Player Discussion Jeremy Swayman -VI President Cam Speaks: Monty, Donny, & Charlie too!
- Thread starter Gee Wally
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No idea what he’s using for comps. No idea what Sweeney is using for comps. No idea what Sweeney has tabled for offers. No idea what Swayman has asked for.
If the rumors are to be believed and the numbers were 6.4 and 9.5, i don’t think either said is out of line with their first pitch
LSCII
Cup driven
First off, copying the blues is f***ing dumb. Their cup was an anomaly and they tripped into by catching lightning in a bottle with a hot goalie that has done nothing but suck since that run. Counting their cup win they’re just as likely to pull a playoff DNQ as they are to make it.
Now, on to Florida. They had a good mix of depth and physicality. Sure. No doubt. But they also had four forwards that were either just under a PPG or well over a PPG. The Bruins keep ignoring that piece of it because they have Pasta and then it drops off a cliff. And all the 10 goals per year depth guys slotting up to the top six aren’t going to suddenly make this anything other than a one line team.
Which is and has been the problem for years. Stop Pasta in the playoffs and the Bruins are an easy out.
Everyone talks about $8.5M - $9.5M long term starting now would be "crippling the team" and that he needs to prove a full workload and #1 status before getting paid but if he signs short term for less and does well and asks for a deserved $10 or $11M in 3 years, won't he still be "crippling the team", and not leaving money for the rest of the lineup for the next 8? What would be the right amount in 3 years if all goes well? Wouldn't it be better to still have him at $8.5M for all those back end years? Since all of us believe he could be the long term answer to great goaltending stability, isn't that a safer bet than worrying that we'd have to match a $10M or $11M deal in 4 years? Or should we look for the next Korpisalo in a few years?
smithformeragent
Moderator
What’s any player worth?
Pay a goalie $12 million and it could cripple your roster to the point where you can’t surround him with the pieces to win a Cup.
Same could be said about paying a winger who scores 70 goals $10m.
But if you have the right complimentary pieces in place at the right value, any contract can be “worth it”.
Helps massively when you connect in the draft and have guys on entry level and bridge deals contributing to your club rather than overpaying the middle of your roster in free agency.
It’s all about making the pieces of the puzzle fit and then getting a little bit lucky in May and June.
Is Swayman “worth X”?
That’s for us all do debate.
Why should he settle for less just to get a deal done?
Pay a goalie $12 million and it could cripple your roster to the point where you can’t surround him with the pieces to win a Cup.
Same could be said about paying a winger who scores 70 goals $10m.
But if you have the right complimentary pieces in place at the right value, any contract can be “worth it”.
Helps massively when you connect in the draft and have guys on entry level and bridge deals contributing to your club rather than overpaying the middle of your roster in free agency.
It’s all about making the pieces of the puzzle fit and then getting a little bit lucky in May and June.
Is Swayman “worth X”?
That’s for us all do debate.
Why should he settle for less just to get a deal done?
LSCII
Cup driven
They filled a hole in the top six at center and then created another at wing when they let JDB leave and didn’t replace him. So I don’t see it.
And now they’re playing games without their best goalie, whose absence will be a huge issue making the lack of top 6 players even more crucial
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smithformeragent
Moderator
Yep.
It’s been “throw crap against the wall and hope for the best” at various spots in the top 6 for years now.
To their credit, they’ve still managed to be regular season juggernauts year after year, but when teams really hone in and match lines in the playoffs, they become rather easy to wear down.
ON3M4N
Ignores/60 = Elite
What if I told you between regular season & playoffs last year he started 55 games?
Dr Quincy
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- Jun 19, 2005
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Why is the Swayman contract the only contract affecting that? Why not Zadorov and Lindholm? When Dean Letourneau is on his 2nd contract we'll be paying those 2 guys over $12m combined on the wrong side of 35.
Yeah thinking the Panthers won because of Gadjovich and Lomberg and not having Barkov, Reinhart, Verhaeghe, Tkachuk, Tarasenko and Lundell (oh and a goalie making $10m) is missing the whole point.
bearcountry17
Registered User
A big reason Florida won was they had guys like Reinhart, Bennett, Verhaege, and Forsling on sweetheart RFA deals.
You're right, the Swayman contract isn't the only contract affecting that, but it contributes to it. For the record, I hate that Zadorov contract too.
