Confirmed with Link: JT Miller traded to NYR for Chytil, Mancini, 1st round pick (protected)

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Wasn't the report that the Canucks players weren't happy with the trade at all?
I randomly read that and haven't been able to find a single source. I saw Seravalli said it but I can't find anything indicating he did.

Allvin did say that his job is to ensure the locker room is a safe environment. We can read into that however we want, but JT probably blew up at someone, and as much as he's liked in Vancouver by both fans and players, it would be pretty bad if he wasn't held accountable for that.
 
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Kakko is worse than not existing to me. He all of a sudden discovered an offensive game while not doing shit here. f*** him.
you should get rid of the snow in your handle. the nyr too. just go with "Blind"

Only explanation for seeing a player that you all lambasted for years. YEARS. and so many of us said no he's a good player he's just not being given a chance. not being put in a position to succeed.

then he goes somewhere else, they put him in a better position, and lo and behold he has success.


You can blame the player for "suddenly" changing, or you can understand that the team you root for does not put its players in position to succeed. See Fox/Lindgren. See Cuylle with brodzinsky. It's not the players bro. It's the Rangers.
 
you should get rid of the snow in your handle. the nyr too. just go with "Blind"

Only explanation for seeing a player that you all lambasted for years. YEARS. and so many of us said no he's a good player he's just not being given a chance. not being put in a position to succeed.

then he goes somewhere else, they put him in a better position, and lo and behold he has success.


You can blame the player for "suddenly" changing, or you can understand that the team you root for does not put its players in position to succeed. See Fox/Lindgren. See Cuylle with brodzinsky. It's not the players bro. It's the Rangers.

Kakko was a malcontent who quit on the Rangers. Chytil was put in similarly "unfair" situations, but worked his ass of to get back and help the team whenever he he was out, and didnt say boo about it. Im with @SnowblindNYR , I'll be watching and rooting for Filip from afar, but could care less about Kakko getting points in games Seattle loses on their way to the lottery.
 
Kakko was a malcontent who quit on the Rangers. Chytil was put in similarly "unfair" situations, but worked his ass of to get back and help the team whenever he he was out, and didnt say boo about it. Im with @SnowblindNYR , I'll be watching and rooting for Filip from afar, but could care less about Kakko getting points in games Seattle loses on their way to the lottery.
you can stick to whatever invented narrative you like to justify your dislike for a player. that's your prerogative.

but the point is: Kakko was capable of much more than what he did here. The organization is responsible for maximizing its assets. It didn't. Their loss.
 
you can stick to whatever invented narrative you like to justify your dislike for a player. that's your prerogative.

but the point is: Kakko was capable of much more than what he did here. The organization is responsible for maximizing its assets. It didn't. Their loss.

I didn't invent him complaining about his role to the media every year.
 
you can stick to whatever invented narrative you like to justify your dislike for a player. that's your prerogative.

but the point is: Kakko was capable of much more than what he did here. The organization is responsible for maximizing its assets. It didn't. Their loss.

Lot of NYR fans have heavy biases on this one they can’t work past. Disappointment breeds resentment.
 
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I randomly read that and haven't been able to find a single source. I saw Seravalli said it but I can't find anything indicating he did.

Allvin did say that his job is to ensure the locker room is a safe environment. We can read into that however we want, but JT probably blew up at someone, and as much as he's liked in Vancouver by both fans and players, it would be pretty bad if he wasn't held accountable for that.

God has spoken.
 
I mean I'm definitely a little wary about Miller having a blowup here too but considering this team already shit the bed and pouted their way to a shitty year without him then whatever, f*** 'em

Rather a blow up because a guy is an asshole than because their feelings were hurt when a player was moved.
 
Lot of NYR fans have heavy biases on this one they can’t work past. Disappointment breeds resentment.
yup. inflated expectations -> crashing disappointment -> misdirected blame -> legacy of resentment -> rinse repeat


porzingis
d jones
judge
kakko/laf


it's endemic to this city's fandoms. when loudly and publicly overhyping your shiny new toys is your entire personality, you leave no room to say "i was wrong." theres just a series of sputtered excuses, each one flimsier than the last, until you get to the Lamest of All: "he couldn't handle NYC."
 
Didn't find to time to comment on this whopper ... holy shit.

I f***ing loved Manc, pulled me out of my seat, legit. Fil ... our boi. And my precious 1st rd pick!! ... yes, yes protection bla.

