Kitchener Rangers 2024-25 Season Thread, Part II

[Gondrex]

......... My greatest fear is that once / if Ellis comes to this team, that would be 8 - yes eight - '07's from the 2023 draft......

Haeden Ellis signed -> Press Release: Rangers Sign 2023 Draft Pick Haeden Ellis to OHL Scholarship & Development Agreement - Kitchener Rangers

My mistake. As this release has pointed out, there are 9 players from the 2023 draft now signed, not 8. In comparison, we only have one from the 2022 draft. That one's a little easier to figure out.

 

[Jives]

Ellis officially announced. Somethings gotta give soon.

Forwards - 17 (plus Cameron)
Defence - 8
Goalies - 2 (plus Edwards)

OA - 2
Swick
Misa
2005 - 3
Mercer
Grisolia
Pridham
2006 - 4
Ellinas
Bott
Hlacar
Vermeulen
2007 - 6
Lam
Romano
Arquette
Labrash
Ellis
Stark
2008 - 2 + Jr.B
Headrick
Anstis
Cameron (Jr. .B card)

2005 - 2
Ando
Chromiak (import)
2006 - 2
Campbell
Dirracolo
2007 - 3
Reid
MacNeil
Schneider
2008 - 1
Bilecki

OA - 1
Parsons
2007 - 1
Edwards (signed but not with team)
2008 - 1
Schaubel

 

[Krangers08]

Rangers have him listed at 5,10 USHL through central scouting has him at 5,7.5 (last years height?)

 

[Matttheleaf]

What round would Ellis have been drafted if he wasn't committed to a college? I know we took him in the 8th round but surely he would have gone sooner.

 

[EvenSteven]

What round would Ellis have been drafted if he wasn't committed to a college? I know we took him in the 8th round but surely he would have gone sooner.

Unsure. But a player who at least played a few games with the NTDP is a significant player.

 

[Jives]

I would guess middle of 2nd. No way his agent allows him to come here without a path to ice time. This signing imo is a good sign to continuing the rebuild and out the door next are the older players via trade.

 

[EvenSteven]

I would guess middle of 2nd. No way his agent allows him to come here without a path to ice time. This signing imo is a good sign to continuing the rebuild and out the door next are the older players via trade.

He is committed to NCAA for the 26-27 season. But I wouldn’t be surprised if he and others who come to the CHL play their 19 year old year here.

Those committments were made before the CHL was a possibility.

 

[robertmac43]

MM, time to get on the phones and make some thing happen here. There are too many cooks in the kitchen on this roster.

 

[Gondrex]

Rangers have him listed at 5,10 USHL through central scouting has him at 5,7.5 (last years height?)

When drafted by the Rangers last year, he was listed at 5'-6 3/4" and 137 lbs. His height / weight are no longer listed on the Cedar Rapids website, but I believe that when I viewed it a couple days ago, he was listed at 5'-10" and 160-ish lbs.....just trying to go by memory, which ain't as good as it was when I wore a younger man's clothes .

 

[Ranger77]

I know that many of you feel that trading Andonovski is a move that needs to happen and I completely understand the rationale. I would be concerned though with losing our biggest physical threat and intimidation factor. Who would we have to protect the likes of Reid, Lam, and Romano? Can you imagine the liberties the Knights would take in future matchups?

 

[bobber]

I know that many of you feel that trading Andonovski is a move that needs to happen and I completely understand the rationale. I would be concerned though with losing our biggest physical threat and intimidation factor. Who would we have to protect the likes of Reid, Lam, and Romano? Can you imagine the liberties the Knights would take in future matchups?

Good point 77. At this moment in time it's a mystery for most Ranger fans what the actual agenda is going forward. Not sure what message MM is sending with signing more young players, older players etc.

 

[EvenSteven]

I know that many of you feel that trading Andonovski is a move that needs to happen and I completely understand the rationale. I would be concerned though with losing our biggest physical threat and intimidation factor. Who would we have to protect the likes of Reid, Lam, and Romano? Can you imagine the liberties the Knights would take in future matchups?

Good point 77. At this moment in time it's a mystery for most Ranger fans what the actual agenda is going forward. Not sure what message MM is sending with signing more young players, older players etc.

We managed when we dealt Xhekaj. We could deal Ando and bring back someone as we did back then (Mutter).

