Kingston Frontenacs 2023-24 Off-Season Thread (Part 4)

[dirty12]

What are his issues at centre? Is he not good at taking face offs or is it something else. The Petes need a player that can play centre they do not need another left winger.

Frasca did not effectively defend the middle as well as Ludwinski, McNamara, Poole, and Hopkins. Three of them could not defend their position and produce offence equal to the top six of better teams.
If you want to be competitive, a dominant centre is needed when 5 of the top 6 wingers are 17-18. That imo is a big reason why Kingston brought in Dubois.

 

[frontsfan67]

https://x.com/i/web/status/1819028200007110828

Death, taxes and London cheating other teams out of players. Would be nice if the fronts picked this guy rather than malholtra

 

[OHL4Life]

https://x.com/i/web/status/1819028200007110828

Death, taxes and London cheating other teams out of players. Would be nice if the fronts picked this guy rather than malholtra

there were better players on the board then him, hyped as a top 3/5 pick he was not in the mix at all and because of that, he started to pout and played the school card as why he was dropping, not that his game wasnt very good this year.

 

[frontsfan67]

https://x.com/i/web/status/1819028200007110828

there were better players on the board then him, hyped as a top 3/5 pick he was not in the mix at all and because of that, he started to pout and played the school card as why he was dropping, not that his game wasnt very good this year.

Yikes

Would he have went around where McLean did if not for the whining?

 

[OHL4Life]

Yikes

Would he have went around where McLean did if not for the whining?

don’t think so but it only takes 1 team

 

[Petes1987]

Yikes

Would he have went around where McLean did if not for the whining?

This is why the OHL needs to change the rules that players who indicate they are not going to play in the OHL are deemed not eligible for the regular OHL Draft. There should be a supplemental draft we’re teams can draft these players. Doing this will allow the lower place teams to draft these players without waisting their 1st round pick on a player that may not report.

 

[frontsfan67]

This is why the OHL needs to change the rules that players who indicate they are not going to play in the OHL are deemed not eligible for the regular OHL Draft. There should be a supplemental draft we’re teams can draft these players. Doing this will allow the lower place teams to draft these players without waisting their 1st round pick on a player that may not report.

Would be nice if something like this was implemented but they don’t seem to care much about smaller market teams. Won’t ever happen as they love their Londons and kitcheners

 

[sbpointer]

Would you guys rather these players not play in the OHL at all?
They are kids who are making pretty big forward looking decisions. The reality is not every program is equal and some kids are going to advocate for themselves to put themselves in the best possible position..

 

[LDN]

Do you think Miedema could be on the move this year?

 

[frontsfan67]

Would you guys rather these players not play in the OHL at all?
They are kids who are making pretty big forward looking decisions. The reality is not every program is equal and some kids are going to advocate for themselves to put themselves in the best possible position..

How is that good for the league though? Was never like this 15 years ago. When domi said no to kingston it’s just spiralled from there and now it happens every year.

We know how it’s good for teams like London who are good every year specifically because every year something like this happens and London is involved but how is it good for the rest of the teams?

You ever wondered why London is always a top team? Yes there is the hunters- they’re great but without them do you think you guys get steals every year because people like max domi, Sam Dickinson, Isaiah George, Easton Cowan, Oliver bonk etc don’t want to go to smaller market teams.

 

[LDN]

How is that good for the league though? Was never like this 15 years ago. When domi said no to kingston it’s just spiralled from there and now it happens every year.

We know how it’s good for teams like London who are good every year specifically because every year something like this happens and London is involved but how is it good for the rest of the teams?

You ever wondered why London is always a top team? Yes there is the hunters- they’re great but without them do you think you guys get steals every year because people like max domi, Sam Dickinson, Isaiah George, Easton Cowan, Oliver bonk etc don’t want to go to smaller market teams.

I think Barkey, Cowan and Bonk were all just simply drafted. No raft manipulation. Just good scouting

 

[frontsfan67]

Do you think Miedema could be on the move this year?

I think if he struggles at the start with consistency it’s a possibility they’ll look at trading him but not before the season starts- they already are actively looking to trade frasca apparently.

I think Barkey, Cowan and Bonk were all just simply drafted. No raft manipulation. Just good scouting

I’m only going off of certain things OHL4Life has said- I wasn’t on here then and didn’t care about it then- just repeating whatever he says cause he seems to know some stuff.

