Player Discussion Juraj Slafkovsky Discussion

[TomKosto]

That makes you the arbitrator of takes and their motivation.. Layers to undo there.. Not fun for others, and you carry quite a load on your shoulders.

Always him can be right. Even when Slaf says something that he doesnt like himself, he says "Slaf need to talk less", if it doesn't fit his narrative.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

It seems to be the other way around. You always challenge someone when they are critizing and "it's getting boring " if we dont agree with you. You kinda are the ultimate homer habs fans, and it's okay we need some. We are winning multiples cups in the next few years according to you. W e need some fans like you to compensate the ultra negative one, but not everyone has to be a blind fan. Don't worry bud, I'm not going anywhere

1. “Ultimate Habs homer”… man, you have absolutely no idea what you’re talking about. For about 15 years I was the most negative poster on these boards.

2. I’m like any poster. I can challenge you if I think you’re wrong. Again, if you don’t like it, a message board isn’t for you. And it’s ironic that you’re sitting here talking about how you “can’t” criticize Slafkovsky and then turn around and try to silence me by saying it’s “boring” when you’re challenged.

Buddy… too bad. Post something and you’ll get challenged by other posters. That’s how it works.

3. I believe we have one of the best collections of young talent in the league. Not afraid to say so or be wrong. Just like I wasn’t afraid to say we sucked years ago.

4. Slaf’s putting up 50 points a year and is just breaking into the league. Yeah, I’m excited about him as a player. He’s really good. You don’t need to be a ‘homer’ to see this.

 

[dackelljuneaubulis02]

Yep. He does little stuff like this just about all the time I watched him. Especially when people were screaming he was a bum or low IQ.

To get such a detailed game from a massive sized talent at such a young age especially in a big game should have people doing somersaults about him. And it’s not like these details haven’t been here since early in his second season. They just seem a bit more refined this game and more consistently displayed.

Criticize him by all means but when you criticize while ignoring the finer details of his game then you’re criticisms seem hollow.

 

[KevSkillz4]

The best news about his progression, it's that we are going to have this beauty signed for only 7,6 millions per year for 8 year.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

That makes you the arbitrator of takes and their motivation.. Layers to undo there.. Not fun for others, and you carry quite a load on your shoulders.

I can comment on what I see just as you can.

 

[TomKosto]

1. “Ultimate Habs homer”… man, you have absolutely no idea what you’re talking about. For about 15 years I was the most negative poster on these boards.

2. I’m like any poster. I can challenge you if I think you’re wrong. Again, if you don’t like it, a message board isn’t for you. And it’s ironic that you’re sitting here talking about how you “can’t” criticize Slafkovsky and then turn around and try to silence me by saying it’s “boring” when you’re challenged.

Buddy… too bad. Post something and you’ll get challenged by other posters. That’s how it works.

3. I believe we have one of the best collections of young talent in the league. Not afraid to say so or be wrong. Just like I wasn’t afraid to say we sucked years ago.

4. Slaf’s putting up 50 points a year and is just breaking into the league. Yeah, I’m excited about him as a player. He’s really good. You don’t need to be a ‘homer’ to see this.

Allright bud, I'll continue to do my thing and so do you. Just hope you wont lashed out again at Slaf if he says what everybody here is saying when he plays bad

He doesnt need to "Talk less"

 

[dackelljuneaubulis02]

Proud of him,need to be himself and it's awsome for us. Glad we draft him #1 instead of Bo Callahan. Hughes said in an interview, he drafted not the best player right now but the one who will become the best player in the draft. He's better than mckinnon/rantanen/tkachuk in the same age. He look like a real gamer,that guy will be a monster in 2-3 years

If you factor just about all the oversized young stars now I think only Rantanen’s out produced him. Don’t quote me on that but I think Rantanen had his break out year the same age as Slaf is now.

For a project, he’s somewhat ahead of schedule imo

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

Allright bud, I'll continue to do my thing and so do you. Just hope you wont lashed out again at Slaf if he says what everybody here is saying when he plays bad

He doesnt need to "Talk less"

So you start here by saying you’re not “allowed “ to criticize him and then end by telling me what I should and shouldn’t post. Too funny.

I’ll lash out at him when I want to. I’ll praise him when I want to. It’s a message board and I’m allowed to do that.

