Low Effort GDT Kraft Hockeyville Presents: Clash at the Sudbury Community Arena | Sunday! Sunday! Sunday! (7PM)

[bert]

Or that there are some Sens fans that liked him and some who considered him replaceable.

“Sens fans” are not a hive mind like the Borg.

I liked Joseph and I think they could miss his speed on puck retrievals. However I think Gregor could fill that role to an extent. Cousins was really good last night he's way better on the cycle and down low than Joseph. He also knows his role something I think Joseph didn't want to accept at times. So I mean the people complaining about losing him could also acknowledge a players that essentially replaced him was really good.

 

[jbeck5]

Suddenly, Joseph is considered an exceptional player, yet when he was on our team, many were eager to trade him for a bag of pucks. It's peculiar how Sens fans seem to lack appreciation for players while they're here, but the moment they leave, they become ardent admirers.


Yeah in a preseason game that means absolutely nothing. okay

When our vets suck "it's just the preseason, vets don't care about this"

Then other teams vets do well "it's just the preseason, no one cares about this"

Maybe our vets just aren't as good?

We’re going to see some DJ smith hockey. Our team looked goood under a world class coach like Jacques. But we didn’t want to go the world class route again

Even under JM we looked "mid".

 

[NyQuil]

If we had been winning all of our games, it would be “well it’s pre-season” so I’m not going to get worked up after dropping two in a row.

The game did remind me of the games last season where our stretches of better play than our opponent would go unrewarded and then we’d lose the game in the blink of an eye.

But that shouldn’t be much of a surprise because it’s not as if there’s been a large number of games since. Its still the same team and there’s still a lot of work to do.

I don’t think we will clean up a lot of our endemic problems overnight.

Whether you like Green or not, he hasn’t had enough time to put his stamp on the team.

I liked Joseph and I think they could miss his speed on puck retrievals. However I think Gregor could fill that role to an extent. Cousins was really good last night he's way better on the cycle and down low than Joseph. He also knows his role something I think Joseph didn't want to accept at times. So I mean the people complaining about losing him could also acknowledge a players that essentially replaced him was really good.

I haven’t seen enough of anyone to really know.

 

[jbeck5]

That's been a problem for awhile now, compete level. I know it's only pre-season but I'm not confident they'll just turn it on on Oct 10th. I saw a lot of gap control issues and puck watching tonight which was very familiar.

This.

I don't see how players will magically learn how to do proper defensive coverage in the next week or so.

That and the compete level is awful..like you said, too much standing around and watching.

No pressure on the forecheck.

Having bounces not go your way at this time of the year is expected. But to not have legs and look lost in the defensive zone again for the 8th straight year is not encouraging.

 

[Micklebot]

When our vets suck "it's just the preseason, vets don't care about this"

Then other teams vets do well "it's just the preseason, no one cares about this"

Maybe our vets just aren't as good?


Even under JM we looked "mid".

I mean, we outshot them 38 to 26 and they only got back in the game after a phantom call put them on the PP, along with a circus bounce or two.

I'm not saying we were perfect, we weren't, but it's painfully obvious people are incapable of separating the score from how teams played.

 

[jbeck5]

I mean, we outshot them 38 to 26 and they only got back in the game after a phantom call put them on the PP, along with a circus bounce or two.

I'm not saying we were perfect, we weren't, but it's painfully obvious people are incapable of separating the score from how teams played.

Nope. This isn't a case of not separating the play from the results..

This is a case of fans seeing the exact same type of hockey as last year. The same type of hockey that won't be good enough to make the playoffs.

Now, thankfully it's just preseason...but that doesn't mean it's not cause for concern when the team is still doing the same crap they have in the past with a different coaching staff and big roster turnaround.

I would have expected to see guys legs moving more, considering they're trying to impress a new coach, and I would have expected all the new vets to make this team have a different look, and not the same "kick ass for 20 minutes, don't bank enough of a lead, then suck ass for 40 mins and lose the game" (simplification, but still).

Instead, the vets just seemed to play like the sens of old play. So if they're not going to lead the way, but will follow the current sens group, what's the point?

 

[Senscore]

It's hard to get too upset given that we were a perfect 3-0 against Pittsburgh last year with largely the same teams.

