Post-Game Talk: JUMP TO THE PUMP: Jets have gas in 5-2 win over Sabres

[hn777]

Higher in the line up = more minutes = playing against other teams better players

Both of those would produce worse results

Actually, playing with better teammates has been shown statistically to be more important than playing against better opponents.

Also, you can't just assume higher icetime means reduced scoring rate for every player due to fatigue. Some scores at higher rates, as they are more involved with the flow of the game with higher icetime.

Anyway, we don't have to guess, as Ehlers have excellent results with Scheifele, and I reckon we agree, he plays topline minutes when with Scheifele.

 

[BarnabyJones PI]

I feel like this is a bit of a weird point? Why would Ehlers (or anyone) play worse just because they play more minutes? You realize of course that in a game he plays 20 minutes he... also played 17 minutes up until that point, right?

The real issue with players playing too much is that it wears them out down the stretch, or if they play a ton in a game maybe they let up a bad goal late game.

But the things you're showing here with wins and losses and stuff seem more likely to be correlated with something other than Ehlers' endurance levels.

Doesn't this forum annually dissolve into how Ehler's needs-to-get-more-minutes debate? I decided to look into it. I wanted to see, if I was wrong (or not) specifically about the P/60, and how Ehler's performed when he played more minutes. The promise is, at least to my understanding, that the more minutes he'd play, he'd be putting up Kyle Connor-type numbers (or more), while also, suppressing the opposition while doing so.

I actually didn't specifically look at wins or losses, just as I was doing it (not filtering it out), it became impossible for the eye not to wander to all of those "L's" in the won/loss column. How could someone, being unbiased, not wonder how the team performs over that entire stretch?

Also, how could I not think that there's a direct correlation?

False.

Playing with better teammates has been shown statistically to be more important than playing against better opponents.

Also, you can't just assume higher icetime means reduced scoring rate for every player due to fatigue. Some scores at higher rates, as they are more involved with the flow of the game with higher icetime.

Anyway, we don't have to guess, as Ehlers have excellent results with Scheifele, and I reckon we agree, he plays topline minutes when with Scheifele.

We know this one isn't the least bit biased...

 

[Jack7222]

Cognitive dissonance is strong with this one

More minutes = more fatigue

Higher in the line up = more minutes = playing against other teams better players

Both of those would produce worse results

Fatigue doesn't start until the 17th minute so at most you'd be seeing worse results in three minutes worth of ice time. Do you really think this is being statistically accounted for?

Cognitive dissonance indeed lol. I see you've latched on to these charts in a hurry.

 

[BarnabyJones PI]

double post

 

[BarnabyJones PI]

Fatigue doesn't start until the 17th minute so at most you'd be seeing worse results in three minutes worth of ice time. Do you really think this is being statistically accounted for?

Cognitive dissonance indeed lol. I see you've latched on to these charts in a hurry.

They're records.

 

[WpgSteve]

I think fans and click bait reporters are making too much of the Elhers ice time thing. There's evidence he plays better in limited minute. I've never seen any indication he's unhappy with his useage. He often misses practices, presumably due to fatigue and nagging injuries. Two coaches have used him the same way. At some point, the most logical conclusion is that he's being used properly.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

A slow, small 5’8” guys isn’t who you build around….as another poster said, I don’t get him!

5'11, 185 is not that small. Certainly not 5'8. He is not slow either. Maybe not what you would call fast, but not slow.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

So all you have to do is change every line? I guess they are only second in the league. You could always get better….

Yes, you can always get better.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Maurice - that name rings a bell. I think that is the professional quitter who quit our team on a game day in the middle of the season. Seriously, who does that? May have happened in the NHL before but not the I can remember. That guy? If I did criticize him, I was obviously right.

Not that I can recall ever saying that an NHL coach makes decisions for no reason at all. If I did, I must have been 2/3 of the way through a bottle of Hendricks.

Frankly, I find Bones to be very transparent about why he does certain things, roster moves, utilization, etc. Look at how open he is discussing the 'why' in these situations. Including talking about how difficult the decisions are sometimes and how it can be a challenge for players to have to deal with these decisions. But that is part of being a professional hockey player.

Anyway, on to the next game. Thank goodness we finally have a coach that knows what he is doing and why.

I do appreciate some things about Bones - you can't argue with the results he is getting. And I like the way he talks publicly. But continually punishing Ehlers has gotten out of hand. Scheifele - Connor has gone too far.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

This Ehlers debate is getting out of hand ... you figure the Jets are on a losing streak and trying to hold on to a wild card spot.
I like Ehlers don't get me wrong but you do know Ehlers only has scored in one game in his last 16 games right.
Ehlers is electric and fun to watch but he is a wild card very hard to play with and in a close game where one turnover can cost you the game I can see where the coaches are coming from.
Remember Dallas game 3 mistakes 3 goals ... game basically over.
As long as the Jets are winning why worry about a player on where he is playing.

You are absolutely right - but - I don't like seeing Ehlers continually being singled out the way he is. I think it is going to cost us a very good player. I hope we at least don't lose the trade.

 

[raideralex99]

You are absolutely right - but - I don't like seeing Ehlers continually being singled out the way he is. I think it is going to cost us a very good player. I hope we at least don't lose the trade.

Its more of the social media that is pushing this narrative. The Jets winning is boring to write about need controversy to get more clicks.
Has Ehlers ever complained or asked for a trade?
If Ehlers was unhappy I'm sure Chevy would have traded him already.
@Dale53130 posted Ehlers career numbers where he played 17 minutes or more and they are not good ... check them out in the Ehlers thread.
I just find it weird ... the big story was the second half collapse which never happened ... the team goes 9-2 and now this thing with Ehlers a nothing burger but lets blow it up for negativity.
How about we just enjoy this year's Jets great turnaround from the doom and gloom "tear it down" stories from the summer to playoff bound and a true SC contender. I like that story a lot better ... everybody loves a parade.

 

[Jets 31]

I love the positivity in your posts @Jets 31. They are realistic, and refreshing to read. Even if the Jets won the Cup, there would be people complaining about something. Enjoy the ride here.

Hey thanks, i sometimes like reading the opposing team's GDT just to see what their fans are saying about the Jets, they have no reason what so ever to say anything positive about the Jets , so seeing the Jets are legit or the Jets are for real kinda puts a perspective on things .

 

[Buffdog]

Fatigue doesn't start until the 17th minute so at most you'd be seeing worse results in three minutes worth of ice time. Do you really think this is being statistically accounted for?

Cognitive dissonance indeed lol. I see you've latched on to these charts in a hurry.

Fatigue sets in at different points for everyone. I recall there was a similar discussion about Buff.. his sweet spot was around 22:00...

Just curious... have you ever actually played the sport? Even beer league?