Value of: Justin Barron to Pittsburgh

[Empoleon8771]

What would the cost be here? With Karlsson almost assuredly being traded next off-season for futures, the Penguins should be looking for opportunities to acquire a young RD or two to build up on their 3rd pair and plan on taking over 2nd pair duties next year. Barron seems like a nice jack of all trades type of defenseman that could have a solid middle pair D upside.

Montreal is very deep in picks so I'm not sure that picks would be interesting for them, but would some sort of prospect for prospect swap make sense?

Click to read more...

 

[TT1]

i dunno about Pitts prospect pool but we need size and good 2 way/defensive play for middle 6/bottom 6

 

[SEALBound]

i dunno about Pitts prospect pool but we need size and good 2 way/defensive play for middle 6/bottom 6

Puljujarvi and a pick would make sense.

 

[Nakawick]

i dunno about Pitts prospect pool but we need size and good 2 way/defensive play for middle 6/bottom 6

Sam Poulin could use a fresh start.

 

[TT1]

ironically the type of player we need for Barron is Lehkonen-like , sigh

i dunno if you guys are familiar with Emil Heineman on our team but a similar player to him

 

[malcb33]

A reasonable target from the OP, good job!

Montreal's young players/ prospect pool is probably shallowest at RHD and C. Being that Barron is RHD, it would make the most sense from Montreals PoV that the player coming back would be a RHD or C. Unless, of course, the player is viewed as a homerun by Habs management.

 

[Gaylord Q Tinkledink]

Done.

Didn't read the thread, but done.

 

[Empoleon8771]

i dunno about Pitts prospect pool but we need size and good 2 way/defensive play for middle 6/bottom 6

Would Ponomarev for Barron be a reasonable base? Ponomarev projects to be a 2-way bottom-6 center.

I figure the Penguins would have to add a bit but I think the basis could make sense.

 

[japhi27returns]

Habs don’t need C depth, behind Suzuki we have Dach, Evans and Beck with Hage farther out. Newhook can play C as well.

We could use a true top 6C but not getting that for Barron.

I wouldn’t move him, better of hoping he pans out, his value doesn’t return anything we couldn’t get for one of our dozens of mid round picks.

 

[JadedRandom]

Would Ponomarev for Barron be a reasonable base? Ponomarev projects to be a 2-way bottom-6 center.

I figure the Penguins would have to add a bit but I think the basis could make sense.

I quite like Ponomarev, but he would only have limited attractiveness as a trade target for us given that Emil Heineman has started to establish himself as a good bottom-sixer, that we already have Owen Beck and Oliver Kapanen that track well to be good middle-six centers, and that we also have Luke Tuch and Jared Davidson showing extremely well in the AHL as potential 3rd/4th liners.

So yeah, at the end of the day I don't think there would be a trade to be made here unless the Pittsburgh GM would be willing to part with some picks/prospects that would probably be considered overpays for Barron given the current state of his level of play.

At this point Justin Barron's still-untapped potential might hold more value to the Canadiens than what we could realistically get back in trade.

 

[Bell Centre Hotdog]

Barron
Pezzetta

For

Puljujarvi
Poulin

I think Puljujarvi has a bit of forecheck and grit along with the size I feel the Habs would welcome. He would replace a Armia who is likely gone at the deadline. Poulin would replace Pezzetta who isn’t getting really any chance with the big club to play.

Could be a guy to help add some energy to the Pens. Just he has not been given any chance to play this year for some reason even during stretches of where the team played bad which I personally find odd.

Barron I’m of the mindset he’s never going to be a regular for the Habs. The guy has shown flashes but consistency and decision making is sometimes bad. I think next season he loses out his spot for pushing Reinbacher and Mailloux. The 3rd pairing I expect a rugged veteran guy there leaving not spot for Barron. So I think like OP indicated get useable bodies up front with size to replace guys moving out at the deadline who are both still young. The Habs aren’t really in need of the value of picks that would be involved in a trade for Barron. Crosby has already endorsed the kid and his skill. I could see there being interest here.