Some bad puck luck with the lob shot and Pinto's stick breaking at the worst possible time.

Chiefly through I'm concerned about Forsberg. While I'm not going to blame him for the tap in or the lob shot, he's still giving up at least one or two bad goals a game that he should have. He's a $2.75 million player delivering sub-replacement level goaltending, made all the more egregious in an offseason where Kevin Lankinen is making 800k and Anthony Stolarz is making $2.5 million.

Making the playoffs is going to be a battle, and giving 30 or so games to a goalie who will likely have limited options finding a job in this league next year is maybe too large an obstacle to overcome, provided nothing changes.

 

[Cosmix]

Speaking of anthems I still think about that lady in Sweden from time to time.

Was that the one you met in the street?

 

[Micklebot]

Nope. This isn't a case of not separating the play from the results..

This is a case of fans seeing the exact same type of hockey as last year. The same type of hockey that won't be good enough to make the playoffs.

Now, thankfully it's just preseason...but that doesn't mean it's not cause for concern when the team is still doing the same crap they have in the past with a different coaching staff and big roster turnaround.

I would have expected to see guys legs moving more, considering they're trying to impress a new coach, and I would have expected all the new vets to make this team have a different look, and not the same "kick ass for 20 minutes, don't bank enough of a lead, then suck ass for 40 mins and lose the game" (simplification, but still).

Instead, the vets just seemed to play like the sens of old play. So if they're not going to lead the way, but will follow the current sens group, what's the point?

There was quite a bit different last night, and while some things that still need cleaning up that wasn't last year's team. The system and type of hockey was quite different from last year, not sure how you could watch that and think otherwise.

 

[jbeck5]

There was quite a bit different last night, and while some things that still need cleaning up that wasn't last year's team. The system and type of hockey was quite different from last year, not sure how you could watch that and think otherwise.

See, I'm not sure how YOU could not see the similarities.

Plenty more posters seem to be saying what I'm thinking....

Such as:

-Forsberg still looks like Forsberg who let's in a weak goal every game, if not 2. just like last year.
-chabot looked good for a bit...and then started looking lost in his own zone...just like last year.
-batherson made a couple nice plays, and then was invisible for the rest of the game...just like last year.
-norris is nowhere to be seen while being talked about as being healthy...just like last year. (Though this one isn't about this specific game, but it comes to mind)

I will give you stutzle looks uninjured this year, and therefore looked good, just like he did in preseason last year before injuring his wrist.

Then you have all the veteran additions that didn't stand out or take over the game, but rather looked like they were going through the motions. Were you impressed by amadio or Perron? Me neither. You wouldn't think they combine for almost 7M of our cap lol.

 

[Senscore]

Was that the one you met in the street?

If only.

 

[Micklebot]

It's hard to get too upset given that we were a perfect 3-0 against Pittsburgh last year with largely the same teams.

Some bad puck luck with the lob shot and Pinto's stick breaking at the worst possible time.

Chiefly through I'm concerned about Forsberg. While I'm not going to blame him for the tap in or the lob shot, he's still giving up at least one or two bad goals a game that he should have. He's a $2.75 million player delivering sub-replacement level goaltending, made all the more egregious in an offseason where Kevin Lankinen is making 800k and Anthony Stolarz is making $2.5 million.

Making the playoffs is going to be a battle, and giving 30 or so games to a goalie who will likely have limited options finding a job in this league next year is maybe too large an obstacle to overcome, provided nothing changes.

2 quick goals turned the game around and both came off pretty fortunate bounces, one a circus bounce, the other a center pass gets blocked by a skate and deflects right to the point completely breaking down coverage. It happens, but that was the difference right there.

I think Forsberg could have had one of them but he isn't really to blame here, bounces happen and being able to recognize when it doesn is necessary in evaluating performance.

No team is controlling the play for 60 mins, if that's your (not you specifically) expectations, the maybe people should follow the globetrotters,

 

[jbeck5]

2 quick goals turned the game around and both came off pretty fortunate bounces, one a circus bounce, the other a center pass gets blocked by a skate and deflects right to the point completely breaking down coverage. It happens, but that was the difference right there.

I think Forsberg could have had one of them but he isn't really to blame here, bounces happen and being able to recognize when it doesn is necessary in evaluating performance.

