Player Discussion Kirby Dach: Welcome to Montreal part 2

[ahmedou]

I’m not an @ahmedou or @KevSkillz4 type who does a dayly round of positivity making sure all the boys get equal love type I admit

@SBah the positivity GOAT!

@SBah the enthusiast GOAT!

 

[Andrei79]

Did he do this at the NHL level before injury? I don't remember this as something he did before.

He wasn't physical as he's been since being traded here. He was legitimately developing a mean streak before the injury. There were some scouting reports saying that Zegras was the one who didn't shy away from altercations and physical play while Dach was a bit soft. Man did that age poorly.

 

[Sorinth]

7 in 9 with six goals. That’s great production and you can throw in a game winning shootout goal to boot.

The weird thing here is that he’s always been a playmaker. The way he’s driving to the net now is awesome.

Hopefully it’s not just a streak. The fact that he’s been steadily improving before the production popped is a good sign.

I would expect the assists to come with time, Laine hasn't really produced outside his one-timer in that one spot, Newhook has been snake bit but is getting quality chances. Both guys will start scoring more 5 on 5 and more goals from your linemates means more assists for everyone, which will help Newhook out a lot as well.

As for Dach's goals, he's obviously not going to continue at a 55 goal pace, but if he continues to improve his skating, it's still not back to his pre-injurt stride, and drives the net he'll be productive regardless of the goal vs assist split. And importantly for us that style of play brings diversity to our offence.

 

[sampollock]

good for 77 keep it going

 

[417]

Dach is back to making plays around the net, that's where he's going to be most successful because he just doesn't have the shot to score from the perimeter.

But his reach in tight is as good as anyone on this team.

 

[CHwest]

Any updates on where he is injury wise?

 

[morhilane]

Any updates on where he is injury wise?

Rehabing. He haven't started to skate before the season was over, but he was doing bicycle (since he was on one to watch Demidov's first practice).

 

[CzarDemidov]

Was called out by Gorton and Hughes for coming into the past season in sub-optimal condition.

Gorton said he has a spot on the roster but his role [in the top6 or not] will be up to him -- it's basically a clear statement that they're not planning with him in the top6. It's the final year of Dach's contract and he's got the tools and size to play a good middle6 game at RW if his rehab goes well and he enters the season in good condition.

Assuming he stays a Hab and has a decent season, since he will likely get PP2 time and no PK responsibilities, I think he can pace for a 40pt season which is good for a big middle6 RW.

The questions are (1) if the Habs will rely on him to stay healthy (I think yes), (2) if the Habs will commit to him long term since he is a pending RFA, and (3) if he'll want to stay at middle6 salary or if he'll still try to break into top6 territory. Maybe the Habs punt and qualify him at just under 4m for a one year extension.

It sucks that he can't be pencilled in the top6 but not everything works out optimally.

 

[Dagistitsyn]

Was called out by Gorton and Hughes for coming into the past season in sub-optimal condition.

Gorton said he has a spot on the roster but his role [in the top6 or not] will be up to him -- it's basically a clear statement that they're not planning with him in the top6. It's the final year of Dach's contract and he's got the tools and size to play a good middle6 game at RW if his rehab goes well and he enters the season in good condition.

Assuming he stays a Hab and has a decent season, since he will likely get PP2 time and no PK responsibilities, I think he can pace for a 40pt season which is good for a big middle6 RW.

The questions are (1) if the Habs will rely on him to stay healthy (I think yes), (2) if the Habs will commit to him long term since he is a pending RFA, and (3) if he'll want to stay at middle6 salary or if he'll still try to break into top6 territory. Maybe the Habs punt and qualify him at just under 4m for a one year extension.

It sucks that he can't be pencilled in the top6 but not everything works out optimally.

Keep in mind that even if a miracle happens and he stays healthy, he will likely be playing with Newhook. I wish Dach the best of luck but between that and coming back from the same injury that already shattered his confidence the first time around, my expectations are rock bottom now.

No one has been able to produce with, or get Newhook to produce well. Even Suzuki was only able to get 1 point (goal) out of Newhook with 122 even strength minutes with him on the line in the first half of the season this year. Dach has his work cut out for him.

