Post-Game Talk: Jets 5 Oilers 4

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

Yeah, so much groaning about the game and that own goal was really the difference. Without which maybe the Oilers even W in reg time.

That said, people are expecting too much saving between the pipes. You get it once in awhile but the last month or so its to the point of ridiculous. We are getting outshot in nearly every game and the goaltending is almost always being the difference for us. Not a sustainable formula. You take the pts and be happy, but the team play has to be optimal for this team to have a chance. Quite clearly the Oilers again started this game last night not playing their best and giving up 2 goals in the first. How quickly this team forgets that it often only scores 1 or 2 goals in a game. We gave up the tenable amount of GA in the first damned period. Despite recent games this Oilers club has a lot of trouble scoring goals. But they forget that completely after a couple games in which they've been able to score.

The frustrating part is how quickly this team becomes casual about such things.

Last night's third period was very reminiscent of years past with the Oilers clinging to the lead and having no offensive pressure. I said they needed a goal early in the third because the Jets weren't going to go away. Hopefully they're a little better today. Philly is no defensive stalwart but they have a few weapons up front that have really hurt the Oilers. Giroux and Voracek come to mind.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

Goalies are suppose to make saves no?

sub 900 save last night isnt the reason we got to OT. Its the reason we lost.

Weird, Hellybuck had a .845sv% and his team won.

Maybe it's about more than numbers.

 

[CupofOil]

Goalies are suppose to make saves no?

sub 900 save last night isnt the reason we got to OT. Its the reason we lost.

As I said, it's all so simple to you. Looks at save percentage, says it's all his fault and doesn't bother to look at any context nor cares to because the poster spends most of his time the last 3 seasons posting anti-Talbot rhetoric and refuses to budge off stance because of a miles thick agenda.

 

[Drivesaitl]

And also made 16 saves in the 3rd just to get that game to OT but the peanut gallery conveniently ignores that.

I say this while also adding that he gave up 2 bad goals (Laine and Morrissey) so no bias here. I like to see both sides of it unlike some people.

3 on 3 though is a different beast because the goalie has to look at so many scenarios. The play happens quick in OT and Morrisey gets that cross pass in full flight and gets it away quickly. its impossible to be set on that play. Not sure why people are considering it simply a bad goal. If the Oilers scored that goal nobody here is saying it was weak.

Mention as well that we left every Jets sharpshooter alone in the slot last night and Talbs saved us on a number of occasions.

Nothing wrong with people acknowledging we have two capable goalies now, a good thing, and both are better than what hellbuck looked like last night. Nobody mentioning that we won the goaltending battle once again. As we always do the last month.

Hellbuck was far worse than Talbot in this game and not even close.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

3 on 3 though is a different beast because the goalie has to look at so many scenarios. The play happens quick in OT and Morrisey gets that cross pass in full flight and gets it away quickly. its impossible to be set on that play. Not sure why people are considering it simply a bad goal. If the Oilers scored that goal nobody here is saying it was weak.

Mention as well that we left every Jets sharpshooter alone in the slot last night and Talbs saved us on a number of occasions.

Nothing wrong with people acknowledging we have two capable goalies now, a good thing, and both are better than what hellbuck looked like last night. Nobody mentioning that we won the goaltending battle once again. As we always do the last month.

Hellbuck was far worse than Talbot in this game and not even close.

The Jets GDT was railing on Hellybuck even more than HFOil rails on Talbot.

 

[frag2]

Goalies are suppose to make saves no?

sub 900 save last night isnt the reason we got to OT. Its the reason we lost.

Goes back to that saying I said in Talbot's first year and seemingly every year after-if we gotta score 5 to win, then he's no good. Our D will always have its warts

The one thing with Koskinen that I have seen so far is that he seems much stronger mentally. He seems to move on quicker from a bad goal. He also mentioned that he doesnt care about his statistics, all he cares is about winning. He seems to just make the saves when they are needed. Seems like theres something about finnish personality which translates well for goalies (unless its Rask).

Talbot has seemed better under Hitchcock. He didnt lose the game last night and he didnt win it either. Main thing with him is that he just seems much more fragile mentally. He gets rattled easier and cant seem to move on bad goals or bad games that well. I think we need to be patient with Talbot and try and get him to work on his focus and confidence with Hitchcock. Talbot is trending in the right direction. Its a long season, we will probably need him at some point.

I think Hitch has a system that helps goalies in that they aren't always 5* chances when the opposition shoots. I mean, Elliot was a top 5 goalie IIRC in St Louis under Hitch

 

[Drivesaitl]

The Jets GDT was railing on Hellybuck even more than HFOil rails on Talbot.