Man, like from the long term economic stand point, this is ridiculous asset management. The trade cycle's been pointed out enough though here.

Now I haven't seen the man play yet (his 2nd time around; didn't catch many games, too busy with getting up at 6 AM). From what I read on HFNYR, he's our best player instant. That's good. You can look it up, I always thought JTM to be a skilled player that needed TIME.

Maybe he can ignite some people. Be the big [REDACTED] leader of the team.
 
Didn't find to time to comment on this whopper ... holy shit.

I f***ing loved Manc, pulled me out of my seat, legit. Fil ... our boi. And my precious 1st rd pick!! ... yes, yes protection bla.

Man, like from the long term economic stand point, this is ridiculous asset management. The trade cycle's been pointed out enough though here.

Now I haven't seen the man play yet (his 2nd time around; didn't catch many games, too busy with getting up at 6 AM). From what I read on HFNYR, he's our best player instant. That's good. You can look it up, I always thought JTM to be a skilled player that needed TIME.

Maybe he can ignite some people. Be the big [REDACTED] leader of the team.

This is actually a good question. Is he our best forward? Probably not last year, but what about this year? He's having a down season himself.
 
This is actually a good question. Is he our best forward? Probably not last year, but what about this year? He's having a down season himself.

Obviously it's only been 2 games. We've been begging for skill players who play like the bottom six in terms of tenacity and fearlessness -- what the misguided people took for "tuffness" and equated to "fighting". The team will go as far as Miller can carry them. Without Miller, there isn't anyone short of Trocheck who will not hesitate to go to the middle of the ice. They don't even use the middle of the ice on odd man rushes. Everything is wide, from the boards, staying from the outside.
 
Obviously it's only been 2 games. We've been begging for skill players who play like the bottom six in terms of tenacity and fearlessness -- what the misguided people took for "tuffness" and equated to "fighting". The team will go as far as Miller can carry them. Without Miller, there isn't anyone short of Trocheck who will not hesitate to go to the middle of the ice. They don't even use the middle of the ice on odd man rushes. Everything is wide, from the boards, staying from the outside.

He's going to have the C on opening night next year
 
you should get rid of the snow in your handle. the nyr too. just go with "Blind"

Only explanation for seeing a player that you all lambasted for years. YEARS. and so many of us said no he's a good player he's just not being given a chance. not being put in a position to succeed.

then he goes somewhere else, they put him in a better position, and lo and behold he has success.

I am still not overly impressed with Kakko, don’t see much difference in him now, so I’ll ask sincerely: when you say success now, what tangible improvement are you seeing in him now vs NY?

I see Seattle falling in the standings and losing more since Kakko arrived:
  • SEA 33 games w/o Kakko – .484 pts pct, 4 pts out of playoff spot
  • SEA 21 games w/ Kakko – .405 pts pct, 10 pts out of playoff spot
If that’s the measure of success, plunging from bubble to lottery pick, I’ll give you that one. Seattle is now in top 5 pick territory and that is something.

Are you going by Seattle having all of one win against playoff-positioned teams since Kakko got there?

Or are we going by the most illogical and useless stat imaginable, points?

Before answering that, I’ll explain my long-standing issue with points. One, this stat devalues goals and inflates assists as up to twice as valuable as goals by including secondary assists. This is the first broken thinking.

This flawed thinking is shown to be even more idiotic as it’s roughly 5x more difficult for a forward to put a shot in a net than it is for a forward to complete an offensive zone pass:
  • Forward off. zone pass completion – 60.09% (sportsnet.ca)
  • Forward shot percentage – 12.59% (nhl.com)
Points should never be a thing. Goals should be goals. Assists should be primary only, and their own thing. Especially when shots succeed at roughly 1/5 the frequency of offensive zone passes. This might explain why scorers in most other sports get paid vastly more than players who are heavy assist-only types.

We can also take this assists thing deeper by going into pass type. Sportsnet did a nice break down of this a few years ago, looking at which types of passes most contribute to goals (slot, rush, east-west) vs passes that had the least impact on goals (cycle). They then crossed this data against a player’s pass frequency and pass completion rate.

Which players came out as the passers most impactful on scoring in this Sportsnet CA deep dive in 2019? Crosby was 1, Panarin was 2, and the top ten saw relatively expected names of the day in 2019, such as Backstrom, Giroux, Point, MacKinnon, Kopitar, and Barkov.