No team is controlling the play for 60 mins, if that's your (not you specifically) expectations, the maybe people should follow the globetrotters,

Just promise me you won't use bounces as an excuse come the regular season like DJ Smith always used.

Good teams create their chances and their luck.

Good teams don't let it come down to the bounces.

But this is just preseason. Let's see I'm they can magically turn it around in the next week or so.

 

[Micklebot]

See, I'm not sure how YOU could not see the similarities.

Plenty more posters seem to be saying what I'm thinking....

Such as:

-Forsberg still looks like Forsberg who let's in a weak goal every game, if not 2. just like last year.
-chabot looked good for a bit...and then started looking lost in his own zone...just like last year.
-batherson made a couple nice plays, and then was invisible for the rest of the game...just like last year.
-norris is nowhere to be seen while being talked about as being healthy...just like last year. (Though this one isn't about this specific game, but it comes to mind)

I will give you stutzle looks uninjured this year, and therefore looked good, just like he did in preseason last year before injuring his wrist.

Then you have all the veteran additions that didn't stand out or take over the game, but rather looked like they were going through the motions. Were you impressed by amadio or Perron? Me neither. You wouldn't think they combine for almost 7M of our cap lol.

The for check was more aggressive, we clearly changed it up, we also were much much better at reloading and resetting. We stayed above the puck much better than last year, and it showed.

Our D were aggressive in a good way, they joined the rush and forwards were back to cover, Hamonic had a couple great chances, he was skating well.

Defensively, the D were keeping their gaps much better, in part because the back checkers were helping out more than last year. I really liked Kleven in particular, he did a great job breaking plays up though he did get a bit aggressive on the first goal clearing the net, and JBD didn't pick up the opening to cover. It will come as guys start to learn each other's tendencies and communicate more.

But your right, posters complained about Forberg, even when it made no sense to, that part is just like last year.

 

[bert]

There was quite a bit different last night, and while some things that still need cleaning up that wasn't last year's team. The system and type of hockey was quite different from last year, not sure how you could watch that and think otherwise.

Yes the d were stepping up more gaps were tighter. To me I saw half the guys executing it and half of them not. They were all doing it in the first period and it got away from them as the game went along.

Stutzle even talked about the extra thinking they are doing in his interview between the first and second period.

To suggest nothing has changed from a systems perspective is incorrect. The more used to it the better they will be as it becomes habit. They need reps.

I personally thought the gaps were way better. My issue came from the lack of battle from some players at the blue lines. The weak clears many players had under limited pressure. Lastly how long the second forchecker took to get there in the 2nd and 3rd period.

This teams biggest issues last year were consistency. It's not going to change over night unfortunately. To expect that it will is a little unrealistic.

They were the better team one stinker from Forsberg (which is unacceptable) and two bad bounces were the difference. Greig scores that open look and they probably win. If they are gonna lose on bad breaks I'm OK with it. Especially in pre season.

I'd like to see Tokarski get a full game. Let's see what he's got.

See, I'm not sure how YOU could not see the similarities.

Plenty more posters seem to be saying what I'm thinking....

Such as:

-Forsberg still looks like Forsberg who let's in a weak goal every game, if not 2. just like last year.
-chabot looked good for a bit...and then started looking lost in his own zone...just like last year.
-batherson made a couple nice plays, and then was invisible for the rest of the game...just like last year.
-norris is nowhere to be seen while being talked about as being healthy...just like last year. (Though this one isn't about this specific game, but it comes to mind)

I will give you stutzle looks uninjured this year, and therefore looked good, just like he did in preseason last year before injuring his wrist.

Then you have all the veteran additions that didn't stand out or take over the game, but rather looked like they were going through the motions. Were you impressed by amadio or Perron? Me neither. You wouldn't think they combine for almost 7M of our cap lol.

You seem to be confusing habits of players with coaching style and systems.

 

[jbeck5]

The for check was more aggressive, we clearly changed it up, we also were much much better at reloading and resetting. We stayed above the puck much better than last year, and it showed.

Our D were aggressive in a good way, they joined the rush and forwards were back to cover, Hamonic had a couple great chances, he was skating well.