 

[Naslundforever]

I remember writing here he looked done way before his latest injury and getting angry replies. Good to hear Hughes say everyone could see he did not have his legs.

Hoping he does the work this year sounds like no more hand outs (3-4th line wing and/or, ahl is where you rehab, not 2c, that’s on the org). It’s up to him to take a spot. Let’s hope he actually does, size and talent are both a premium..

 

[Habs Halifax]

Contract year for Dach. This is the season where the real Dach shows up IMO. If he continues to struggle to show momentum and improvement, he's going to be on the Galchenyuk train.

Contract year for both Dach and Laine. This is a good thing IMO

 

[CzarDemidov]

I remember writing here he looked done way before his latest injury and getting angry replies. Good to hear Hughes say everyone could see he did not have his legs.

Hoping he does the work this year sounds like no more hand outs (3-4th line wing and/or, ahl is where you rehab, not 2c, that’s on the org). It’s up to him to take a spot. Let’s hope he actually does, size and talent are both a premium..

The Kirby Dach Defence Force was suddenly not so equivocal when it came to venemously criticizing Laine

Laine production this year was Dach’s best ever season. Dach has been incredibly underwhelming so far, in no small part due to his unavailability and devastating injuries but his rehab and conditioning was sub-optimal.

 

[WeThreeKings]

I remember writing here he looked done way before his latest injury and getting angry replies. Good to hear Hughes say everyone could see he did not have his legs.

Hoping he does the work this year sounds like no more hand outs (3-4th line wing and/or, ahl is where you rehab, not 2c, that’s on the org). It’s up to him to take a spot. Let’s hope he actually does, size and talent are both a premium..

There was some acknowledgement of this on his part during the year, so hopefully when he can train, he goes at it as hard as he can. But we all know that Hughes/Gorton aren't relying on him for anything anymore. It's up to Dach to stake his claim and if he can't, then it's unfortunate because it looked very good in the first year and the start of year 2. Though, if he hadn't got injured in year 2, we don't have Demidov.. so it's a bit of a catch-22 there.

 

[Goalfield13]

Dach can start as the 4RW and work his way up. The Suzuki special.

 

[Habs]

I’m not an @ahmedou or @KevSkillz4 type who does a dayly round of positivity making sure all the boys get equal love type I admit , but I am def not a « hater » of any player myself. No I hated Petry after he did not stand up for his goalie.

Things are looking up in any case, this is fun.

Imagine running to make threads like your life depended on it on this forum like one of the guys above you mentioned lol. Every new prospect, draft pick... run to the forum and make a thread.. lol

 

[dackelljuneaubulis02]

Think HuGo also called out Slaf’s conditioning too which is a good thing.

Only a week or two ago I was saying with someone that whatever Slaf’s doing offseason wise isn’t quite cutting it.

Hopefully both him and Dach (and Laine I suspect) really put in the effort.

What I don’t understand is how this is allowed to happen. Like ever. I couldn’t even understand it 15 years ago. Certainly not now.

 

[Leon Lucius Black]

They should use Paul Byron as an example for Newhook and Joel Armia as an example for Dach. Not saying they can't improve their offensive games as they are still young, but they need to work on other things to make them more effective if they want to be part of this team long-term. In addition they should put both guys on the wing and keep them there until they show massive improvements whether one might be able to play centre.

Both Byron/Armia were offensive guys to start their careers but changed their games which allowed them to stay in the NHL. Newhook/Dach haven't been good enough offensively and their defensive game is nowhere near good enough for the point totals they put up this past year.

Newhook should work with Byron on finding ways to use his speed to be more effective defensively and on the PK. They should show Dach video of how Armia uses his size and stick to be effective without the puck.

 

[sbhatt]

Dach is a 3rd line spare part at best at this point. Counting on him for more than that is a recipe for disaster.

 

[Sorinth]

They should use Paul Byron as an example for Newhook and Joel Armia as an example for Dach. Not saying they can't improve their offensive games as they are still young, but they need to work on other things to make them more effective if they want to be part of this team long-term. In addition they should put both guys on the wing and keep them there until they show massive improvements whether one might be able to play centre.

Both Byron/Armia were offensive guys to start their careers but changed their games which allowed them to stay in the NHL. Newhook/Dach haven't been good enough offensively and their defensive game is nowhere near good enough for the point totals they put up this past year.