 

[sansabri]

problem with trading Barron is we would need a RHD back

 

[biturbo19]

Sam Poulin could use a fresh start.

He'd be an interesting swap. Not sure if he's got quite enough "value" straight across...but we're honestly talking about struggling "change of scenery" type guys anyway. So fiddling around with late round picks or something to balance is almost not worth the time of day.

And at one point at least, Poulin projected as more or less the sort of piece the Habs would probably look for. Good size, gets around alright, at least projects to be able to play a solid responsible Bottom-6 game. Plus, bonus Quebecois.



I'm a little iffy on Barron to the Penguins though. I'm not sure it's a foregone conclusion that Karlsson can be moved in the offseason. I know the want to is probably going to be there, but actually making it work could be tricky, with the sort of season he's having and that shambles that is his defensive play at this point.

So ending up with Letang - Karlsson - Barron down your RHD, seems problematic if they can't move Karlsson. Barron is really more in that same vein, more offensive-minded guy who really needs to be on the Powerplay, if not the Top Unit to likely find his footing in the NHL. In theory, he's got the tools to be more of a two-way guy, but doesn't seem to have the mentality to do so.


But i do think he's a good "buy low" change of scenery candidate. His runway is running out in Montreal, and he's never going to see the top powerplay there with Hutson around, plus others.

 

[malcb33]

Habs don’t need C depth, behind Suzuki we have Dach, Evans and Beck with Hage farther out. Newhook can play C as well.

I disagree here.

Yes, we have Suzuki, but we don't know what Dach is right now after his injury and Evans is UFA. Beck looks good in the AHL and in his D+1 year Hage looks great, but both still have a lot to prove before pencilling them into an NHL line-up. Newhook is a winger that can play C in a pinch.

I think it's dangerous to count on young players and prospects for future NHL roster spots before they've earned it, and I wouldn't mind another C lottery ticket. Worst case scenario is moving a centre to the wing, which is a lot easier to do, than trying to get a winger to play centre.

I do think RHD is the organization's weakest area though.

 

[Empoleon8771]

I'm a little iffy on Barron to the Penguins though. I'm not sure it's a foregone conclusion that Karlsson can be moved in the offseason. I know the want to is probably going to be there, but actually making it work could be tricky, with the sort of season he's having and that shambles that is his defensive play at this point.

I think Karlsson is moveable because the Penguins can retain a huge amount of his AAV while not retaining that much money. After his July 1st signing bonus next off-season, he's only owed $11.5 million in real money and San Jose is retaining $1.5 million of that. The Penguins could eat half of his cap hit while any team acquiring him would only be paying him a $5 million AAV and $2.5 million salary per year. I would be shocked if that wouldn't be movable.

 

[BKarchitect]

Barron has no hockey IQ but his athletic ability will continue to tantalize folks, I guess.

He’s a deep reclamation project at this point. I said a while ago he’d be lucky to have a career similar to Jon Merrill - another guy who back in the day was a high pick with great skating and athletic ability who never put it together fully. That may have been generous.

 

[biturbo19]

I think Karlsson is moveable because the Penguins can retain a huge amount of his AAV while not retaining that much money. After his July 1st signing bonus next off-season, he's only owed $11.5 million in real money and San Jose is retaining $1.5 million of that. The Penguins could eat half of his cap hit while any team acquiring him would only be paying him a $5 million AAV and $2.5 million salary per year. I would be shocked if that wouldn't be movable.

The big question for me in that, is whether the Penguins would actually be willing to eat two more years of $5M in dead cap themselves to make Karlsson palatable in trade. The actual cash being lower probably helps with that, but if the aim is to "retool" quickly as to not waste Sid's remaining good years, dragging around $5M in retention for two of those years hurts.

