Post-Game Talk: Jerks 5 - Penguinos 1 : Buncha Jerks Indeed

Ryder71

Registered User
Nov 24, 2017
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Didn't watch the game because i don't want to waste my time for Sullivan but crazy that the shots were 36-18 for the Pens. Anyways, F(ire/u*k) Sully. I mean, F FSG and Duba, its's them who aren't doing their jobs
You're wrong! Dubas is letting this team SINK! That's precisely what he should be doing! He's not the one who handed out contracts to Letang and Malkin, that was hextall. They insisted on staying! So now, they suffer!

This might have been the most feckless loss of them all

What a low point
Oh my precious sweet friend, it's gonna get worse! We need difference makers through the draft. At least three years of top 4-8 overall picks! And we need to hit on them!
 

Luigi Lemieux

Registered User
Sep 26, 2003
22,040
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Gonna be hard to out tank some of these teams. Pens at 25th in p%. Barring lottery would be drafting 8th as it stands.
 

Tacitus Kilgore

Registered User
May 26, 2010
6,829
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Potomac, MD
This might have been the most feckless loss of them all

What a low point

I have no doubt that it can, and will go lower. My gf got me tickets to go see the Pens vs Caps in Wsh in January. She's never been to a live hockey game before. Dammit I hope we at least make a game out of it.

Gonna be hard to out tank some of these teams. Pens at 25th in p%. Barring lottery would be drafting 8th as it stands.

Woo Derrick Pouliot
 

Honour Over Glory

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You're right - I've watched this team for a long, long time. They've had terrible coaches with terribly untalented teams many teams., but this team has enough talent that they shouldn't be this bad. That's a reflection of the coach's strategy and/or his ability to motivate them. The only other explanation is that they have a boatload of really bad contracts that those 70's/80's/early 2000's team didn't really have. They do however have some throwback players - Karlsson is playing like an expensive Ron Stackhouse, Letang is playing like an expensive Mario Faubert, Tristan Jarry is playing like Gordie Laxton, and so on.
I know blokes hate mentioning Disco, but this is where Disco was always better with getting the most out of his line-up and when you look around the league, I mean hell, look at the Islanders in the last game, the players they were without are the equivalent of the Pens being without - Pettersson, Grzelcyk, Crosby, Rust, and a depth D-man like a Shea/St Ivany.

If Sullivan was without those players as long as the Isles have been, he’d have his excuse that he’d milk with Werner behind the scenes to get the heat off of him, but the Islanders even found a way to beat the Pens ass with a push back.


Also Jesus mate, Laxton comparison to Jarry? Lol that’s harsh and Jarry only played 2 games so he’s not an excuse at all after the team passed the 5 game mark and even then he was 1-1 so again his impact negatively or positively is negligible for that reason. But the key indicator is neither goalie after have done well with keeping more than 3+ out of the net, the Penguins have literally done it twice this season and both teams are some of the worst in the league for offense so it isn’t even worth noting as any sort of feat out of 15 games.

Also their record vs shit teams and better teams is comical.

Pens record vs Habs, Ducks, Sabres, and Wings is 23GF 13GA (5-0, 3 regulation wins, 2 OT wins)
Pens record vs Isles, NYR, Canes, Flames, Canucks, Jets, Oilers, Leafs, and Wild is 18GF 39GA (0-7-2)

Score at a 4.6 GP/G against shit teams, allow 2.6 GA/G
Score at a 2.00 GF/G against better teams (incl hobbled Isles) and allow 4.33 GA/G

They still allow the highest high danger chances against, most high danger shots against, luckily the Hawks suck a little more which puts the pens 2nd last for high danger goals against, and they’re tied with the Habs for allowing the most goals against (Habs are worse, with 57 goals against in 14 games to the Pens 15, imagine the Sharks being better than the Pens lol).

It’s comical that he’s survived this long, so many coaches were fired early last season and some mid season - Evason, Woodcroft, Berube, Lambert, Smith, McLellan, and Ruff all during the season.

At the end of the season - Vincent, Hakstol, Quinn, Granato, Keefe, Bowness retired.

