Post-Game Talk: Jazz

[CasusBelli]

And every time this discussion comes up people think of the exceptions that continue to be very good players past their early 30s, but the thing is, almost every single one of them is worse than they were in their late 20s, and on top of that, they are only remembering the players who stayed good enough to be impact players despite the almost inevitable decline.

You forget about most of the guys who hit a wall at 30 and silently transition out but it’s like, most of them.

Many star players - even those who aren’t Panarin-level talents (which Mika isn’t) - can stay top-6 effective into their 30s despite a decline, but the writing has been on the wall with Zibanejad that he was approaching a cliff and people ignored it because they want to believe that hitting 30 SHOULDNT be an obstacle.

But it is. And it’s getting him bad.

For me it’s 30-32, but that depends on the player type, position, etc. No doubt that 30 seems to be Mika’s number. The Mika contract simply broke the cardinal rule: you offer contracts based on what you think a player will do for you, not on what he has done for you. If the player cannot get on board with the figure, he can find a place elsewhere, and you can deploy your long term cap space more wisely.

 

[mas0764]

How so?

Because if you were to track player performance across the whole league the vast majority of production nosedives at that age range. It’s not 35, it’s more like 30 or 31.

Again, you can cite plenty of guys who defy that and stay great till late 30s but they are the exceptions.

I don’t agree. making stupid passes instead of shooting isn’t physical. the vast majority of the time i’m screaming at my TV about a dumb play by him is a stupid decision.

Well, we will see. I’ve certainly argued that Kakko’s problems are mental (and I argued that about Lafreniere before that as well). I would have thought Mika would be beyond confidence issues though.

 

[savebyrichter94]

 

[SnowblindNYR]

I will say, we did look good at 5 on 5 for a second game in a row. Weird game where it really didn't look like we should lose. But horrible officiating, defensive lapses, Mika, and Mr. 12 million dollar man lost it for us.

 

[CasusBelli]

Because if you were to track player performance across the whole league the vast majority of production nosedives at that age range. It’s not 35, it’s more like 30 or 31.

Again, you can cite plenty of guys who defy that and stay great till late 30s but they are the exceptions.


Well, we will see. I’ve certainly argued that Kakko’s problems are mental (and I argued that about Lafreniere before that as well). I would have thought Mika would be beyond confidence issues though.

Basically it’s guys with exceptional instincts, who stayed mostly healthy throughout their careers and don’t play an overly physical game or who have changed their games to revolve around passing or shooting as their speed evaporates. To your point, that’s great news for the Lidstroms and the Ovechkins; not so much for the Bures and the Lindroses.

 

[Shesterkybomb]

It's an organization that doesn't belong in the league. It's a disgrace, the arena they played in last year, the season they had and the fact that that team was sold as an NHL franchise

Has nothing to do with the players they assembled. All the issues you're talking about were from Arizona and Pheonix.

 

[17futurecap]

Shouldn’t GA be 1?

That’s five on five.

 

[Shesterkybomb]

Chytil needs Mika’s OT minutes. It’s obvious to everyone but the guy with the most hair product.

Chytil didn't do much with his ot time, basically kept circling between the red and blue line, not saying I disagree but if he wants that time he's gonna push the pace.

 

[Kords]

Here's the line change before the gwg. Guy about to hop over the boards looked off sides to me in real time too.


Utah are young, undisciplined, and sloppy and got away with it all night.

 

[mas0764]

The good news is that I think Panarin will stay an elite player beyond this contract. We talk about freeing up his salary when his contract ends, and when you get to that age the end can come suddenly, but it wouldn’t shock me if he’s worth another contract when this one is up, albeit at a reduced price.

The bad news is that we might not be able to afford that because we gave all those extra years and dollars to the guy it was clear would not last into his late 30s.

Had to have those two ECF appearances though. Glad we mortgaged the future for them.

 

[CasusBelli]

But yeah the narrative this year is everybody should be rooting for Utah but not me. Sorry these terrible teams don't interest me one bit.

Hated Vegas from day one by the way, and I couldn't have been more right because look what that scumbag organization has become.

Easily my least favorite organization. I hate the Devils, Isles and the rest of them, but I don’t have a problem with the organization. Leafs, Bruins and Habs fans are as obnoxious as they come, but I still don’t have a problem with those organizations. Vegas is just … evil.

Here's the line change before the gwg. Guy about to hop over the boards looked off sides to me in real time too.


Utah are young, undisciplined, and sloppy and got away with it all night.

I thought I saw too many men for an instant, but I didn’t realize there were five. Jeez.