That's the kind of thing people pay no attention to seemingly. But its the first logical thing that should be considered. In hockey if your goalie played far better than the other goalie you probably shouldn't blame the result on goaltending.

Conversely in Football or baseball if the pitcher or QB is playing much better than the opponent do you blame the result on QB or pitching? Its inane, and people do it incessantly.

It speaks to general laziness of thought and non evaluation. People just pick the easiest position to blame results on without a modicum of thought involved.


That said the Jets board SHOULD be on Hellbuck. He's vastly overrated and a deep Jets club that plays the game right and basically dominates through depth should expect far lower GA than they are getting. He's a real average goalie. He's really a limiter on how far the Jets can go and if they had better they would be a SC contender.

 

[GMofOilers]

Goes back to that saying I said in Talbot's first year and seemingly every year after-if we gotta score 5 to win, then he's no good. Our D will always have its warts

Every D in the league has warts, look at the Jets last night. We exposed their D plenty of times.

I shouldnt have to argue about Talbot this year, it should be crystal clear that he was a big problem last year and this year. His numbers last year and this speak louder then words. When you compare them to Koski it should be the end.

 

[GMofOilers]

That's the kind of thing people pay no attention to seemingly. But its the first logical thing that should be considered. In hockey if your goalie played far better than the other goalie you probably shouldn't blame the result on goaltending.

Conversely in Football or baseball if the pitcher or QB is playing much better than the opponent do you blame the result on QB or pitching? Its inane, and people do it incessantly.

It speaks to general laziness of thought and non evaluation. People just pick the easiest position to blame results on without a modicum of thought involved.


That said the Jets board SHOULD be on Hellbuck. He's vastly overrated and a deep Jets club that plays the game right and basically dominates through depth should expect far lower GA than they are getting. He's a real average goalie. He's really a limiter on how far the Jets can go and if they had better they would be a SC contender.

FTR I actually agree with this.

My point is to all the people that think Talbot stole a point. He did not.

 

[ThePhoenixx]

I praised Nurse, and you lost your Siht...completlry turned my words.
That;s not a victim mentality. that's you pushing your propaganda.LOL

I have one poster on ignore. One. After nearly 14 years.

 

[ThePhoenixx]

Its a constant scapegoating board. The GDT comments and PGT comments are almost always unreasonable day of the game. Things start to get more sensible after hours pass.

Agree with you entirely, it was a team loss. The Oilers completely laid down in the 3rd. Frankly the Oilers only played well in the 2nd. I'll take the point.

The people criticizing Nurse are the same posters that were critiquing him before the game was played, or any other time.

You do the same thing. You just pick different victims.

 

[CupofOil]

Every D in the league has warts, look at the Jets last night. We exposed their D plenty of times.

I shouldnt have to argue about Talbot this year, it should be crystal clear that he was a big problem last year and this year. His numbers last year and this speak louder then words. When you compare them to Koski it should be the end.

Yes, he's been poor this season. The game last night was not entirely his fault however.

Can you just admit one thing? That he did his job making 16 saves under heavy pressure in the 3rd getting the game to OT? It'll show that you at least have a little objectivity in regards to the player.

 

[Drivesaitl]

You do the same thing. You just pick different victims.

Wow, being called out for calling out the play of players like Lucic and Spooner.

So no, not the same thing but I don't think you get the difference.

 

[ThePhoenixx]

Wow, being called out for calling out the play of players like Lucic and Spooner.

So no, not the same thing but I don't think you get the difference.

Like I said...you can copy and paste this post and each critic can claim the same thing.

Wow, being called out for calling out the play of players like Nurse or Draisaitl.

So no, not the same thing but I don't think you get the difference.

Wow, being called out for calling out the play of players like Caggs and Kassian.

So no, not the same thing but I don't think you get the difference.

Like I said...you just feel that your victims are legitimate.

 

[GMofOilers]

Yes, he's been poor this season. The game last night was not entirely his fault however.

Can you just admit one thing? That he did his job making 16 saves under heavy pressure in the 3rd getting the game to OT? It'll show that you at least have a little objectivity in regards to the player.

Well he lost the lead and OT in the 3rd, so I guess he did his job.

My point was that he didnt steal a point last night.

 

[CupofOil]

Well he lost the lead and OT in the 3rd, so I guess he did his job.

My point was that he didnt steal a point last night.

No, he didn't steal a point but he held the fort in the 3rd. The tying goal was far from his fault, the OT goal is another story.

 

[Drivesaitl]

Like I said...you can copy and paste this post and each critic can claim the same thing.

Wow, being called out for calling out the play of players like Nurse or Draisaitl.

So no, not the same thing but I don't think you get the difference.