Of these teams only a couple missed the playoffs in consecutive seasons prior to them being fired: Sharks, Senators,

Blues missed the year before and Berube had a short leash, he was fired 28 games in, Bannister didn’t make the playoffs the rest of the way. Evason was fired after being bounced in the first round 3 times and they didn’t see improvement.

All of these teams have higher standards than the Penguins, the Penguins have become a team that prioritizes their respect and adoration for a coach’s previous success more than his current failures that have extended into 7 seasons of failures.

Yohe's obsession with Karlsson is almost as weird as his mancrush on Sullivan.
I called it, why am I even shocked at this point.

In the Isles game, Karlsson was pretty f***ing solid given the circumstances, he wasn’t liable for any goals against and the game before that he was insanely active at trying to get shots on net and attempts, yet Yohe found the smallest shit to make a gripe about him.
 

Honour Over Glory

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So on X/Twatter seems like the Pens reporters we all mention good or bad, are now pouring on Karlsson, which is just bizarre. It’s like they all secretly agreed on their WhatsApp Group “Sully’s Sack Lickers” that they need to push a scapegoat this year to keep the heat off of Sully and chose him.

Karlsson has some bad moments but I think everyone focuses on it more because of what he’s also capable of with production. But he hasn’t really been as bad as they want to make him out to be which is just weird. It maybe makes it an easier focus because Sullivan is coaching this team to shit in a defensive system that is illogical for all the players.
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Like where do I see the part that makes Karlsson the worst on defense in this? Where? His Corsi, Fenwick, his HDGF? SCF? PDO?

Lol like what? f*** sakes, it’s stupid to see the names that are on him right now on X.

And yeah I went all situations because that’s a fair look rather than just ES.
 
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DearDiary

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Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't Dubas have an outrageously long contract, like 5 years left after this year? Too bad they can't invoke a "firing with cause" - if there were ever reasons for such a termination, the idiotic acquisition of Karlsson and the equally idiotic Jarry signing would qualify.

Dubas doesn't need to be fired, he needs to return to being team President full time. Then hire a new GM. It's ridiculous that he's juggling both positions
 

Honour Over Glory

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So EK is the new whipping boy this year eh???

Meanwhile Letang’s been hot garbage for years now but he somehow gets a free pass?? :eyeroll: :shakehead
Letang and Grz are literally the two worst D-men on this team and Karlsson has been our best, yet the narrative pushed by Yohe, Rossi, Jesse, etc is Karlsson is a problem. Lol, really? EK has had like 4+ good games in a row, has 1 rough one and they’re just absolutely ready to pounce. Meanwhile, Letang hasn’t had a good game twice in a row.
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Honour Over Glory

Blomqvist for Vezina + ROTY
Jan 30, 2012
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Dubas doesn't need to be fired, he needs to return to being team President full time. Then hire a new GM. It's ridiculous that he's juggling both positions
President of Hockey Operations, yeah - He’s done a fantastic job in that role imo.
As a GM, he hasn’t been great or bad, he’s kind of mediocre so far - but I also think this is a team that is radio active to a lot of executives because of how things have gone down with JR, Hextall, Burke, Reirden, Recchi, Gonchar, Martin, etc all being fired or scapegoats for Sullivan who has the full backing of FSG and unwavering support by them as well as a lot of say in the roster.

If you’re a bloke wanting your chance at being a GM finally, do you take that job knowing you can’t fire the coach unless ownership lets you and the coach has more power than you and could taint your GM career before it even begins? I wouldn’t. That’s a shitty situation to go into knowing it could ruin your career. JR saw the writing on the wall and left before it left a stink on him and took Allvin with him and hired Tocchet and Sarge when he could.

I have said it before but I sincerely believe when Sullivan is finally fired, Dubas will step back and he will hire a GM to take over the rest of the Pens situation moving forward. Dubas didn’t want to be GM anymore, he knew his bread and butter was in the original role that Toronto never wanted to give him with full autonomy from Shanahan. He got the Pens initial role with full autonomy to hire the people he needed to, but we all knew that meant Sullivan was untouchable either way because of how FSG views him.