Newhook should work with Byron on finding ways to use his speed to be more effective defensively and on the PK. They should show Dach video of how Armia uses his size and stick to be effective without the puck.

It's fairly common for young guys who were offensive stars before the NHL to have to adapt and become more defensive minded.

For Newhook it already started this year, and I would expect it to continue and yeah if he can become a decent PK option that would help his career immensely whether that's with us or some other team.

For Dach I wouldn't write off his offence game quite so quick. His defensive game certainly needs work but that can be mitigated somewhat by him moving to wing, where he's also had a lot of success offensively. The goal for him should be to get his skating back to where it was, and continue to build on his physical play. I saw quite a few battles in front of the net where he did really well, and that's the type of thing the team could really use more of.

 

[le_sean]

It's fairly common for young guys who were offensive stars before the NHL to have to adapt and become more defensive minded.

For Newhook it already started this year, and I would expect it to continue and yeah if he can become a decent PK option that would help his career immensely whether that's with us or some other team.

For Dach I wouldn't write off his offence game quite so quick. His defensive game certainly needs work but that can be mitigated somewhat by him moving to wing, where he's also had a lot of success offensively. The goal for him should be to get his skating back to where it was, and continue to build on his physical play. I saw quite a few battles in front of the net where he did really well, and that's the type of thing the team could really use more of.

I get where you’re coming from but I find in Dach’s case that it will be unlikely he makes the switch to becoming a physical player because of his injury history. It’s always going to be looming in the back of his head. But yeah, his best bet to become a longtime NHLer would be to start using his body and becoming better defensively.

 

[Sorinth]

I get where you’re coming from but I find in Dach’s case that it will be unlikely he makes the switch to becoming a physical player because of his injury history. It’s always going to be looming in the back of his head. But yeah, his best bet to become a longtime NHLer would be to start using his body and becoming better defensively.

Like I said I saw him using his body effectively just last season, so I don't think it's really a "switch" he has to make or that he's going to be scared about engaging.

EDIT: He even got into a fight in October which also shows he's not really afraid of getting hurt again.

 

[le_sean]

Like I said I saw him using his body effectively just last season, so I don't think it's really a "switch" he has to make or that he's going to be scared about engaging.

EDIT: He even got into a fight in October which also shows he's not really afraid of getting hurt again.

It was too few and far in between. His physicality was not something we saw every game. And this is yet another injury from a big nothing. I don’t see how this doesn’t affect him mentally.

 

[morhilane]

Think HuGo also called out Slaf’s conditioning too which is a good thing.

Only a week or two ago I was saying with someone that whatever Slaf’s doing offseason wise isn’t quite cutting it.

Hopefully both him and Dach (and Laine I suspect) really put in the effort.

What I don’t understand is how this is allowed to happen. Like ever. I couldn’t even understand it 15 years ago. Certainly not now.

It was evident at season start that his conditioning wasn't as good as at the start of season 2, but the report were that he trained like a beast in the off-season. Sometimes it's not how much, but what you trained that make the difference.

Dach mentioned mid-season that he didn't train the right thing too.

 

[Sorinth]

It was too few and far in between. His physicality was not something we saw every game. And this is yet another injury from a big nothing. I don’t see how this doesn’t affect him mentally.

Not that it's a good measure of the physicality that I'm talking about which is more board/net front battles, but looking at hits Dach was at 2.96 per 60 minutes in 2022-2023 and was at 6.71 last year. Now I think there was an adjustment between then in terms of how they counted hits but it was something around a 25% boost to the number of hits counted.

Dach was more physical, if he comes back healthy I expect to see it as a big part of his game. But that's the real question mark, will he be healthy and skating the way he can.

 

[dackelljuneaubulis02]

It was evident at season start that his conditioning wasn't as good as at the start of season 2, but the report were that he trained like a beast in the off-season. Sometimes it's not how much, but what you trained that make the difference.

Dach mentioned mid-season that he didn't train the right thing too.

Yeah I don’t think Slaf was horribly out of shape but he definitely didn’t look improved imo at least. Especially for all the talk of his fitness like you said.

Rooting really hard for these 2 and Laine. I mean Slaf isn’t in the same situation as the other two but really want to see him transformed