 

[LDN]

I think if he struggles at the start with consistency it’s a possibility they’ll look at trading him but not before the season starts- they already are actively looking to trade frasca apparently.

Why Frasca? That’s odd… he seems to fit your timeline?

 

[frontsfan67]

Why Frasca? That’s odd… he seems to fit your timeline?

Yeah I agree but from multiple people on here he has a bad attitude and was pissed off when they got Dubois.
Sucks they have to let go of him as I think he’s going to break out this year but per multiple people on here- they think he will not report to training camp if not traded before then.

 

[sbpointer]

How is that good for the league though? Was never like this 15 years ago. When domi said no to kingston it’s just spiralled from there and now it happens every year.

We know how it’s good for teams like London who are good every year specifically because every year something like this happens and London is involved but how is it good for the rest of the teams?

You ever wondered why London is always a top team? Yes there is the hunters- they’re great but without them do you think you guys get steals every year because people like max domi, Sam Dickinson, Isaiah George, Easton Cowan, Oliver bonk etc don’t want to go to smaller market teams.

I get what you are saying here my point was there are a LOT more credible options for these players now then 15 years ago and any rule that would restrict their ability to play for a program they prefer ( this happens for any number of reasons and not always to the advantage of the London/Kitchener of the world ) that will only result in more players choosing to play somewhere other then the OHL causing the entire product to suffer. It isn't a path to parity for the smaller markets its a path to obscurity for the league..

 

[ScoutLife4]

I do not think the OHL will do to much to jeopardize the revenue coming in from London's 9000 season tickets.

 

[LDN]

I do not think the OHL will do to much to jeopardize the revenue coming in from London's 9000 season tickets.

Not sure what you mean? What would they want to do?

 

[Section5Petes]

I doubt the Petes will trade for Gage Hayes. They already have Jonathan Melee and Ryder MacIntyre who likely will be two of their three overages. Both are better than Heyes. If they do not keep Liam Sztuska as their third overage they will likely trade for an overage defenceman to fill that spot.

Don’t forget OA Chase Lefebvre who Rob Wilson is a BIG fan of

 

[frontsfan67]

I get what you are saying here my point was there are a LOT more credible options for these players now then 15 years ago and any rule that would restrict their ability to play for a program they prefer ( this happens for any number of reasons and not always to the advantage of the London/Kitchener of the world ) that will only result in more players choosing to play somewhere other then the OHL causing the entire product to suffer. It isn't a path to parity for the smaller markets its a path to obscurity for the league..

Yeah that’s a fair point. Just wish the league was more competitive and not the same teams every year stacked and going for it while others have to go through 2 or 3 year rebuilds for 1 or 2 years of good hockey that other teams get every single year. That’s the big reason Kingston doesn’t have a big fan base. They’re good for 1 year and people may hop on the bandwagon and then for 2 or 3 they’re a joke of a team and “fans” don’t want to see a team lose so many have given up on the fronts.

 

[frontsfan67]

Don’t forget OA Chase Lefebvre who Rob Wilson is a BIG fan of

Yeah all 3 of your OA’s are better than heyes- again I was just speaking about a younger team that may trade some OA’s and then struggle the second half the season- one of those teams if they have a poor penalty kill and need a good team guy who may be able to play in their middle 6 (2nd/3rd line) could take a chance on Heyes as he would be very cheap. But even then I’m not super sold that he gets a team. Poole I highly doubt it unless a younger team (again) needs a guy who can play on the penalty kill and is pretty solid on faceoffs. But that’s not very valuable either and he would be in the bottom 6.

 

[frontsfan67]

Not sure what you mean? What would they want to do?

London generates almost 3x the amount of revenue compared to a small market team like Kingston. Even Kitchener does double. Windsor has good fans, Oshawa has good fans, Soo and Guelph have good fans.
Kingston is always one of the bottom teams in the league percentage wise despite having a 5700 seat arena

 

[Petes1987]

Don’t forget OA Chase Lefebvre who Rob Wilson is a BIG fan of

I think he is in the mix as potential overage. The Petes are likely only to keep two overage forwards and third will either be Liam Sztuska or they will obtain an overage defenceman. I would not be surprised if Peterborough trades Jonathan Melee and keeps Chase Lefbevre instead.