The potential candidates before they hired Dubas as the POHO was something like - Botterill, Chayka (lol), Darcie, Martin, and Bergevin, the Hawks denied the Penguins permission to speak to Greenberg. Greenberg was a name that was first reported after the Hextall and Burke firings. That was back in May or so of 2023, by September Greenberg left the Hawks anyway to take the Detroit Tigers GM job. Greenberg’s Dad has strong ties to Mario and typical Pens and their cronyism also had Bergevin on their list. Chayka though? His sister is the brains, the brother is a dipshit, the fact that he was on the reported list…I mean that’s a not so great list.

Tulsky was on the list as well but I don’t think the Canes gave permission to speak to him.
Darche the year before was in the running for the Habs and Ducks GM jobs and they chose Hughes and Verbeek and I think Darche didn’t want to leave Tampa either as I think he has a succession plan like Colorado and Carolina did with their ace AGM’s.

 

Honour Over Glory

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I know weeks before Dubas took the role himself temporarily - Greeley from the Stars, Darche, and Botterill were the names that were still clanging around.

I never got the impression Darche would leave Tampa and the way Kyle put it was he wanted a Gm that had knowledge of the role that he didn’t and was progressive etc, which I mean that’s probably closer to Darche and Greeley, not Botterill.

Greeley never made any sense to me as a GM candidate at all, he was hired by the Stars the year before, he was essentially doing a Director of Hockey Operations type of role for Dallas, which he would have made sense for if the original plan was - Dubas as GM, Greeley as President of Hockey Operations, FSG openly pined for Dubas as their top choice, but were interviewing several others in 2nd round interviews, Tulsky being hte best of the bunch, more on that later.

Greeley is a Masshole so for me, that checks out why FSG was so interested and given his background, the Hockey Ops part made sense. Also he has ties to David Quinn as an Associate Coach at BU for 2yrs (obviously unrelated at the time in 2023), was a scout for the Kings, Player Personnel for the Rangers for 2yrs, AGM for Buffalo with Botterill, then took on Hockey Strategy and some other shit for Dallas the year before Dubas was hired. He’s also quite young at 44 in comparison to the others.

I think Dubas likely agreed to be interim GM because FSG really wanted him as GM and it was pretty well known, but Dubas was clearly more interested in the personnel side as President of Hockey Ops. Darche was in the running for a lot of GM jobs yet didn’t leave Tampa or some other reason those teams chose other options - Canucks, Ducks (before Pat), Sens (Owner chose his BFF instead), Jackets (recently), Habs (wanted to hire an experienced mentor for Darche), Pens, etc. But Darche valued his close friendship with Brisebois and didn’t leave, Julian even came out and said he’d have to accept that Darche is a great candidate and that he’d lose him some day. Tulsky and Darche were the two talked up future GM’s after MacFarland in Colorado finally took over from Sakic. I think for the Pens GM Candidate, you would look for a bloke that has some a very deep scouting and development background given this GM would be the bridge to the new Pens era with the last remnants of the old. I didn’t see Darche as that yet, Tulsky made more sense and he was done dirty by FSG.

Tulsky likely felt f***ed over and said piss off to the Pens - He was one that had a 2nd round of interviews and FSG was impressed by him but they held out hope Dubas would become available and when he did, they jumped at Dubas immediately, so this whole time Tulsky has 2 interviews, has FSG talk him up and then they chose Dubas as the first choice for Gm but Dubas chooses Hockey Ops and by then Tulsky is like eat shit, FSG.
 

BillyOcean

Registered User
Jan 2, 2015
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I really hope they're playing these middling grinders in the bottom 6 to enhance their value and trade them. Otherwise, I really don't see the point of playing them over guys in the AHL.
 

TooManyHumans

Registered User
May 4, 2018
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Karlsson needs to be with a defenseman who can actually defend so that Karlsson is free to push the offense. We don't have that guy, especially with Pettersson regressing this year. I don't really blame Karlsson for not being someone radically different than he has always been. It is the team's fault for expecting that and not getting a guy he can play with and be successful.
 

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