Player Discussion Joel Armia turnaround year?

[Catanddogguitarrr]

How on earth was Edmundson better than Petry last year? You’re just lying. Halfway through the season Petry was getting Norris consideration from the media.

And the question is, based on your logic, was Edmundson 5x better than Petry? Because his +\- was 5x better.

5x better is exageration. With solid D who were giving a lot of Sherwood, Petry was able to make some offensive plays. If this year Eddy is playing and Petry not playing, Habs wouldn't be so bad. But so many players are missing, like Price, Weber and Danault. It's a combination of many things to explain how bad Habs are this year. Gallagher without Danault is looking so washed up.

Back to the topic, Armia doesn't half the guts Gallagher have, or had. Armia have all the tools we can dream : size, skills, skating and hockey IQ. A smart gm should know the character of his players, who will keep on playing the same level and who is not reliable. For Armia's contract and other things, Bergevin lost his job and I didn't complain.

 

[HabsWhiteKnightLOL]

I am dissapointed some people came at me when he was extended this offseason and said he has top 6 potential.

Armia have been a bigger disaster than Savard at this point.

Pezzeta is far far far far in front of him

 

[Catanddogguitarrr]

I am dissapointed some people came at me when he was extended this offseason and said he has top 6 potential.

Armia have been a bigger disaster than Savard at this point.

Pezzeta is far far far far in front of him

So true. Pezzetta is what I like about a new player from the farmhouse. He plays for cheap and shows up every night. All this when Armia is overpaid at 3,5 he shows no emotion. Armia is flat like an opened bottle of Coke 2 days ago.

 

[Catanddogguitarrr]

Probably quite a bit more. Suzuki has more room, Dvorak/KK plays where they should, and whoever replaces Armia at 900K is a better player than Joel Armia. And we probably get much more productive hockey out of Brandon Gallagher.

The issue is long term, because the minute Danault's skating starts dwindling, his usefulness goes downhill, fast. Really fast. And that will probably happen before the end of his deal, and we're then stuck with a 5.5M 3rd/4th line tweener at best when this team is probably ready to be good.

Dvorak is younger than Danault and his skating is dawn slow. Kopitar is 34 and he skates faster than Suzuki at 22. How in the world can you predict when Danault's skating will slow down? You saw a bad technique of skating? You just predict ramdomly that he will slow down, like some who predict Bergeron will slow down or Crosby. How can you tell? Did you see Danault skate with short pushes, like the Gallagher technique? Or he have long pushes, naturally flow like natural skaters? Watch him again and come back with your observation.

 

[MXD]

Dvorak is younger than Danault and his skating is dawn slow. Kopitar is 34 and he skates faster than Suzuki at 22. How in the world can you predict when Danault's skating will slow down? You saw a bad technique of skating? You just predict ramdomly that he will slow down, like some who predict Bergeron will slow down or Crosby. How can you tell? Did you see Danault skate with short pushes, like the Gallagher technique? Or he have long pushes, naturally flow like natural skaters? Watch him again and come back with your observation.

I can't tell it, but players tend to slow down at some point.

Crosby and Bergeron did lose explosiveness (relative to the league at the very least) and they dont rely on their skating as much as Danault is to be effective.

Of course, Danault may not slow down at all during his deal.

 

[MasterD]

alright. You don't want to admit that Danault is an important player, and you are better than NHl GM's and coaches. Fine. Keep living in your fantasy world.

Didn't say he's not an important player, 3rd line C is one of the most important positions on a team. He's just not an offensively gifted player

 

[WickedPegJets]

I am dissapointed some people came at me when he was extended this offseason and said he has top 6 potential.

Armia have been a bigger disaster than Savard at this point.

Pezzeta is far far far far in front of him

Jets GM Chevy traded Joel Armia to Bergy for a reason. Chevy also thought Ben Chariot was too expensive to resign.

 

[HabsWhiteKnightLOL]

Jets GM Chevy traded Joel Armia to Bergy for a reason. Chevy also thought Ben Chariot was too expensive to resign.

People told me i was dumb when they extended him ''he did great in the playoffs''

This guy had top 6 icetime for 2 years at 17min + powerplay and pk time and never managed to break 30 points.
This show how much Bergevin blinded the fanbase by thinking those players are worth something liek that.