Defensively, the D were keeping their gaps much better, in part because the back checkers were helping out more than last year. I really liked Kleven in particular, he did a great job breaking plays up though he did get a bit aggressive on the first goal clearing the net, and JBD didn't pick up the opening to cover. It will come as guys start to learn each other's tendencies and communicate more.

But your right, posters complained about Forberg, even when it made no sense to, that part is just like last year.

You described the first period.

And then it was all crap. It's the same as last year. Do you really think we never had periods of good hockey last year? We always had these super sweet 10-30 minutes of hockey but could never do it for 60 mins to ensure the W.

What you described is very accurate, for a portion of the game. Unfortunately, it was just like last year, where we didn't sustain that play for the whole game, and ended up losing.

You can go through last year's tapes and find a good 20-30 or even 40 mins of play in any random game just like you described. And then we lose confidence or endurance or something and collapse.

Same old same old.

We're incapable of playing a proper solid/dominant 60 mins like the good teams. We will dominate periods of games and lose half the games we play.

I don't think you've been very convincing that the team looks significantly different than last year. It's a lot of the same old same old.

We also had Tkachuk going off with a scrub because no one else takes care of stuff...like last year.

 

[Micklebot]

Yes the d were stepping up more gaps were tighter. To me I saw half the guys executing it and half of them not. They were all doing it in the first period and it got away from them as the game went along.

Stutzle even talked about the extra thinking they are doing in his interview between the first and second period.

To suggest nothing has changed from a systems perspective is incorrect. The more used to it the better they will be as it becomes habit. They need reps.

I personally thought the gaps were way better. My issue came from the lack of battle from some players at the blue lines. The weak clears many players had under limited pressure. Lastly how long the second forchecker took to get there in the 2nd and 3rd period.

This teams biggest issues last year were consistency. It's not going to change over night unfortunately. To expect that it will is a little unrealistic.

They were the better team one stinker from Forsberg (which is unacceptable) and two bad bounces were the difference. Greig scores that open look and they probably win. If they are gonna lose on bad breaks I'm OK with it. Especially in pre season.

I'd like to see Tokarski get a full game. Let's see what he's got.


You seem to be confusing habits of players with coaching style and systems.

Yeah, it seemed like some guys started to get tired by the third, might be a bit of a side effect of Green's tough training camps.

I agree the consistency will need to improve, that's pretty typical when you introduce a new system.

 

[jbeck5]

Yes the d were stepping up more gaps were tighter. To me I saw half the guys executing it and half of them not. They were all doing it in the first period and it got away from them as the game went along.

Stutzle even talked about the extra thinking they are doing in his interview between the first and second period.

To suggest nothing has changed from a systems perspective is incorrect. The more used to it the better they will be as it becomes habit. They need reps.

I personally thought the gaps were way better. My issue came from the lack of battle from some players at the blue lines. The weak clears many players had under limited pressure. Lastly how long the second forchecker took to get there in the 2nd and 3rd period.

This teams biggest issues last year were consistency. It's not going to change over night unfortunately. To expect that it will is a little unrealistic.

They were the better team one stinker from Forsberg (which is unacceptable) and two bad bounces were the difference. Greig scores that open look and they probably win. If they are gonna lose on bad breaks I'm OK with it. Especially in pre season.

I'd like to see Tokarski get a full game. Let's see what he's got.


You seem to be confusing habits of players with coaching style and systems.

You're probably right, but I think they go together. I'm of the belief we need to improve our coaching staff and roster relatively significantly before we could win a Stanley cup....so I may be lumping them together.

Sometimes, if a player leaves his coverage, it's hard to know if that's what the coach is asking them to do, or if that's a players tendencies that can't seem to be coached out of them...so I may just pump them together.

 

[Micklebot]

You described the first period.

And then it was all crap. It's the same as last year. Do you really think we never had periods of good hockey last year? We always had these super sweet 10-30 minutes of hockey but could never do it for 60 mins to ensure the W.

What you described is very accurate, for a portion of the game. Unfortunately, it was just like last year, where we didn't sustain that play for the whole game, and ended up losing.

You can go through last year's tapes and find a good 20-30 or even 40 mins of play in any random game just like you described. And then we lose confidence or endurance or something and collapse.

Same old same old.

We're incapable of playing a proper solid/dominant 60 mins like the good teams. We will dominate periods of games and lose half the games we play.