Though at this point, i suppose maybe that's just a bullet you've gotta bite. What they have isn't working. Freeing up $5M is nice, but even just decent defencemen are creeping up well into that range and good ones well beyond. And even with that retention, i doubt you're getting a significant piece back for Karlsson. More just moving him for the sake of moving him and clearing $5M cap. Becomes a challenge if you're trying to improve while also only freeing up half his cap hit to play with on a replacement.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Barron has no hockey IQ but his athletic ability will continue to tantalize folks, I guess.

He’s a deep reclamation project at this point. I said a while ago he’d be lucky to have a career similar to Jon Merrill - another guy who back in the day was a high pick with great skating and athletic ability who never put it together fully. That may have been generous.

To be fair, this sounds a lot like Letang to me. I think him playing behind and learning from Letang could definitely help him with that.

I think his value is likely around only a 3rd, but the Penguins have nothing on RD beyond Brunicke who will likely spend another year in juniors. The Penguins need to gamble more on these young players just to see if they can get some sort of upside out of him. Same exact thing they did with Tomasino (and probably Hoglander sometime soon), but they need to gamble on a RD with that.

 

[JadedRandom]

To be fair, this sounds a lot like Letang to me. I think him playing behind and learning from Letang could definitely help him with that.

I think his value is likely around only a 3rd, but the Penguins have nothing on RD beyond Brunicke who will likely spend another year in juniors. The Penguins need to gamble more on these young players just to see if they can get some sort of upside out of him.

For that the Canadiens wouldn't move him at all, as I've said earlier.

They don't need mid-round picks, they've already got 7 picks between the second and fourth rounds this year and likely more by the end of the year depending on other teams' interest in the likes of Savard, Evans, Matheson, and perhaps Armia at the deadline.

The sort of trade Montreal would like to make would be picks/prospects + Barron as a warm body with potential in a trade for a veteran RD that somewhat fits with the core's age.

If a guy like Connor Murphy was a bit younger, as an example, that would be the kind of guy the Canadiens' management would likely try and acquire.

But let's face it, those kinds of trade targets don't come along often, and GMs who have those RDs usually just don't trade them.

 

[Empoleon8771]

For that the Canadiens wouldn't move him at all, as I've said earlier.

They don't need mid-round picks, they've already got 7 picks between the second and fourth rounds this year and likely more by the end of the year depending on other teams' interest in the likes of Savard, Evans, Matheson, and perhaps Armia at the deadline.

The sort of trade Montreal would like to make would be picks/prospects + Barron as a warm body with potential in a trade for a veteran RD that somewhat fits with the core's age.

If a guy like Connor Murphy was a bit younger, as an example, that would be the kind of guy the Canadiens' management would likely try and acquire.

But let's face it, those kinds of trade targets don't come along often, and GMs who have those RDs usually just don't trade them.

Yeah I was just saying that was his value, not that the Habs would move him for that. They have an abundance of picks, which is why I don't think they'd just move him for a 3rd.

 

[therocket9]

The Barron brothers do workout with Sid in the summer in Halifax....so i guess there is a fit.

 

[TGWL]

Has Barron shown top 4 in his future, yet? I've only seen him play a view times this season and maybe 10 or so games from last season, but nothing has led me to believe that he is going to be a top 4 replacement. Unless you meant for the 3rd pair with your current 3rd pair moving up.

​

 

[CTHabsfan]

Justin Barron has decent size, skates well, has a good shot, but needs to work on his defensive game. Unless the Canadiens receive an offer that's too good to be true (and I don't know why they would), I'd keep Barron rather than giving up on him too soon. He's under contract through next season at a low salary, he's a RHD, and David Savard will be traded at some point.

 

[vokiel]

Puljujarvi and a pick would make sense.

No thanks. I'd give a 6th rounder in 2026 with Justin if you cede San jose's 3rd in 2026 + a warm body to equal contracts? Aho?

 

[SEALBound]

No thanks. I'd give a 6th rounder in 2026 with Justin if you cede San jose's 3rd in 2026 + a warm body to equal contracts? Aho?

Nah, I'd maybe consider a 4th or 5th or at the very most, the highest of the 3rds if there's a 4th coming back.

I don't think Barron for a 3rd fits with what we should be doing.