Same for Byron or Lekhonen. 4th liner that get some streaky then dissapears for 30games.

 

[Heffyhoof]

People told me i was dumb when they extended him ''he did great in the playoffs''

This guy had top 6 icetime for 2 years at 17min + powerplay and pk time and never managed to break 30 points.
This show how much Bergevin blinded the fanbase by thinking those players are worth something liek that.

Same for Byron or Lekhonen. 4th liner that get some streaky then dissapears for 30games.

The fabled 200-foot player in MB's mind. He just forgot that 200-foot means they can play offense as well.

 

[HabsWhiteKnightLOL]

The fabled 200-foot player in MB's mind. He just forgot that 200-foot means they can play offense as well.

Exactly. We could have traded him at the deadline for free assets , instead now we are stuck with him.
I hope Hugues don't do the same for Lekhonen.

 

[Hins77]

Exactly. We could have traded him at the deadline for free assets , instead now we are stuck with him.
I hope Hugues don't do the same for Lekhonen.

. thats were i want to see Hugues playing his cards. If he get rid of Lehkonen vs asset. He is doing very well. If he keeps him, bad asset management. He just don’t need to retain a UFA guy and pay him 3/4 years on good salary. It doesnt make sense. For a borderline 3rd liner. He is gonna lose cap sace for absolutely none reason. And this cap space. Sometimes you will need to keep it and be able to sign the plAyer you really want to keep or to reach

 

[Aces on the road]

How on earth was Edmundson better than Petry last year? You’re just lying. Halfway through the season Petry was getting Norris consideration from the media.

And the question is, based on your logic, was Edmundson 5x better than Petry? Because his +\- was 5x better.

They have different role.

 

[Miller Time]

People told me i was dumb when they extended him ''he did great in the playoffs''

This guy had top 6 icetime for 2 years at 17min + powerplay and pk time and never managed to break 30 points.
This show how much Bergevin blinded the fanbase by thinking those players are worth something liek that.

Same for Byron or Lekhonen. 4th liner that get some streaky then dissapears for 30games.

Lol... he's fallen flat, no doubt. But no need to make sh*t up.

Armia had 1 year with 17+min of ice time (his only year with more than 16min, actually).

And yes, he "only" got 16 goals & 30pts... in 58 games.

Add the post season (where his ice time dropped under 16min, but he kept up the .5ppg), and it's 19g/35pts in 68 games.

That's a 23 goal/42 pt pace, over 80% of a season. For a defensively sound winger, that's pretty great middle-6 production level... and pretty consistent with his overall career productivity related to ice time.

It's unfortunate for us that he didn't build off of that career year, and very unfortunate that after MB gave him a 4-year deal this summer, he's regressed to a career-worst level well below his career averages... kudos to you for seeing that coming. I don't think his current ineptness and regression, at an age where he should be peaking, was all that predictable nor do I think it's likely he'll be this bad for the duration.

Hopefully we can unload him, obviously. Will be interesting to see of this seasons anomaly is the start of the end of his nhl career, or just a bad road bump & he ends up playing a solid and cap reasonable middle 6 role in his next landing spot.

 

[salbutera]

Jets GM Chevy traded Joel Armia to Bergy for a reason. Chevy also thought Ben Chariot was too expensive to resign.

Chiarot signed for less $ w Habs vs Jets offer

Armia was the bait to move Mason’as contract & create cap space - Jets did not want to deal him, he was respected in the room and was a mentor for Laine at the time

 

[Habs Halifax]

As fans, we don't matter about the decision he made and the salary he should make. It was up to Bergevin to give him what he wanted. Unless Danault knew very well that this team was going to b a shit show with Price injured seriously, Weber gone, and Ducharme behind the bench.

Danault wanted out due to how he was disrespected by both Bergevin and the fans. Remember when I asked this question... Are you nervous that you agree with Bergevin on Danault?

 

[Habs Halifax]

Well, just because we don't have 2 better centemen on this team doesn't make him a top 6 C. He's a high end 3rd C, maybe low end 2nd behind a McDavid.