So are we doing the broken points stat thing with Kakko? Or look realistically that his goal-scoring in SEA now is slightly up. And will we wait some time to observe if he is growing into a player who can consistently complete passes more likely to lead to goals or will be more the guy compiling secondary assists and completing cycle passes?

Objectively, thus far, I see his goal scoring has improved from 15 gls per 82 games to 19/82. Good on him (but short sample and can rapidly drop, as well). His assists are up, for what little that’s worth for reasons I stated above. If he becomes a guy who consistently makes plays and passes that create scoring opportunities, awesome. Time will tell more clearly on that. He seems to be playing more confidently, which is good to see also.

Beyond that, the dude to me still doesn’t look like anything to lose 3 seconds of sleep over. I’m indifferent and not trying to intentionally be disagreeable. If he flourishes, great. At this point, however, I don’t feel like it was much of a loss, have no clue what his camp wants as far as his next contract, and don’t see much tangible positive impact on his team (they’ve dropped from a bubble spot to a lottery spot, with a 1-10-0 record vs playoff teams since he arrived).

If at some point this all proves otherwise, I’ll gladly admit it. No skin off my ass to admit I am wrong. I screw up and make mistakes like a champion. Just ask my ex-wife if you need a bulleted list.
 
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I am still not overly impressed with Kakko, don’t see much difference in him now, so I’ll ask sincerely: when you say success now, what tangible improvement are you seeing in him now vs NY?

I see Seattle falling in the standings and losing more since Kakko arrived:
  • SEA 33 games w/o Kakko – .484 pts pct, 4 pts out of playoff spot
  • SEA 21 games w/ Kakko – .405 pts pct, 10 pts out of playoff spot
If that’s the measure of success, plunging from bubble to lottery pick, I’ll give you that one. Seattle is now in top 5 pick territory and that is something.

Are you going by Seattle having all of one win against playoff-positioned teams since Kakko got there?

Or are we going by the most illogical and useless stat imaginable, points?

Before answering that, I’ll explain my long-standing issue with points. One, this stat devalues goals and inflates assists as up to twice as valuable as goals by including secondary assists. This is the first broken thinking.

This flawed thinking is shown to be even more idiotic as it’s roughly 5x more difficult for a forward to put a shot in a net than it is for a forward to complete an offensive zone pass:
  • Forward off. zone pass completion – 60.09% (sportsnet.ca)
  • Forward shot percentage – 12.59% (nhl.com)
Points should never be a thing. Goals should be goals. Assists should be primary only, and their own thing. Especially when shots succeed at roughly 1/5 the frequency of offensive zone passes. This might explain why scorers in most other sports get paid vastly more than players who are heavy assist-only types.

We can also take this assists thing deeper by going into pass type. Sportsnet did a nice break down of this a few years ago, looking at which types of passes most contribute to goals (slot, rush, east-west) vs passes that had the least impact on goals (cycle). They then crossed this data against a player’s pass frequency and pass completion rate.

Which players came out as the passers most impactful on scoring in this Sportsnet CA deep dive in 2019? Crosby was 1, Panarin was 2, and the top ten saw relatively expected names of the day in 2019, such as Backstrom, Giroux, Point, MacKinnon, Kopitar, and Barkov.

So are we doing the broken points stat thing with Kakko? Or look realistically that his goal-scoring in SEA now is slightly up. And will we wait some time to observe if he is growing into a player who can consistently complete passes more likely to lead to goals or will be more the guy compiling secondary assists and completing cycle passes?

Objectively, thus far, I see his goal scoring has improved from 15 gls per 82 games to 19/82. Good on him (but short sample and can rapidly drop, as well). His assists are up, for what little that’s worth for reasons I stated above. If he becomes a guy who consistently makes plays and passes that create scoring opportunities, awesome. Time will tell more clearly on that. He seems to be playing more confidently, which is good to see also.

Beyond that, the dude to me still doesn’t look like anything to lose 3 seconds of sleep over. I’m indifferent and not trying to intentionally be disagreeable. If he flourishes, great. At this point, however, I don’t feel like it was much of a loss, have no clue what his camp wants as far as his next contract, and don’t see much tangible positive impact on his team (they’ve dropped from a bubble spot to a lottery spot, with a 1-10-0 record vs playoff teams since he arrived).

If at some point this all proves otherwise, I’ll gladly admit it. No skin off my ass to admit I am wrong. I screw up and make mistakes like a champion. Just ask my ex-wife if you need a bulleted list.
i certainly don't use team wins as a measure of player success.

the confidence is what i'm talking about. look at him play
 

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