Confirmed with Link: Jeff Carter Traded to Pittsburgh / Jeff Carter Appreciation Thread

[Kudelski37]

Saves more money, frees up more cap space immediately. The picks have low odds of converting to the higher value. He was worth more to the team looking to improve ASAP by being completely off the books.

Or maybe it’s just Uncle Phil’s money and no fan should care how it’s spent, right?

A buyout this summer would have a higher cap hit for 21-22 (~3.9 million) and a cap hit for 22-23 (666k), according to cap friendly, compared to the Kings retaining (~2.6 million) next season for the trade. Capfriendly shows the buyout split50/50 between Kings and Pens so the numbers need to be added to see the full buyout if the Kings had kept him and bought Carter out this summer.

 

[DoktorJeep]

Barely saves money, we have very little need for cap, draft picks are trade chips too (see Faber), he's off the books and not hindering the team from improving.

It's not that we shouldn't care about AEG's pocketbook, but that Carter being traded vs. Carter being Robidas-Island'ed is barely a drop in the bucket, and one that is mitigated through TWO draft assets.

In a flat cap world, every dollar saved has heightened value. Having $5M+ free and clear next year would greatly increase flexibility to make moves. At the end of the day moving Carter does help that, but it was another half measure, not a full measure.

A buyout this summer would have a higher cap hit for 21-22 (~3.9 million) and a cap hit for 22-23 (666k), according to cap friendly, compared to the Kings retaining (~2.6 million) next season for the trade. Capfriendly shows the buyout split50/50 between Kings and Pens so the numbers need to be added to see the full buyout if the Kings had kept him and bought Carter out this summer.

My understanding is the full remaining salary (little over $2M I believe) is off the Kings books. That was the primary objective in my opinion and why a buyout was never considered. If Hextall hadn’t offered enough for Carter, he would have been in the lineup and retired a King, barring injury.

 

[mysterman2]

I like the idea people think "draft picks are worthless." Someone already mentioned the trade of picks to move up and select Faber; Kings got the 45th pick in exchange for the 2020 51st and 97th overall picks being sent to the Detroit Red Wings. Faber has all the making of a solid top 4 dman.

But when we look at the Kings other 2-4rth rd picks...

2017 Entry	41	2	Jaret Anderson-Dolan	C	Spokane Chiefs [WHL]	30	6	5	11	6
2017 Entry	72	3	Matthew Villalta	G	Soo Greyhounds [OHL]
2017 Entry	103	4	Michael Anderson	D	Waterloo Black Hawks [USHL]

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

2018 Entry	51	2	Akil Thomas	C	Niagara IceDogs [OHL]
2018 Entry	82	3	Bulat Shafigullin	F	Nizhnekamsk-2 (Russia Jrs.)
2018 Entry	113	4	Aidan Dudas	C	Owen Sound Attack [OHL]

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

2019 Entry	33	2	Arthur Kaliyev	R	Hamilton Bulldogs [OHL]	1	1	0	1	0
2019 Entry	50	2	Samuel Fagemo	R	Frolunda HC [SweHL]
2019 Entry	87	3	Lukas Parik	G	Liberec [Czech Jrs.]
2019 Entry	95	4	Jordan Spence	D	Moncton Wildcats [QMJHL]
2019 Entry	119	4	Kim Nousiainen	D	Kalpa [Finland Jrs.]

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

2020 Entry	45	2	Brock Faber	D	U.S. National Under-18 Team [USHL]
2020 Entry	66	3	Kasper Simontaival	R	Tappara Jrs. (Finland)
2020 Entry	83	3	Alex Laferriere	R	Des Moines Buccaneers [USHL]
2020 Entry	112	4	Juho Markkanen	G	Kettera Jrs. (Finland)

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

And note- the Kings for the 2021 draft have 5 picks in the first 3rds. Solid drafting by Blake for the most part.

 

[KingsFan7824]

In a flat cap world, every dollar saved has heightened value. Having $5M+ free and clear next year would greatly increase flexibility to make moves. At the end of the day moving Carter does help that, but it was another half measure, not a full measure.



My understanding is the full remaining salary (little over $2M I believe) is off the Kings books. That was the primary objective in my opinion and why a buyout was never considered. If Hextall hadn’t offered enough for Carter, he would have been in the lineup and retired a King, barring injury.

The Kings still pay half his salary.

Here's the problem with LTIRetirement; the player has to be on board. He has to not feel like playing anymore, or have some sort of injury. If Carter wants to play next year, which seems to be the case, you can't just put him on LTIR because you feel like it. Nor can you buy him out if he's injured. Not that the Kings have been shy about buying players out the last few years.

 

[DoktorJeep]

The Kings still pay half his salary.

Here's the problem with LTIRetirement; the player has to be on board. He has to not feel like playing anymore, or have some sort of injury. If Carter wants to play next year, which seems to be the case, you can't just put him on LTIR because you feel like it. Nor can you buy him out if he's injured. Not that the Kings have been shy about buying players out the last few years.

I get it that LTIR isn’t something that can be forced onto a player. Cap circumvention penalties are fire able offenses. Good to know about the retained salary. I couldn’t tell from CF if it was cash and cap retained or just cap.