Thanks to the CHL/NCAA agreement, MM is capitalizing on his taking flyers over the last few years.

Get them into Kitchener. Sort out the logjam afterwards.

Better to have and not need, than need and not have.

 

[I Mac 80]

I think something has to give sooner rather than later. Have to remember that these young guys all want to play and currently there isn’t enough ice time to around to keep everyone happy. As well as this being a learning/building year I think we’ll be ok trading the vets. We have a great coaching staff and we should get into the playoffs which will give the young guys great experience. We truly have a great opportunity here to really set the team up to be successful and a true contender for not just one season but a couple. This years situation reminds of the Windsor team in 07-08 when they were pretty good but young and they didn’t try to trade into contention that year and did a soft sell and set themselves up for the next 2+years. Not saying we will be as good as those teams but there is a chance to see what might happen.

 

[Krangers08]

Will the Hlacar experiment last the full year?
I think one of Vermeulan/Grisolia will be released.
Can a player be traded twice in a season or is there a timeframe between trades? Can’t remember the rule

 

[EvenSteven]

I think we’ll see LaBrash scratched before Hlacar.

Grisolia is a premiere PKer I think. I like him better than Mercer. Ellis is listed as a center. Does he make Mercer expendable?

Vermeulen is a step behind I think. But there’s a reason he’s used ahead of Bottineau on the 2nd PP unit and top six when there’s an injury.

I think you still stick to the plan attempt to move high end graduating players. But some evaluation has to be going on among the 07’s. Will Ellis make Arquette expendable for example.

 

[EvenSteven]

Quick question.

I know players cannot make the jump from the NCAA to the CHL to play their OA season (Mike Van Ryn rule). But can players who are committed to the NCAA, but aren’t yet playing there, make the jump to play their OA season?

Former Ranger draft pick D-Tucker Shedd, an 04, is currently playing in the BCHL. He’s committed to start at Michigan State next year. He has decent numbers this year as a D.

Would the Mike Van Ryn rule apply here or could he make the jump?

Or would the Rangers have even held onto his rights? (50 player protected list). If he’s not on our protected list, could he or anyone in his situation be signed as a FA?

Say the Rangers move Ando and an OA. Could he be brought in to fill the void left by Ando on D?

 

[Gondrex]

I think we’ll see LaBrash scratched before Hlacar.

Grisolia is a premiere PKer I think. I like him better than Mercer. Ellis is listed as a center. Does he make Mercer expendable?

Vermeulen is a step behind I think. But there’s a reason he’s used ahead of Bottineau on the 2nd PP unit and top six when there’s an injury.

I think you still stick to the plan attempt to move high end graduating players. But some evaluation has to be going on among the 07’s. Will Ellis make Arquette expendable for example.

Agreed. With LaBrash + the 2023 picks, there are now a total of (10) '07's on this team. That is too many from one draft year IMO. I was also thinking about what Even Steven mentioned. I wouldn't be surprised to see a mid-tier '07 (or two ?) traded. Hopefully for picks and not for an older top-end player in an attempt to contend. As ES also mentioned, this is MM's last chance to bring in a lot of picks in exchange for one of our coveted players (or two ?).

Will Ellis slot in for Mercer ? If so, should be interesting to see how he fits in on that 3rd line.

 

[Gondrex]

Quick question.

I know players cannot make the jump from the NCAA to the CHL to play their OA season (Mike Van Ryn rule). But can players who are committed to the NCAA, but aren’t yet playing there, make the jump to play their OA season?

Former Ranger draft pick D-Tucker Shedd, an 04, is currently playing in the BCHL. He’s committed to start at Michigan State next year. He has decent numbers this year as a D.

Would the Mike Van Ryn rule apply here or could he make the jump?

Or would the Rangers have even held onto his rights? (50 player protected list). If he’s not on our protected list, could he or anyone in his situation be signed as a FA?

Say the Rangers move Ando and an OA. Could he be brought in to fill the void left by Ando on D?

I'm personally unsure, but at what age was Jeff Szwez brought into the line-up back at the early part of this century?

 

[Jives]

I think we’ll see LaBrash scratched before Hlacar.

Grisolia is a premiere PKer I think. I like him better than Mercer. Ellis is listed as a center. Does he make Mercer expendable?

