Post-Game Talk: Jets buffalo Buffalo - 7:4 Final

[Edgar Halliwax]

Don't get me wrong, I like what the Jets got out of it, but it seems like we forget that Kane is still an effective top six player in the NHL.

Yea, but he’s a class 1 d-bag. So there’s that....

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Curious why you're treating Lemieux as a throw in that is hardly even worth mentioning. Kasdorf, yes I'll consider him as that, but IMO Lemieux was a highly desired piece in that deal from our end, as was Armia, Stafford, and the 1st. Bogo for Myers was largely considered a saw off at the time, but I suspect Chevy was keener in including him than Buffalo might have been

I don't think I said that but he is certainly less than Roslovic. Just allowing for some flexibility in the value estimate.

Lemieux has been back on the goon, idiot, penalty train again lately. We don't need that. He behaved himself pretty well during his stint with the Jets but if he can't sustain that then he is not going to make a positive contribution to the Jets, IMO. Unless the contribution comes in trade.

I'm very encouraged by the progress he has shown this season but if he can't stay out of the box I don't want him. IIRC he took a couple of fighting penalties while he was here. They were in the line of standing up for teammates and I like that. I don't hold those penalties against him. It sounds like some of his recent ones were just undisciplined temper tantrums though. I'm still on the fence.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

I think you have to look at from just the stand point of the deal between the two teams and not anything they did after the fact. For instance if Armia in 4 or 5 years becomes to expensive so we deal him for draft picks/prospects do we keep counting that? No. If Buffalo wins the draft lotto this year and gets Dahlin I am sure some people will point out the Kane deal got them that pick so it is a win.

Who has been the better team after this deal was made. Who is going to be the better team for the future?

I agree that you have to draw a line somewhere but not sure how. If a player was acquired in trade and then traded on shortly after how do you count that? I think each player is a package with a certain net value. That value is all that he brings from that point on. You don't need to trace every trade and add them all up. But Kane had a certain future value on the day of the trade. The exact amount is not known yet but it can be estimated more accurately now than it could then.

Your last paragraph sums it up. How good Buffalo is in the future as a result of that trade will include the return they get for Kane and it may be substantial.

 

[Whileee]

I don't think I said that but he is certainly less than Roslovic. Just allowing for some flexibility in the value estimate.

Lemieux has been back on the goon, idiot, penalty train again lately. We don't need that. He behaved himself pretty well during his stint with the Jets but if he can't sustain that then he is not going to make a positive contribution to the Jets, IMO. Unless the contribution comes in trade.

I'm very encouraged by the progress he has shown this season but if he can't stay out of the box I don't want him. IIRC he took a couple of fighting penalties while he was here. They were in the line of standing up for teammates and I like that. I don't hold those penalties against him. It sounds like some of his recent ones were just undisciplined temper tantrums though. I'm still on the fence.

He has been very disciplined in every appearance with the Jets. I think he's highly motivated to play and stay in the NHL and will rein in his hot-headed stuff as necessary. Meanwhile, he's a high energy, fast and physical forward scoring at a point/game in his second AHL season. That's a good prospect.

 

[Whileee]

I agree that you have to draw a line somewhere but not sure how. If a player was acquired in trade and then traded on shortly after how do you count that? I think each player is a package with a certain net value. That value is all that he brings from that point on. You don't need to trace every trade and add them all up. But Kane had a certain future value on the day of the trade. The exact amount is not known yet but it can be estimated more accurately now than it could then.

Your last paragraph sums it up. How good Buffalo is in the future as a result of that trade will include the return they get for Kane and it may be substantial.

Would you trade Roslovic straight up for Kane right now? How about Armia?

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

He has been very disciplined in every appearance with the Jets. I think he's highly motivated to play and stay in the NHL and will rein in his hot-headed stuff as necessary. Meanwhile, he's a high energy, fast and physical forward scoring at a point/game in his second AHL season. That's a good prospect.

I agree he is a good prospect. If he can remain disciplined once he begins to feel secure with the Jets then there should be no problem. I was quite impressed with his play here.

But I will continue to have reservations about him until I see him play well and responsibly for an extended time. I took the reports of his off-season work as a very good sign. I'd say that all-in-all I'm more optimistic than pessimistic about him.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Would you trade Roslovic straight up for Kane right now? How about Armia?

I regretted the necessity of trading him in the first place. It was necessary but his power forward play was missed.

With all his baggage no, I wouldn't trade him right now for either one. Ignoring the baggage it would be a difficult decision for Armia, not that hard with Roslovic. Armia brings so much more than just scoring and Roslovic's potential is so high by the time you consider ages, contracts etc, I think the answer is no.

 

[Aavco Cup]

Plus, he can actually skate.

I loved Wellwood's skill, but speedster he was not.

It was interesting to hear Wheeler the other day comment how Roslovic is the team's best performiing player in fitness testing. Surpassing Scheifele is something that must have made the coaches take notice.

 

[Aavco Cup]

Don't get me wrong, I like what the Jets got out of it, but it seems like we forget that Kane is still an effective top six player in the NHL.