And yes, he needs to keep his mouth shut. He’s not doing himself any favours with these dumb quotes to the press.

 

[TomKosto]

So you start here by saying you’re not “allowed “ to criticize him and then end by telling me what I should and shouldn’t post. Too funny.

I’ll lash out at him when I want to. I’ll praise him when I want to. It’s a message board and I’m allowed to do that.

And yes, he needs to keep his mouth shut. He’s not doing himself any favours with these dumb quotes to the press.

He has the right to say what everyone is saying, even if you like it or not D

 

[Naslundforever]

I can comment on what I see just as you can.

100%.. What peeps write, the games we watch, the stats... I’m just not a fan of the whole “who’s righteous” convo, none of us are jedi or telepathic psychologists.

I mean you probably come from a place of love with your white knighting for Slaf but can come off a bit pedantic.

I know I can come off like a dick, working on it lol

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

He has the right to say what everyone is saying, even if you like it or not D

And I’m allowed to criticize him for it.

See? You ARE allowed to criticize him.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

100%.. What peeps write, the games we watch, the stats... I’m just not a fan of the whole “who’s righteous” convo, none of us are jedi or telepathic psychologists.

I mean you probably come from a place of love with your white knighting for Slaf but can come off a bit pedantic.

I know I can come off like a dick, working on it lol

You clearly aren’t reading my posts that closely. I said he’s been mostly disappointing this year.

 

[Naslundforever]

You clearly aren’t reading my posts that closely. I said he’s been mostly disappointing this year.

I feel he’s evening out nicely haha..

Hey here’s a useful q: what do we mean by “ceiling”? Best season? Average best 5?

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

I feel he’s evening out nicely haha..

Hey here’s a useful q: what do we mean by “ceiling”? Best season? Average best 5?

I think he could be a 70 plus point player with us. Part of that is due to the fact that I think we’re going to be an offensively focused team. I think his real value will be in physical play. Big skilled physical player. That’s what I see.

What I don’t see is him becoming a Tkachuk type player. He won’t be Wendel Clark/Shanahan/Neely… but he’ll he’ll use his size to win battles in the boards and in front of the net. That’s what I expect from him.

He’ll never be as good as other number ones were. It was a weak draft and he might not be better than some drafted later. But he’ll provide a dimension we badly need. He wasn’t who I wanted but I’m happy we got him.

 

[Junohockeyfan]

I don't like the " big guys take longer" excuse, some do, some don't, same as any other players. And McKinnon ain't that big, 6' 200lbs.

It took Mac years for his coordination and tools to catch up with his speed.

For Slaf its all coordination. He has to grow into his body. He gained a lot if weight in his draft year and lost coordination and awareness.

 

[dackelljuneaubulis02]

Uhh.. Tkachuk was already a point per game player at 21. Mackinnon had 63 points in his rookie season and Rantanen was over a point per game in his 21yo season. Just accept that we got a first overall pick in a weak draft and that Slaf is not the same caliber as those players. Doesn't mean he won't be a good player.

I'll agree with you that he is driven and that will help him as he matures as he can be too hard on himself at times.

I’d recheck those Tkachuk stats. Also worth noting that Slaf had 2 years of junior eligibility when drafted and Tkachuk only had one.

And in Tkachuk’s 3rd season he had 36 points in 56 games.

 

[Miller Time]

Yep. He does little stuff like this just about all the time I watched him. Especially when people were screaming he was a bum or low IQ.

To get such a detailed game from a massive sized talent at such a young age especially in a big game should have people doing somersaults about him. And it’s not like these details haven’t been here since early in his second season. They just seem a bit more refined this game and more consistently displayed.

Criticize him by all means but when you criticize while ignoring the finer details of his game then you’re criticisms seem hollow.

Bingo.

 

[Andrei79]

Its funny because in the Laine thread, there was a video calling one of his defensive shifts against a fourth line (Carrier) impressive, when it was actually weak at best. Took 4 tries to weakly get the puck towards a teammate along the boards, but struggled against a 4th liner with no very little deception who was only looking to cycle it and get it to the slot - he was actually telegraphing what he was doing too.