My issue with paying goaltenders premium money is the fact that they only play 50-55 games a season and when they do play, they save you about 1 extra goal every 4-5 games.
As for the playoffs, yeah, I've seen elite goalies carry teams. I've also seen average ones do it too.
SwayHeyKid
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- Mar 14, 2022
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also the GM saying both he and Ullmark wanted to start 55+ games each and that's impossible so they dealt Ullmark. Sweeney has zero qualms about Swayman being able to be a 55 plus play-offs, but for some reason "fans" keep bringing it up
LSCII
Cup driven
The time to sign a guy like Swayman to a team friendly deal was last year. Instead they went to arbitration and made it contentious by dragging him through the mud. You don’t have to view everything as a mail and think you’re the hammer, but that’s what they do.
Fire Sweeney
Registered User
It's obvious Swayman is not worth that kind of money, but Donald dug his own grave by trading Ullmark for nothing and not even generating any cap space.
A creative GM would have traded Swayman for a king's ransom last year and we would be heading for a cup contending season.
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smithformeragent
Moderator
As this situation continues to drag on:
Please keep the conversation pertinent to the topic and avoid making it personal.
Debate about the management of the salary cap and the performance of the general manager fits into the context of the conversation, but we’ll avoid dividing fans into camps like “pro-player” and “team apologist”.
Thanks!
Please keep the conversation pertinent to the topic and avoid making it personal.
Debate about the management of the salary cap and the performance of the general manager fits into the context of the conversation, but we’ll avoid dividing fans into camps like “pro-player” and “team apologist”.
Thanks!
Dr Quincy
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- Jun 19, 2005
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Sure, and so having a $10m goalie didn't hurt them.
Another big reason they won is they didn't overpay for UFAs on July 1.
Let's say Sway signs for 8.5m.
What price do people think you'd pay for a top 15 starting goalie 3 years from now? Because it's not going to be $5m, and it's not going to be $6m. Maybe it's 7.
The amount that Swayman would be overpaid (if at all) between what some want to pay and what he might make really isn't that big. It's like people are saying "If he take $9m, that's $9m you can't use to pay Lohrei!!!!" But it's really only $2m, which can be trimmed at other parts of the roster.
I get your logic, but I think you have it backwards. Instead of taking the thought process of "slightly overpay now, and the market value will catch up over the term of the contract" I'd rather take the logic of "pay market now, and extract value over the term of the contract".
From a club's point of view, that's the whole point of adding term....to gain value. Not just with Swayman, but with any player...My thoughts on goalies in general, still stands.
Trimmed how ? Freddy is up after this season as well as a few others.... It's not as simple as you say what do you think 37 63 33 40 all took team friendly deals? To keep the team competitive if they paid those guys what they were worth we wouldn't have been able to sign a lot of other players that made us competitive the past decade Plus no way should we be paying a guy that won one playoff round in his career and has never played more than 44 regular season gamesmore than 7 million dollars
I'm aware of that. Even Sorokin bought his time and was a starter for 3 seasons before being given his $8.25M AAV deal...and the other guys making $8M+ either have cups, vezinas or 500+ NHL games.
Swayman needs to be a little more patient.
ON3M4N
Ignores/60 = Elite
Tough to do when you see all these other young guys coming off ELC's and getting 8yr deals for $8 million+
You see teams shelling out big contract for less proven guys, but goalies don't get that same treatment. Goalies for some reason need to be superstars with numerous accolades before getting paid
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Boston Bruno
Mostly not serious input..
I think Sweeney has made a good attempt his year to build a solid roster, one of my biggest bitches with him over the years was that he did not build his team in the off season, but waited until the trade deadline. I, do think a RW is still something that needs to be worked on, and a goal scorer. Everyone wants Swayman signed agreed, but if he signs for anything less than what he really wants he is not going to be a happy camper. My fear it could have a negative effect on this team, especially with the new players.
LikeHe should not. He should take as much money as Anaheim will give him
bearcountry17
Registered User
Dennis Bonvie
Registered User
LSCII
Cup driven
Maybe? Depends on whether Lindholm is healthy, and how Coyle looks. Given Linholm isn't healthy right now, its hard to guess what he's going to look like and whether he'll be in the lineup. And Coyle to me is a guy like Geekie and others that you're really slotting up to spots they're not ideally suited for because the holes. He had a good season production wise last year, but that season is the anomaly in his career so far. Until he does it again, it's hard to expect him to equal or surpass that.
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