I don't think you've been very convincing that the team looks significantly different than last year. It's a lot of the same old same old.

We also had Tkachuk going off with a scrub because no one else takes care of stuff...like last year.

I described the whole game, it's just perception got more and more negative every time a goal went in.

Wth are you talking about nobody takes care of things, both Hamonic and MacEwen went right after Poulin when he tried to go after Stu, had anybody tried to intervene with the Tkachuk situation it would have been a third man in, stupid penalty to want them to take.

No team plays a dominant 60 mins, go watch the globetrotters if that's what you want.

 

[bert]

You're probably right, but I think they go together. I'm of the belief we need to improve our coaching staff and roster relatively significantly before we could win a Stanley cup....so I may be lumping them together.

Sometimes, if a player leaves his coverage, it's hard to know if that's what the coach is asking them to do, or if that's a players tendencies that can't seem to be coached out of them...so I may just pump them together.

I mean the system they had them playing was on full display in the first period. Extremely tight gaps with puck pressure all over the ice. Players are literally talking about thinking too much as they get used to it. They just stopped excecuting as the game went along. Coach's can only do so much. It takes reps. By game 30 if you want to start to complain about the coaching and show tangible reasons I will listen but it's way too early and frankly the signs of a good system were already seeing it in game 1 of actually having an NHL roster in exhibition game.

What we did see were d men stepping up on guys with the blue line with back pressure. That's coaching. If you don't want to acknowledge it that's fine. But it was happening.

 

[Burrowsaurus]

It's hard to get too upset given that we were a perfect 3-0 against Pittsburgh last year with largely the same teams.

Some bad puck luck with the lob shot and Pinto's stick breaking at the worst possible time.

Chiefly through I'm concerned about Forsberg. While I'm not going to blame him for the tap in or the lob shot, he's still giving up at least one or two bad goals a game that he should have. He's a $2.75 million player delivering sub-replacement level goaltending, made all the more egregious in an offseason where Kevin Lankinen is making 800k and Anthony Stolarz is making $2.5 million.

Making the playoffs is going to be a battle, and giving 30 or so games to a goalie who will likely have limited options finding a job in this league next year is maybe too large an obstacle to overcome, provided nothing changes.

Can’t blame him for taking the monster contract from Dorion

 

[Golden_Jet]

That deflected in goal by Sanderson was hilarious to watch. What a perfect pop fly.

The chicken little posts from Jeff Beck is entertaining.

 

[UglyPuckling]

That's been a problem for awhile now, compete level. I know it's only pre-season but I'm not confident they'll just turn it on on Oct 10th. I saw a lot of gap control issues and puck watching tonight which was very familiar.

There were also some tap in goals from a player (e.g., Crosby) alone at the side of the net. I think some will blame it on the goalie as per usual. I do think Forsberg had one stinky goal that he let in, so we would have only lost 4 - 2 then. It's still a loss regardless. But the superficial and lazy analysis from some will focus on a single source of blame, namely the goalie.

 

[UglyPuckling]

What an absurd comment.


Sidney Crosby back door tap ins are stinkers? Stopped reading right there and so should everyone else.

If you wanna be negative atleast have some substance or be accurate. Plenty of things to talk about. But a hyperbolic inaccurate comment looking for an argument because you want attention is a waste of.time.

It's the per usual from some in here. There always is the lazy, single source of blame type of analysis from some.

 

[Micklebot]

There were also some tap in goals from a player (e.g., Crosby) alone at the side of the net. I think some will blame it on the goalie as per usual. I do think Forsberg had one stinky goal that he let in, so we would have only lost 4 - 2 then. It's still a loss regardless. But the superficial and lazy analysis from some will focus on a single source of blame, namely the goalie.

Well, 4-2 assumes we still let in the EN goal after pulling the goalie early to make up a two goal deficit, it's impossible to know how things would have gone had he not let in the stinker.

That said, I don't think it's fair to blame Forsberg, the pop fly goal was a one in million situation, the first goal was a tap in where neither D took care of the weak side and a forward lost coverage on Crosby, so at best were tied without him being at fault.

I didn't go back and rewatch the other goal, it seemed soft on first viewing, so maybe that one was on him, we just needed to finish on some of our chances on the PP and it doesn't matter