Meanwhile, Slaf consistently gets the puck out of the zone in one try, whether by beating one or two forecheckers on the boards or having a great first touch and quickly passing the puck in transition like a center or defenseman would do. And some posters wonder why St Louis has him on the first line. He's the perfect complement to Suzuki and Caufield. Even if his defensive reads aren't perfect yet, he's responsible, he constantly supports on defense and backchecks. You don't see many 20 year old top 6 forwards/wingers doing that.

 

[dackelljuneaubulis02]

I looked up stats of a bunch of noteworthy oversized young/youngish elite talents and only Draisaitl and Rantanen out classed him mightily in their 3rd seasons. Would be interesting to know if they were any older than Slaf is now in their 3rd seasons.

The players I looked at were: T. Thompson, Knies, Strome, B. Tkachuk, Byfield, Nickushkin, and the two I mentioned. He’s either very similar or out produced these names except the two previously mentioned.

I’m not knowledgeable of the league so if people want to submit other names, I’d be curious how Slaf measures up. But with the examples I’ve checked Slaf stacks up extremely well. And I wonder how many of them were on a competitive playoff team first line that got the toughest match ups.

 

[CzarDemidov]

I am one of the biggest Slaf fans. Been following his career since he was 15 or so. I completely understand the frustrations of some fans regarding Slaf this season. I have watched 70+ Habs games live this season even though they are usually on during the night in Slovakia so I am fully aware of the highs and lows of his season.

For sure it wasn't the season we were all hoping for. Slaf struggled for a big part of the season, even though he was able to maintain decent numbers all the way through. There were good games, there were bad games, and plenty of mediocre games. He wasn't quite the force he was in the second half of last season. I believe this is something we can all agree on.

I don't believe the highlighted portion is a fair comment. You and I can agree on this, sure, but many others disagreed with any criticism levelled at Slaf at several points this season. It made for an insufferable discussion. It's been three years of this and ongoing.

But that doesn't mean his development is done. I still believe he can be an offensive star in this league and he has plenty of room for improvement. I don't understand how any self respecting hockey aficionado can claim that a player is a finished product at 21. You know who you are.

Very few comments or commentators indicated that Slaf was done with his development. Seems like you're chasing shadows.

Incidentally, a player's not being a finished product also means he could simply not improve. Improvement isn't guaranteed. Kostitsysn, Galchenyuk, and others never improved.

And well, if you write thousands upon thousands of words throwing shade at a player when he is struggling or even just playing ok and then write one sentence when he scores a big goal, don't be surprised when you are called a hater or a troll.

I think he has played very well in these playoffs so far. He is shooting the puck a lot more and created a bunch of chances as well. Thankfully he scored that goal otherwise I can't imagine the hate he'd be getting right now. It's funny how his lack of shooting has been pointed out as a problem (rightfully so), but now that he is shooting, it has become an irrelevant stat for those same people.

You're mistaken here thinking commentary is the same as hate. We're in a dialogue with other fans here. We are not in a dialogue with the organization or the players themselves. How a commentators write about a player has to do about the ongoing dialectic rather than some absolute barometer of their impression of the player. There are precious few words written about Suzuki relative to his contribution because most people are aligned on him: he's great. Slafkovsky doesn't have such alignment because he's inscrutable, inconsistent, and (some will say) overrated or underrated. He's up for debate.

Shots on goal are important and it's good that he's shooting on goal, in my book there is no higher praise than comparing a big powerful forward to a sasquatch but if you think we should get his name tattooed on our foreheads to prove that we're happy with his performance in playoff game 3 I invite you to do it first.

Yep. He does little stuff like this just about all the time I watched him. Especially when people were screaming he was a bum or low IQ.

To get such a detailed game from a massive sized talent at such a young age especially in a big game should have people doing somersaults about him. And it’s not like these details haven’t been here since early in his second season. They just seem a bit more refined this game and more consistently displayed.

Criticize him by all means but when you criticize while ignoring the finer details of his game then you’re criticisms seem hollow.

To me it's interested to figure out just how valuable is "the little stuff" versus the more easily noticeable stuff?

Lehkonen is an example of a player who did the little stuff well but was rarely rewarded when he was here. He was traded away rather unceremoniously. You need to do the big stuff too. Slaf is inconsistent with both. Maybe he'll turn the corner, hopefully he does (hopefully he has).

 

[dackelljuneaubulis02]

I don't believe the highlighted portion is a fair comment. You and I can agree on this, sure, but many others disagreed with any criticism levelled at Slaf at several points this season. It made for an insufferable discussion. It's been three years of this and ongoing.