 

[WojtekWolski86]

Wasn't this the same ref combo that boned us in the playoffs?

Did we switch to man-to-man D for some reason? Or do Trouba, Mika, and Miller suffer from goldfish syndrome?

Great comeback, overcame a lot of adversity for loser point. Shame that the huge save by Igor in OT is rewarded with his teammates airing him out to dry a minute later.

 

[CasusBelli]

The good news is that I think Panarin will stay an elite player beyond this contract. We talk about freeing up his salary when his contract ends, and when you get to that age the end can come suddenly, but it wouldn’t shock me if he’s worth another contract when this one is up, albeit at a reduced price.

The bad news is that we might not be able to afford that because we gave all those extra years and dollars to the guy it was clear would not last into his late 30s.

Had to have those two ECF appearances though. Glad we mortgaged the future for them.

We’re truly in cap hell. Someone will simply have to go. Our NTC / NMC guys are basically out of the question. Maybe Trouba waives after this season, once his wife has completed her residency, since he’s over 30. Lindgren should go because he’s one injury away from death. But then we need to find replacements. We still don’t have a replacement for Igor. I wonder if the answer is a Mika buyout, trading those other pieces and Igor, and using the returns to get some studs in mid 20s. Not superstars — just the right players for the system.

 

[mas0764]

I’m not sure the Mika contract is buyout-able.

 

[effen]

They underestimated this Utah Hockey Club and it cost them. They dominated stretches when they cared. They paid for their globetrotter attempts.

The aroma was exquisite.

I don't care about Miller having 137% corsi share, guy needs to go.

 

[will1066]

Mika's mind wandered. "Utah Hair Club?" He imagined their players undulating on the ice in their flowing locks, just like his. Mika began to smile. He ran his hands through his hair. Not a split end in sight. His mind then turned feverishly towards the techno beats of his imagination. What if the Hair Club wants to go clubbing with me after the game? The buzzer suddenly snaps him out of his daydream. He had actually vacated his spot in front of the net, allowing Utah Hockey Club to score the winning goal. Mika's teammates were not amused. Mika's solemn face didn't dare betray to the team his mental musings that had occurred just before the overtime goal.

 

[MysticLeviathan]

We’re truly in cap hell. Someone will simply have to go. Our NTC / NMC guys are basically out of the question. Maybe Trouba waives after this season, once his wife has completed her residency, since he’s over 30. Lindgren should go because he’s one injury away from death. But then we need to find replacements. We still don’t have a replacement for Igor. I wonder if the answer is a Mika buyout, trading those other pieces and Igor, and using the returns to get some studs in mid 20s. Not superstars — just the right players for the system.

buying out mika would be a disaster of epic proportion. he has way too much term left for it to not kill us for years

 

[majordomo]

We’re truly in cap hell. Someone will simply have to go. Our NTC / NMC guys are basically out of the question. Maybe Trouba waives after this season, once his wife has completed her residency, since he’s over 30. Lindgren should go because he’s one injury away from death. But then we need to find replacements. We still don’t have a replacement for Igor. I wonder if the answer is a Mika buyout, trading those other pieces and Igor, and using the returns to get some studs in mid 20s. Not superstars — just the right players for the system.

Trouba doesn't have to waive....there are 15 teams he can be traded to without his permission.

 

[effen]

I’m not sure the Mika contract is buyout-able.

It's not. It's all bonus money.

buying out mika would be a disaster of epic proportion. he has way too much term left for it to not kill us for years

It would have no effect, he makes $1M salary a year. They'd save like 400k/yr. You can't buyout bonus money.

 

[Glen Sathers Cigar]

Couldn’t watch tonight but saw the OT goal. Wtf was Mika doing? This guy is becoming a liability.

Still have nightmares about his turnover in game 4 vs Florida.

I keep seeing stuff about the refs. Were they that bad? Were we sloppy? How was Igor?

 

[effen]

Lav is going to let Mika figure it out all year, he's going to be a major contributing factor in a 1st round exit, and they're going to roll him out through middle of next year.

So when you think about it, only 15 more months of Mika sucking before he's demoted.

 

[tomobson]

20 - 72 - 24

The line that never should have been broken up in the first place.

 

[Guyute]

Put Laf on PP1 and put Mika on PP2. Mika needs negative incentives to wake him up.

 

[Brutananadilewski]

Trouba doesn't have to waive....there are 15 teams he can be traded to without his permission.

Wasn't the brouhaha this offseason was that he gave the Rangers a list of teams he was willing to be traded to, teams that couldn't make a move for him.

 

[Clark Kellogg]