But if Carter had been Robidas’d, would Blake not be praised as an evil genius, cold hearted, smooth operator? My overall point is that fans expectations of management are not consistently high enough.

 

[Chazz Reinhold]

In a flat cap world, every dollar saved has heightened value. Having $5M+ free and clear next year would greatly increase flexibility to make moves. At the end of the day moving Carter does help that, but it was another half measure, not a full measure.

The Kings will have approximately $15 million in cap space as it is. They will have more than enough to leverage cap space if they need to.

 

[Lt Dan]

The Kings will have approximately $15 million in cap space as it is. They will have more than enough to leverage cap space if they need to.

Not to mention that we are never a destination for the high quality UFAs.

 

[DoktorJeep]

The Kings will have approximately $15 million in cap space as it is. They will have more than enough to leverage cap space if they need to.

Good news is that we’ll find out in a couple of months.

 

[KingsFan7824]

I get it that LTIR isn’t something that can be forced onto a player. Cap circumvention penalties are fire able offenses. Good to know about the retained salary. I couldn’t tell from CF if it was cash and cap retained or just cap.

But if Carter had been Robidas’d, would Blake not be praised as an evil genius, cold hearted, smooth operator? My overall point is that fans expectations of management are not consistently high enough.

I'm not a fan of abusing LTIR the way teams may have done, or might currently be doing. You still do it if you can, because you're only hurting yourself if you don't, but there is nothing about Carter that says LTIR. Unless he felt like retiring without retiring, but apparently that's not happening.

 

[Chazz Reinhold]

My overall point is that fans expectations of management are not consistently high enough.

I’d much rather Blake ensure continuing pipeline viability by getting a 3rd and 4th (or 2nd and 3rd if things break our way) for an aging and ineffective Jeff Carter than try to duplicitously engage in a violation of the CBA by attempting to force a player (who clearly wants to continue to play) to stop playing, all while pissing off the players remaining on the roster by the deplorable treatment of someone who is by all accounts loved by the players and a great friend of theirs. Not to mention draw the ire of the league and the NHLPA.

If those are low expectations then I must be a pretty bad fan.

 

[DoktorJeep]

I’d much rather Blake ensure continuing pipeline viability by getting a 3rd and 4th (or 2nd and 3rd if things break our way) for an aging and ineffective Jeff Carter than try to duplicitously engage in a violation of the CBA by attempting to force a player (who clearly wants to continue to play) to stop playing, all while pissing off the players remaining on the roster by the deplorable treatment of someone who is by all accounts loved by the players and a great friend of theirs. Not to mention draw the ire of the league and the NHLPA.

If those are low expectations then I must be a pretty bad fan.

Rob Blake said on 3/27 that he was done trading vets. Two weeks later he does that. I’m glad you take solace in the evergreen hopes of draft picks. But I prefer a GM whose actions match their words.

LAKI

Looking Ahead
– Blake discussed how, moving forward, the strategy for the Kings is to add moving forward. Any potential deals he is looking at making would make the team better at this stage. After last season’s deadline, where the Kings moved out some veterans for future assets, he believes they have now put that foot forward, to add to the core in place. He said there have been numerous discussions so far, but those discussions support improving the Kings.

How does that statement match what happened with Carter? He moved a vet and the returns on the deal aren’t adding to the core in place.

And if you were hoping to avoid pissing off the players by not dealing with Carter using kid gloves, well, Coach Todd had this to say just two nights ago.

LAKI

On the mood of the team right now
I can’t lie to you guys, we need a little bit of an adjustment there. We worked hard for a number of months right now, we’ve worked hard and we can’t give it back. We may not win as many games as we want, but first of all bring the effort, we’ll help you with the structure and the execution part but you’ve got to absorb some of that and put it into play as a player. Whatever’s happened over the last week has happened, we’ve got to move on, that’s just the way it is. Players come and go all the time, new players come in, we’ve got to find a way to welcome them and they’ve got to find a way to fit in. We’ve got to fix things. It’s not all going to be wins and losses related, the repair work in practice is very limited, we’ve talked ad nauseam about how little time we get, but other teams are fixing things on the fly too. Our group, I don’t know if it’s inexperience that they’ve got to feel it on the ice or walk through it more often than just seeing it visually, but right now, we’re not capturing things and it’s costing us.

Sounds like the players were unhappy by the move anyway.

 

[head eyes]

Rob Blake said on 3/27 that he was done trading vets. Two weeks later he does that. I’m glad you take solace in the evergreen hopes of draft picks. But I prefer a GM whose actions match their words.



How does that statement match what happened with Carter? He moved a vet and the returns on the deal aren’t adding to the core in place.

And if you were hoping to avoid pissing off the players by not dealing with Carter using kid gloves, well, Coach Todd had this to say just two nights ago.




Sounds like the players were unhappy by the move anyway.

Wasn't it Carter himself that said he was open to being traded?

 

[DrHansReinhardt]

I get it that LTIR isn’t something that can be forced onto a player. Cap circumvention penalties are fire able offenses. Good to know about the retained salary. I couldn’t tell from CF if it was cash and cap retained or just cap.