Very few comments or commentators indicated that Slaf was done with his development. Seems like you're chasing shadows.

Incidentally, a player's not being a finished product also means he could simply not improve. Improvement isn't guaranteed. Kostitsysn, Galchenyuk, and others never improved.

You're mistaken here thinking commentary is the same as hate. We're in a dialogue with other fans here. We are not in a dialogue with the organization or the players themselves. How a commentators write about a player has to do about the ongoing dialectic rather than some absolute barometer of their impression of the player. There are precious few words written about Suzuki relative to his contribution because most people are aligned on him: he's great. Slafkovsky doesn't have such alignment because he's inscrutable, inconsistent, and (some will say) overrated or underrated. He's up for debate.

Shots on goal are important and it's good that he's shooting on goal, in my book there is no higher praise than comparing a big powerful forward to a sasquatch but if you think we should get his name tattooed on our foreheads to prove that we're happy with his performance in playoff game 3 I invite you to do it first.


To me it's interested to figure out just how valuable is "the little stuff" versus the more easily noticeable stuff?

Lehkonen is an example of a player who did the little stuff well but was rarely rewarded when he was here. He was traded away rather unceremoniously. You need to do the big stuff too. Slaf is inconsistent with both. Maybe he'll turn the corner, hopefully he does (hopefully he has).

You’re using Lehkonen as an example lol. Weird. Whether he was rewarded he was highly regarded for what he did by those who were knowledgeable.

And as far as the big stuff look at my post above his stats compare favourably and better than most young oversized stars at the same age. You talk like he’s a 30 point guy. 20 goals one year and one less the next by his d+3. But I won’t run around in circles with you over this.

 

[DemidovSZN]

Its funny because in the Laine thread, there was a video calling one of his defensive shifts against a fourth line (Carrier) impressive, when it was actually weak at best. Took 4 tries to weakly get the puck towards a teammate along the boards, but struggled against a 4th liner with no very little deception who was only looking to cycle it and get it to the slot - he was actually telegraphing what he was doing too.

Meanwhile, Slaf consistently gets the puck out of the zone in one try, whether by beating one or two forecheckers on the boards or having a great first touch and quickly passing the puck in transition like a center or defenseman would do. And some posters wonder why St Louis has him on the first line. He's the perfect complement to Suzuki and Caufield. Even if his defensive reads aren't perfect yet, he's responsible, he constantly supports on defense and backchecks. You don't see many 20 year old top 6 forwards/wingers doing that.

He’s also awesome making plays in the neutral zone. Sending his linemates on 2 on 1’s. Like you said, I find it pretty rare for a player his age to have as much details in his game already.

 

[dackelljuneaubulis02]

He’s also awesome making plays in the neutral zone. Sending his linemates on 2 on 1’s. Like you said, I find it pretty rare for a player his age to have as much details in his game already.

Not unlike Reinbacher honestly.

He just plays way too detailed a game to be low iq. Doesn’t mean he sometimes doesn’t make the greatest decisions. I’ve seen it but again weigh the bad against the good and then one’s criticisms get taken seriously

 

[Goldthorpe]

Big hits and dirty plays are flashy, it's entertaining and viewers want that.
Smart two-way board play using your size and reach, that's less flashy and less entertaining. But that's what wins cups.
We should be ecstatic about Slaf progression these playoffs.
First game he seemed tentative, letting Suz and Caufield hustle for pucks.
Second game he was more assertive, but they still lost. He was clearly unsatisfied with the result.
Third game he's one of our best player.

 

[Sookind]

Uhh.. Tkachuk was already a point per game player at 21. Mackinnon had 63 points in his rookie season and Rantanen was over a point per game in his 21yo season. Just accept that we got a first overall pick in a weak draft and that Slaf is not the same caliber as those players. Doesn't mean he won't be a good player.

I'll agree with you that he is driven and that will help him as he matures as he can be too hard on himself at times.

3rd year after their draft, Brady Tkachuk 36 pts/56g, Rantanen 38pts/75g and Mckinnon 52pts/72g he also had only 53 pts the year after.Juraj will mature, he's no Mckinnon but not far from Tkachuk and I personally think he will be better than him, just my opinion.