Vermeulen is a step behind I think. But there’s a reason he’s used ahead of Bottineau on the 2nd PP unit and top six when there’s an injury.

I think you still stick to the plan attempt to move high end graduating players. But some evaluation has to be going on among the 07’s. Will Ellis make Arquette expendable for example.

I think it’s too early to judge / trade any of the 2007s. You never know the development curve of a player. Who would have thought at 17 years old Sop does what he did or Xhejak turns into a beast on D or Yantsis (17 yr 3 goals / 19 yr 50 goals)? The list goes on and on of players greatly improving in 2 years in this league. To me there is zero risk in trading the OAs and Mercer on F. Ellis takes Mercer spot. Pridham takes an OA spot. Headrick / Antsis takes a spot on the 3rd line and you have a good fight for the last top 6F (Romano, Pridham, Lam, Stark and Ellinas top 5) between all the remaining Fs. Maybe Arquette takes it, maybe Antsis shocks and grabs it or maybe a little older player in Gris or Verm take the spot just to have a little more vet presence in the top 6F. I’d hate to trade Arquette and he turns into a 30G / 30A guy when he is 19 and that’s the player we need to go get. Trading players that won’t be back is zero risk and also the young players to fight for ice (but get ice).

 

[Rangers True Blue]

I have to believe that Valentini will be next on the list. His current team is dismal at best, he usually gets 3rd line minutes, and his plus/minus is in the negative zone. If university was the key reason that he and his family chose to go play in the USA, the new ruling has changed all that. There are more positive reasons to play in Kitchener than where he is now.

 

[ohloutsider]

Will the Hlacar experiment last the full year?
I think one of Vermeulan/Grisolia will be released.
Can a player be traded twice in a season or is there a timeframe between trades? Can’t remember the rule

Players can and have been traded more than once in the same year. Just can’t be traded back to the same team they came from for 13 months.

 

[SFC]

Great. Stay here then. We've had enough of your drivel on the LK board.

We could maybe take him back in a Parsons+Andonovski deal but you're going to have to pay the Midwest intra-divisional premium (I'm talking McKegg or Gemel Smith prices).

According to the OHL draft pick database which goes back to the 15-16 season, except for the Covid year, every year there has been a flurry of deals in the month of November. League wide. Many of the blockbuster variety.

This year? One deal on November 1st. (Molnar to Sudbury).

That’s the CHL / NCAA rule change effect. Everyone is waiting to see….

Glad that the trade history in the database is useful for folks. Someone actually sent me a list of OHL trades going back to the early 00's but I never added it as I couldn't verify them. (I do think they're mostly accurate.) I can try to dig them up for you if you're interested.

Quick question.

I know players cannot make the jump from the NCAA to the CHL to play their OA season (Mike Van Ryn rule). But can players who are committed to the NCAA, but aren’t yet playing there, make the jump to play their OA season?

Former Ranger draft pick D-Tucker Shedd, an 04, is currently playing in the BCHL. He’s committed to start at Michigan State next year. He has decent numbers this year as a D.

Would the Mike Van Ryn rule apply here or could he make the jump?

Or would the Rangers have even held onto his rights? (50 player protected list). If he’s not on our protected list, could he or anyone in his situation be signed as a FA?

Say the Rangers move Ando and an OA. Could he be brought in to fill the void left by Ando on D?

I've heard about the Mike Van Ryn rule as well, but then Lucas Edmonds showed up for Kingston to play his OA year in 2021-22 (had a monster season, too). I'm not sure how that squares (some kind of post-covid exception?).

 

[EvenSteven]

I'm personally unsure, but at what age was Jeff Szwez brought into the line-up back at the early part of this century?

He was brought in to play his OA year in Kitchener. That was his only OHL year. That means it should be OK to bring a player like Tucker Shedd into the league this year.

That would make sense because the reason for the Van Ryn rule to begin with, was that he jumped from the NCAA, to the OHL to shirk his NCAA status. He was drafted by New Jersey out of the NCAA and they were to hold his rights for four years. By jumping to the OHL, he became an OHL grad. So he became a free agent at the end of that season and called his shot. He signed as free agent with St. Louis.

Like Tucker Shedd and Jeff Szwez, etc, being undrafted, would likely fall outside of that Van Ryn rule.