Kane doesn't seem to be playing the way he was here in Winnipeg. A lot less aggressive forechecking. Perhaps it's the Buffalo system?

 

[antiqueslivers]

probably playing a lil safer to give himself the best chance at being healthy and trade baitable.

 

[Whileee]

I regretted the necessity of trading him in the first place. It was necessary but his power forward play was missed.

With all his baggage no, I wouldn't trade him right now for either one. Ignoring the baggage it would be a difficult decision for Armia, not that hard with Roslovic. Armia brings so much more than just scoring and Roslovic's potential is so high by the time you consider ages, contracts etc, I think the answer is no.

I agree.

Case closed on who got the better of the trade.

 

[PhilJets]

Jets are 1st in the west and here we are discussing 4 pages of Evander Kane

 

[Aavco Cup]

Jets are 1st in the west and here we are discussing 4 pages if Evander Kane

2nd

 

[AlphaLackey]

15/16: 65 GP 20 G 15 A 35 Pts
16/17: 70 GP 28 G 15 A 43 Pts
17/18: 43 GP 16 G 19 A 35 Pts

I dunno, he's been a pretty effective player for them.

Kane has put up decent numbers over that time. If that's worth the off-ice distraction that immediately came with it and the near certainty that this year will be his last there, that's only for a true hockey mastermind like Tim Murray to say.

Not that Kane has done nothing, but I think we'd agree he's nowhere near the dollar signs they had in their eyes when they picked him up.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

I agree.

Case closed on who got the better of the trade.

That's what I've been saying.

I had been on the fence for quite a while - just waiting to see what we had in the futures. With Armia's play this year and further progress from Roslovic and Lemieux I can see enough.

 

[Monkey D Luffy]

Jets are 1st in the west and here we are discussing 4 pages of Evander Kane

It's so fun to hate him though

 

[Adam da bomb]

Is Lowry going to play next game? Did he sit last game because it was Buffalo and needed to rest up for Chicago?

 

[Aavco Cup]

Is Lowry going to play next game? Did he sit last game because it was Buffalo and needed to rest up for Chicago?

Day to day with UBI

 

[StiffSquid]

Hopefully he waits until we re-sign him to hit such lofty point totals

He's on a pretty decent Pace for 36 points this year. That's with some pretty limited ice time until recently.

 

[Neuf]

You know who I like is that Ryan o'Reilly fellow.

 

[Adam da bomb]

He's on a pretty decent Pace for 36 points this year. That's with some pretty limited ice time until recently.

Yea, these blow out games are killing us long term. We need to win low scoring games where no one can ask for more money afterwards.

 

[Mud Turtle]

It was so fun to watch Zach Bogosian’s hockey sense on display again.

 

[JetsFan815]

Here's my thoughts on the Kane trade. I am definitely in the camp who thinks that it is wrong to say that the Jets "won" the trade and the Sabres "lost" the trade. First of all, Jets did not trade for Roslovic, they trade for the 25th overall pick in the 2015 draft.

Myers is a moderate upgrade on Bogo (although the gap is bigger this season). I can say that the Jets "won" this portion of the trade slightly.

As for the Kane portion of the trade. It is at best an even trade. Kane is going to be moved again this deadline (for a 1st and a prospect) so at the end of the day the Kane side of the trade really ends up looking like

Lemieux + Armia + 2015 25th overall pick + 2 years of Stafford + 5th round pick in 2018 from the Stafford trade

for

3 years of Evander Kane + 2018 1st round pick (likely in the 20s from the Kane trade this deadline) + prospect (Dano level most likely via Kane trade) + maybe a late round pick from the Kane trade

Even ignoring the opportunity cost of having Stafford on the team for 2 seasons, when I look at that, it looks like a pretty even trade to me. Even more-so if you consider a lot of Stafford's time here after the 2015 playoffs as negative value.

It was a good trade for the Jets that they likely do again if given the choice, Buffalo likely doesn't make that trade again in hindsight BUT that has nothing to do with it being a failed trade for them, it has to do with the rebuild process of that organisation not turning out as expected. IMO we can say that it's a good trade for the Jets but it is wrong to say that one side "won" or "lost" that trade. Some Jets however act like it was Forsberg for Erat level of fleecing which is just not true.

 

[Mud Turtle]

Loved the trade then and love it even more now!
Chevy is a great general manager and our scouts have done an incredible job setying this franchise up for many years of success to come.

 

[PhilJets]

The bottom 6:

Lowry and Copp are 2 of our most valuable bottom 6 forwards.

Plus that Perrault guy
Who currently plays big minutes due to injury to 55
See his goals per 60mins riding in that 4th line? Elite

Then Armia and Hendrick fits in nicely with the chemistry.

The 6th forward you can probably put anyone there.
But Tanev fits in perfectly also as he hussle and hussle and hussle. You need 1or2 of them. Not anybody can be
Patrik Laine
All that kid does is fire a wrist shot above the right circle sometimes it goes in though.

If not Tanev on that last forward.
Someone who is physical like lowry.

But overall

The Team is great!!!!!

Go Jets Go