prospect for Spooner?

 

[pierre gagnon*]

Bruins need a #3 for Krug to play like Carlo. Maybe they have it in O'Gara then they need a #1 or #2 to be replace Chara. Could be McAvoy with Carlo. Krug is not dropping down anytime soon he is playing large minutes. Too many bottom pairing guys that should be thinned out. Spooner will not get any of those guys but as a package with McQuaid or K. Miller a pick and prospect or 2. Bruind have lots of quality prospects right now. That may be enough to get a #3 or #4 deeman.

 

[wintersej]

With that description I wouldn't mind Ottawa getting him and playing him at centre between Pageau and Smith. Playing with two natural centres who are intense competitors takes pressure off him for faceoffs and puck retrieval. Pageau got 19 goals last year and Smith 25 goals but this year they have struggled offensively. With a top playmaker centering them on offence perhaps they can thrive like they did with Stone on their line last season. And with two top defensive linemates that flaw in Spooners game is mitigated.

Would Boston take Ottawa's first and a second tier prospect for Spooner?

The value is fair, but I don't think the Bruins trade him in-season for futures, they would be looking at a piece that would help now. And, this early in the season, I don't think Ottawa should be moving their 1st.

 

[Canadian Canuck]

Tanev hands down would be your best dman what are you on about?

Tanev>>>>Spooner lmao

 

[nmbr_24]

Sure, he could. Yakupov could put it all together and become a top 6 player, too. Heck, he's almost two full years younger than Spooner.

The salient point is that nobody is going to value either asset that way until they actually start doing those things, now that they've amply proven that they can't.

It's not like the only thing holding them back has been effort or maturity/experience. There are real problems to their games that they've actively been working on, and in spite of that, they still aren't performing at anywhere near the level that they need to be to get the sort of minutes their talent ostensibly "deserves."

Spooner is, what, a month or so away from being 25? The typical prime years range for forwards is their age 24-27 seasons. Raise your hand if you think he's going to be a #1 center next year or the year after, because that's what a 60+ point center is. Look at the centers who scored 60+ points last year. Do you honestly believe that the only thing preventing Spooner from joining that list is better defense?

If he hasn't done it by the end of the traditional prime years, then the chances of it ever happening only go down from there.

I think Spooner could score 60 points playing with better linemates and more minutes. I don't think he is a 1st line center, I think he is a 2nd line center who is very good offensively and can run a power play and has gotten much better defensively. He is never going to have 1st line center value because every legit 1st line center is going to be able to win face offs and be competent defensively. Tyler Seguin couldn't crack the top 2 center position on the Bruins so Spooner not cracking the top 2 center positions doesn't mean that much to me. That is what happens when a team has Bergeron and Krejci playing center. When Spooner filled in for Krejci at one point last year he looked great and played better than I have ever seen him before.

He is not going to knock Bergeron or Krejci out of their spots and he doesn't play as well as a wing. He is what he is, a good offensive center with some flaws. I would love to see how he would do with Belesky and Backes as his wings. I believe that could be one of the best 3rd lines in the league, kind of like back when the Bruins had a 70 point player on their 3rd line 6-7 years ago when the Bruins had Savard, Bergeron, and Krejci.

None of that means he fits the bill for what anyone would be looking for, just that I also believe he could score 60 points.

 

[PetterssonSimp]

Bruins need a #3 for Krug to play like Carlo. Maybe they have it in O'Gara then they need a #1 or #2 to be replace Chara. Could be McAvoy with Carlo. Krug is not dropping down anytime soon he is playing large minutes. Too many bottom pairing guys that should be thinned out. Spooner will not get any of those guys but as a package with McQuaid or K. Miller a pick and prospect or 2. Bruind have lots of quality prospects right now. That may be enough to get a #3 or #4 deeman.

Something around Alex Edler for Spoons and a defenceman prospect who is close to NHL ready with good middle pairing potential. Idk much about Bruins prospect pool as I don't follow you guys very closely at all. And if we start defence talk along the lines of say a Morrow a bit more would be needed, but say one that defender you guys grabbing with your 13/14/15th overall picks you guys had that one season. I always forget his name. Weird spelling.
Edler may not be a stand out #1, but if he was played as the #3 you guys need for now I bet he'd be a lot better in his role and at 5 million for another season but unlikely to have the leverage to demand a huge raise

 

[Cogburn]

Something around Alex Edler for Spoons and a defenceman prospect who is close to NHL ready with good middle pairing potential. Idk much about Bruins prospect pool as I don't follow you guys very closely at all. And if we start defence talk along the lines of say a Morrow a bit more would be needed, but say one that defender you guys grabbing with your 13/14/15th overall picks you guys had that one season. I always forget his name. Weird spelling.
Edler may not be a stand out #1, but if he was played as the #3 you guys need for now I bet he'd be a lot better in his role and at 5 million for another season but unlikely to have the leverage to demand a huge raise

Edler is stubbornly not wanting to move, so that might rubout our hopes of moving him if it isn't an ideal situation for him.

I know my fellow Canucks fans are adamant about his decline being worse then we realise, but Spooner and Morrow (or Senyshyn did you mean?) for Edler seems....very light. I guess I simply don't value futures as much as prime aged assets, even going into a tailspin of a rebuild like everyone is trying to convince me we are.

Three my weird quibbles about the value aside, do we need another near NHL ready D prospect? I mean between Tryamkin, Hutton, Stetcher, Larsen, Gudbranson, Pedan and Subban, not to mention Juolevi, we have a ton of young D with ceilings from AHL PP specialists to top flight number ones. If we were forced to do Spooner+ for Edler, I'd want another potential high end forward, or failing that, a high pick, instead of another D.

I don't know what, outside of a D, we have to offer for Spooner though.