Wow, being called out for calling out the play of players like Caggs and Kassian.

So no, not the same thing but I don't think you get the difference.

Like I said...you just feel that your victims are legitimate.

This is gibberish.

You're bored today and looking for something to pick at. I'm not interested.

.

 

[Drivesaitl]

Every D in the league has warts, look at the Jets last night. We exposed their D plenty of times.

I shouldnt have to argue about Talbot this year, it should be crystal clear that he was a big problem last year and this year. His numbers last year and this speak louder then words. When you compare them to Koski it should be the end.

What games are you watching? The Jets covered McD as good as any team does. To the point where McD was so frustrated that he took two undisciplined penalties. Mcd might have zero pts last night without questionable goaltending from Hellbuck. Every goal scored against him, if happening the other way, would be pinned on Talbot and you would be doing it.

Koski has been a lot better than I expected. That is good news. But its too early to write off a guy that was our savior all of 16-17 and was the reason we got into the playoffs. As I've detailed before Talbot also rediscovered his form in March and April of last season and has played much better in his last 4 starts.

One gets the sense you are hoping pucks get by Talbot when he's in net. Its really starting to feel that way.

 

[Yablo21]

I'm just talking about last night and I know that Koskinen is the better goalie.

I'm just talking about the double standard around when it comes to certain players. You said a goalie needs to keep the goals down to 2 or 3 yet Koskinen let in 4 the previous game with two being very stoppable yet not a peep from.some about those soft goals.

Lol at "not a problem" that Koskinen wins that game last night. Did you see the 3rd period? That would have been a problem for any goalie in the league. I'm more confident with Koskinen in net but that was a very difficult goalie game for the Oilers.

Koskinen as a big goalie may have gotten tired with 17 shots against and 40 attempts in one period. There's absolutely no way anyone can say he wouldn't have let in 2-3 goals. I am a huge Koskinen fan, but people crapping on Talbot after he single handily got them a point, no help in the 3rd, need to give their heads a shake.

 

[TopShelfGloveSide]

Koskinen as a big goalie may have gotten tired with 17 shots against and 40 attempts in one period. There's absolutely no way anyone can say he wouldn't have let in 2-3 goals. I am a huge Koskinen fan, but people crapping on Talbot after he single handily got them a point, no help in the 3rd, need to give their heads a shake.

When a team scores 4 goals then the goalie didn’t single handily get the team a point.

 

[SnooPac]

I don't know why, but that OT goal felt like a kick to the gut. Maybe it was the McDavid post seconds earlier, or the bad play (by Talbot? Drai/Nurse?) I dunno.
Even though I know we 'should' have lost. After missing everyone, and getting destroyed in the 3rd...still, just felt that game could have been had. Should have been had even .

About Talbot. I felt like he was the main reason we got 1 point last night. Simultaneously in a good way (3rd period) and a bad way (OT).

Anyway, on to the next one.

 

[SnooPac]

Anyone have a gif of McDavid steamrolling Myers? And then hit someone else right before the high sticking penalty?

Do you remember when this happened? I could look for it if you let me know where/when to look.

 

[Yablo21]

When a team scores 4 goals then the goalie didn’t single handily get the team a point.

So 16/17 saves in the 3rd period wasn't enough for you, he made timely saves and got them a point. There were 2 he should have had yes, but that doesn't make him a 'bad' goalie. Like I said before RNH has scored with that same shot several times. Guess that was only against 'bad' goalies.

 

[TopShelfGloveSide]

So 16/17 saves in the 3rd period wasn't enough for you, he made timely saves and got them a point. There were 2 he should have had yes, but that doesn't make him a 'bad' goalie. Like I said before RNH has scored with that same shot several times. Guess that was only against 'bad' goalies.

Missing my point. The forwards scoring four goals and talbot being average got them a point. The OT goal was garbage. If you think a goalie letting in five goals and half of them garbage is great goaltending than I can’t help you. An 870 save percentage and a 5GA really salvaged us that point boys !

 

[Yablo21]

Missing my point. The forwards scoring four goals and talbot being average got them a point. The OT goal was garbage. If you think a goalie letting in five goals and half of them garbage is great goaltending than I can’t help you. An 870 save percentage and a 5GA really salvaged us that point boys !

We were dominated and giving up 5 bell chances, so numbers don't tell the whole story. As they often don't. Has Talbot been good enough this year no, was he good enough last night, yes. We were a goal post away from 2 pts, and the OT goal is essentially a breakaway, goalies get beat on that shot all the time. But the hate will blind those who already are done with Cam.

P.S. I'm still a Kosko fan and I think he should be the starter no questions asked over Cam.