 

[EvenSteven]

I think it’s too early to judge / trade any of the 2007s. You never know the development curve of a player. Who would have thought at 17 years old Sop does what he did or Xhejak turns into a beast on D or Yantsis (17 yr 3 goals / 19 yr 50 goals)? The list goes on and on of players greatly improving in 2 years in this league. To me there is zero risk in trading the OAs and Mercer on F. Ellis takes Mercer spot. Pridham takes an OA spot. Headrick / Antsis takes a spot on the 3rd line and you have a good fight for the last top 6F (Romano, Pridham, Lam, Stark and Ellinas top 5) between all the remaining Fs. Maybe Arquette takes it, maybe Antsis shocks and grabs it or maybe a little older player in Gris or Verm take the spot just to have a little more vet presence in the top 6F. I’d hate to trade Arquette and he turns into a 30G / 30A guy when he is 19 and that’s the player we need to go get. Trading players that won’t be back is zero risk and also the young players to fight for ice (but get ice).

If MM decides to pare down the roster, not only by trading a couple vets but by trading younger players who they deem excess right now, there is a plus to that player, say it’s Arquette, going to another team and becoming a 30-30 player.

It will help solidify the fact that the Rangers do draft quality players in late rounds, and if they hit the trade market, it’s worth it to give up assets to trade for such players.

If we trade away an Arquette because he is an excess player, and he crashes and burns, the next Arquette that comes along in Kitchener, might not be a tradeable asset.

London has accomplished that over the years. There are players that they’ve traded away for value, and we shook our heads, wondering why teams traded for such players, only for those players have success on other teams.

 

[Gondrex]

I think it’s too early to judge / trade any of the 2007s. You never know the development curve of a player. Who would have thought at 17 years old Sop does what he did or Xhejak turns into a beast on D or Yantsis (17 yr 3 goals / 19 yr 50 goals)? The list goes on and on of players greatly improving in 2 years in this league. To me there is zero risk in trading the OAs and Mercer on F. Ellis takes Mercer spot. Pridham takes an OA spot. Headrick / Antsis takes a spot on the 3rd line and you have a good fight for the last top 6F (Romano, Pridham, Lam, Stark and Ellinas top 5) between all the remaining Fs. Maybe Arquette takes it, maybe Antsis shocks and grabs it or maybe a little older player in Gris or Verm take the spot just to have a little more vet presence in the top 6F. I’d hate to trade Arquette and he turns into a 30G / 30A guy when he is 19 and that’s the player we need to go get. Trading players that won’t be back is zero risk and also the young players to fight for ice (but get ice).

Good post, and there are different ways of looking at this. I think there are at least two things to look at from the other angle:

1. We may want to be careful about having too many young-ish players on this team (i.e. trading away the four vets that are frequently mentioned). For instance, take a look at Peterborough's current record despite having a number of 1st round '07's in their line-up. Another example...... I took in a Guelph vs Brampton game last month - a game that the Storm were down a number of players so as a result, had to ice extra rookies. A 10-1 loss. It wasn't pretty, and very hard to watch. Now, I'm sure there is a case to be made that these could be apples / oranges comparisons, but just something to think about. Besides, even if MM trades one or both OA's, there is a chance that one or two OA's come back in return.

2. MM may decide he doesn't want to part with any of his older players, despite what the majority of us think. If there's one thing I've learned from the past two seasons is to expect the unexpected from our GM. However, if he becomes a buyer for a 3rd season in a row, while many of thought he would sell, questions would start coming up in my head at least. It would remind me a lot of another GM / coach who had no problem spending high-end picks, but was seemingly reluctant to sell. (We all remember the "it wouldn't be fair to the fans to trade him" narrative a number of years ago). Is that truly what he meant, or was it more of a case of being self-serving ? I want to stop short of passing judgement, but IMO the optics are questionable in the eyes of what I would call the passionate fans. Perhaps that decision was genuinely made in order to continue drawing the passive Ranger fan / family. Who knows.

I won't make an argument one way or the other on what to do or not to do with the "07 logjam, but just pointing out a couple of viewpoints. There are others, and like I said before, MM will likely do something that I completely didn't expect. I'm just hoping that something - whatever it is - doesn't up-end the potentially good looking future.