 

[beastintheeast]

Yeah that’s a fair point. Just wish the league was more competitive and not the same teams every year stacked and going for it while others have to go through 2 or 3 year rebuilds for 1 or 2 years of good hockey that other teams get every single year. That’s the big reason Kingston doesn’t have a big fan base. They’re good for 1 year and people may hop on the bandwagon and then for 2 or 3 they’re a joke of a team and “fans” don’t want to see a team lose so many have given up on the fronts.

The problem with Kingston has been that for the first year they are good, they blow their brains out and trade everything away for a shot at the M Cup. Then, they get eliminated early and have to rebuild.

The same thing happens with coaches and GMs, unfortunately.

Kingston needs to forget about winning championships or being number 1 this year. As you hav stated teh fans do not care about that. What they need is to develop a team system that is based on drafting the best players tht will show up and have the right attitude. Then develop them. Yes, you can make minor trades, but get rid of the idea that if I trade my first, 2nd and 3rd for 3 years to team X for the top 3 players in the league, we will be great and fill seats for a few more games.


The reason that the Knights are so good has nothing to do with the city or the fans. The reason they are so good year in is the same reason that the 67's under Killer and the Battalion under Bert were so good and were highly sought. It was and is because they have a great system with a great GM and coach; the owners know what they have, and they are strictly involved in player development.
One of the things we are looking at in Ottawa is the difference in the team since Andre took the job in Phoenix.

 

[Petes1987]

The problem with Kingston has been that for the first year they are good, they blow their brains out and trade everything away for a shot at the M Cup. Then, they get eliminated early and have to rebuild.

The same thing happens with coaches and GMs, unfortunately.

Kingston needs to forget about winning championships or being number 1 this year. As you hav stated teh fans do not care about that. What they need is to develop a team system that is based on drafting the best players tht will show up and have the right attitude. Then develop them. Yes, you can make minor trades, but get rid of the idea that if I trade my first, 2nd and 3rd for 3 years to team X for the top 3 players in the league, we will be great and fill seats for a few more games.


The reason that the Knights are so good has nothing to do with the city or the fans. The reason they are so good year in is the same reason that the 67's under Killer and the Battalion under Bert were so good and were highly sought. It was and is because they have a great system with a great GM and coach; the owners know what they have, and they are strictly involved in player development.
One of the things we are looking at in Ottawa is the difference in the team since Andre took the job in Phoenix.

I think the Peterborough Petes were in the same category when Dick Todd was Coach and GM. In fact he had more success than Brian Kilrea and Bert Templeton had in the years that he was in charge of the Petes. His success was good drafting, developing players and his systems.

 

[OMG67]

The problem with Kingston has been that for the first year they are good, they blow their brains out and trade everything away for a shot at the M Cup. Then, they get eliminated early and have to rebuild.

The same thing happens with coaches and GMs, unfortunately.

Kingston needs to forget about winning championships or being number 1 this year. As you hav stated teh fans do not care about that. What they need is to develop a team system that is based on drafting the best players tht will show up and have the right attitude. Then develop them. Yes, you can make minor trades, but get rid of the idea that if I trade my first, 2nd and 3rd for 3 years to team X for the top 3 players in the league, we will be great and fill seats for a few more games.


The reason that the Knights are so good has nothing to do with the city or the fans. The reason they are so good year in is the same reason that the 67's under Killer and the Battalion under Bert were so good and were highly sought. It was and is because they have a great system with a great GM and coach; the owners know what they have, and they are strictly involved in player development.
One of the things we are looking at in Ottawa is the difference in the team since Andre took the job in Phoenix.

The league operated much different in the prime Kilrea/Templeton years. We didn’t see massive trades nearly as often. Teams weren’t loading up at the deadline. The landscape of the league has changed dramatically. We now have 20 teams instead of only 15. There wasn’t a massive deviation from the mean with respect to attendance like there is now. Revenues were relatively even by comparison. There are more viable options for players than there ever has been.

Virtually nothing is truly the same as it was. You cannot draw historical comparisons. Teams have to operate in the now.

The best way to be a great organization is to invest heavily in the best people supporting your organization. Hire the best coaches and hockey people you can find. Like any other business, you need to invest in it in the early stages and let it reap the rewards as it matures. Too many new’ish owners operate within a budget that doesn’t allow them to lose money. They need to at least break even. As most businesses do, they look at areas where they can cut costs. ALOT of times it is the player development side.

These teams need long term stability. The teams with the best results are usually the teams with the best long term stability and they are supported by owners that understand you need to reinvest in your organization to maintain that stability.