I would have paid him 5.5 at 3rd C and gotten rid of Byron/Armia, but I don't make those decisions
And he didn't want that.

It was a chain of events and I don't blame Danault one bit. I'm on his side. The guy busted his ass for us and worked as hard or harder each and every shift compared to Gallagher. People obsessed with his lack of offense when he was asked to play a defensive role and still, some people think he is just some 3C.

 

[MasterD]

It was a chain of events and I don't blame Danault one bit. I'm on his side. The guy busted his ass for us and worked as hard or harder each and every shift compared to Gallagher. People obsessed with his lack of offense when he was asked to play a defensive role and still, some people think he is just some 3C.

So because he works hard he's a top 6 C?

 

[Habs Halifax]

So because he works hard he's a top 6 C?

Middle 2C and very effective at shutting down other teams top 2C's. Danault helps you win games but some look at points. If Danault was elite in the shutdown center and he also put up points, he'd be worth $8M+. $5.5M or even $6M is not some massive problem. Maybe not the AAV you prefer to be competitive in the cap but neither is Gallagher's cap hit. Or even Price at $10.5M.

If our team was in a different direction and Danault left cause he was disrespected, this would be a big story on our boards. Add this to the list of things of why some players choose not to play in Montreal. B Marchand just explained why players avoid Canada perfectly. He nailed it!

 

[MasterD]

Middle 2C and very effective at shutting down other teams top 2C's. Danault helps you win games but some look at points. If Danault was elite in the shutdown center and he also put up points, he'd be worth $8M+. $5.5M or even $6M is not some massive problem. Maybe not the AAV you prefer to be competitive in the cap but neither is Gallagher's cap hit. Or even Price at $10.5M.

If our team was in a different direction and Danault left cause he was disrespected, this would be a big story on our boards. Add this to the list of things of why some players choose not to play in Montreal. B Marchand just explained why players avoid Canada perfectly. He nailed it!

If if if. He's not elite shutdown, and he doesn't put up tons of points. I can agree with middle 6, but that depends who the #1 C is. He can't be your #2 when your #1 is Suzuki, you're just not going to score enough!

As far as what Marchand said... He's not 100% wrong, but what Habs players face is a lot less than what soccer players face in the big clubs. You're either made for it, or you're not.

It's why I'm still pissed that we traded Subban. Not that he was perfect at all, but he's one of the rare players I've seen who THRIVED because of the spotlights, not despite them. We need those guys. Kovalev was another one. Armia ain't that, Danault either (though more than Plekanec or Pacioretty were)...

But we're far off subject, I'll leave it there.

 

[Tyson]

Is there a GM that will want Armia and his contract?

 

[Habs Halifax]

Is there a GM that will want Armia and his contract?

Probably another Byron type contract and similar to the Leafs with Kerfoot. Not impossible to move but in a flat cap, it's difficult without taking salary back. I believe GM's would value Armia but coming to agreement on his value and what salary we get back might make it hard to accomplish. See what the Leafs do with both Kerfoot and Mrazek cause they need to unload salary after Rielly's contract kicks in next year.

 

[Runner77]

People told me i was dumb when they extended him ''he did great in the playoffs''

This guy had top 6 icetime for 2 years at 17min + powerplay and pk time and never managed to break 30 points.
This show how much Bergevin blinded the fanbase by thinking those players are worth something liek that.

Same for Byron or Lekhonen. 4th liner that get some streaky then dissapears for 30games.

But Bergevin won all his trades!

All these poison pills like Armia on long term deals just keep unraveling on a time release basis. I wouldn’t lump Lehkonen in there as he’s a versatile defensive specialist but there are plenty of toxic contracts to resolve. The new guys are smart, relentless and creative — it’ll take some time but I’m confident they’ll find solutions.

 

[Whitesnake]

Is there a GM that will want Armia and his contract?

I think we should call LA and ask Bergie to take every stupid contract he has given. Anyway, he LOVES his kids? He believes in them? Sell that to Blake.

 

[Runner77]

Is there a GM that will want Armia and his contract?

Yes. KK lobbying Waddell as we speak, about rescuing his childhood hero.

 

[Habs13]

Who??! Who the hell is Joel Armia!?!