But if Carter had been Robidas’d, would Blake not be praised as an evil genius, cold hearted, smooth operator? My overall point is that fans expectations of management are not consistently high enough.

No, circumventing the CBA by abusing the LTIR or 'forcing retirement' lol as if that's a thing, is not a badge of honor. More accurately makes said GM a conniving d bag. Breaking news; cheating is bad.

 

[SFKingshomer]

Maybe they should play better if they don't want their bff's traded? That is the problem with this culture. They want to be buddies and that's great! You still have to train, practice, and play games hard if you want to continue being teammates. They need Lombardi and Sutter to kick them in the ass. f*** it, bring in Galant or Tortorella when he's fired. Whip these willows into shape...

 

[Chazz Reinhold]

Rob Blake said on 3/27 that he was done trading vets. Two weeks later he does that. I’m glad you take solace in the evergreen hopes of draft picks. But I prefer a GM whose actions match their words.

If you actually watched the Blake press conference about the trade deadline you'd know that the Penguins approached the Kings in early March about trading for Carter. Blake, being the respectful and deferential person he is when it comes to the remaining core members of the championship teams, approached Carter (who did not have a NTC) and presented him with the opportunity instead of simply trading him. Carter was not inclined to be traded then. Blake did not trade him.

The Penguins came back to the Kings about Carter at the deadline (after your March 27 date of concern). Carter was willing to be traded at the point. Blake traded him.

So, as of March 27, how was Blake being disingenuous about not trading vets. At that point he was working off of a base of knowledge that Carter did not want to be moved.

What's your point? That a fluid situation changed over the course of time?

How does that statement match what happened with Carter? He moved a vet and the returns on the deal aren’t adding to the core in place.

On if he considered adding pieces to the roster over the last few weeks

We looked at different options there. Reluctant to move picks and prospects at this time. We were looking at different things there. The focus the last few days there was getting Alex done. We knew where we were there. The moves to further get better and improve will take its course over the summer.

And if you were hoping to avoid pissing off the players by not dealing with Carter using kid gloves, well, Coach Todd had this to say just two nights ago.

Sounds like the players were unhappy by the move anyway.

If you think

• The reaction of players being disappointed losing a teammate and friend (who did not have a NTC but was given the courtesy of choosing if he wanted to leave or not) to a team that is going to give him another chance to win a Cup before he likely retires

=

• The reaction of players if Blake tried to strongarm Carter (without giving any deference to Carter's wishes at all) into no longer playing a sport and profession he clearly wants to keep playing

then I have no idea what to tell you.

 

[bouncesonly]

Sounds like the players were unhappy by the move anyway.

That's what they're unhappy about? lol

 

[SFKingshomer]

I’m going to cry like a baby if they trade Brown.

 

[kilowatt]

Saves more money, frees up more cap space immediately. The picks have low odds of converting to the higher value. He was worth more to the team looking to improve ASAP by being completely off the books.

Or maybe it’s just Uncle Phil’s money and no fan should care how it’s spent, right?

We have $20 million in cap space next season with a couple league-minimum salaries to potentially re-sign (Lizotte, Andersson, etc). The only guy left to sign who might make more than a million is Athanasiou.

We're retaining $2,636,363 on Carter's cap hit, but we're only paying $1,000,000 in real dollars. If he wins a cup this year with Pittsburgh, he probably retires anyway, so that's even more potential savings.

Barring injruy, Carter will be playing in every game for Pittsburgh, and there's a decent chance for them to make it to the Finals, but even still a third and a fourth are good picks to have. Some recent third and fourth picks from LA: Kasper Simontaival, Jordan Spence, Kim Nousiainen, Mikey Anderson, plus guys like Martinez and Quick.

I think you're just backtracking to save face so I'll drop it, but this was a great trade for both LA and Pittsburgh.

 

[KingsFan7824]

I’m going to cry like a baby if they trade Brown.

Maybe if they're out of the race by next year's deadline, and only if Brown chooses to leave. That's going to be the case with all 4 of the current lifers.

 

[SettlementRichie10]

And Smyth, Penner, Ponikarovsky (he had decent numbers Before joining the Kings), Regehr, Mitchell, Gagne

Oh god. I completely forgot about him.

 

[King'sPawn]

Rob Blake said on 3/27 that he was done trading vets. Two weeks later he does that. I’m glad you take solace in the evergreen hopes of draft picks. But I prefer a GM whose actions match their words.



How does that statement match what happened with Carter? He moved a vet and the returns on the deal aren’t adding to the core in place.

And if you were hoping to avoid pissing off the players by not dealing with Carter using kid gloves, well, Coach Todd had this to say just two nights ago.




Sounds like the players were unhappy by the move anyway.

Holy shit. You'd be hammering into Blake if he added vets, because "he said he would", thus showing he's inflexible.

The team was still a bit of a long shot a couple weeks ago as far as making the playoffs. The team is dead in the water now.

Plans change with the circumstances. There are good reasons to criticize Blake, but trading Carter instead of taking an illegal action by forcing Carter to be LTIR or terminating his contract to save a few bucks is the strangest hill to die on.