Rumor: Jakob Chychrun wants to be traded to a playoff team

[SeanMoneyHands]

A player who has been wasting his career playing in a wasteland known as Arizona now wants to be on a real team with an actual fanbase. Shocking.

 

[seafoam]

Wait until the deadline guy.

A player who has been wasting his career playing in a wasteland known as Arizona now wants to be on a real team with an actual fanbase. Shocking.

Not every player is unhappy playing in a place that warm all year round like Arizona. Bad take…

 

[Trash Panda]

Wait until the deadline guy.


Not every player is unhappy playing in a place that warm all year round like Arizona. Bad take…

Guys on overpaid contracts and those on the downslope of their career are big fans. Reclamation projects are pretty fond as well.

Culture in AZ is broken.

 

[jmelm]

I would do Greig, OTT '23 1st (top 3 protected), WSH '23 2nd and Zaitsev for Chychrun tbh.

I would take that from an Arizona POV. That's a fair offer.

 

[hbk]

Guys on overpaid contracts and those on the downslope of their career are big fans. Reclamation projects are pretty fond as well.

Culture in AZ is broken.

AZ culture is fine. BA and Tourigny are rebuilding the right way. AZ fans for the most part are very optimistic of the future.

 

[Hale The Villain]

Wait until the deadline guy.

No guarantee he's healthy at the deadline.

Hasn't had a season without injury yet. Only plays 70% of his team's games on average. And he's just coming off multiple surgeries this off-season.

 

[BurgoShark]

Nemeth just cost the rangers two 2nd like a month ago. Most obvious comp.

I agree it's probably the closest recent comparison. Similar contract terms (NTC, $7m cash remaining) but with a lower AAv.

Rangers NEEDED to trade Nemeth to make space though. No urgency on Ottawa's behalf. As much as Sens fans dislike him, it's not actually necessary to move Zaitsev this season. If they bury him in the minors have would still have sufficient cap space to acquire Chychrun and to sign Formenton.

2023-24 is when Ottawa have to start worrying. I think they will be happy to pay the price (via buyout, retention and/or picks) to move on from him next Summer. Paying a premium to move him now would be unnecessary.

... or perhaps Zaitsev will sustain a Chris Phillips-esque "undisclosed injury" in his final season.

 

[rt]

I would do Greig, OTT '23 1st (top 3 protected), WSH '23 2nd and Zaitsev for Chychrun tbh.

That looks like a deal to me. I’d do it.

 

[Wallet Inspector]

Buddy Arizona had higher attendance than the Sens did last year. Nothing quite like being a complete douche who can't even troll effectively, eh?

Congratulations on being an outstanding representative for your fanbase. We're all impressed

View attachment 588392

Source:

NHL 2021-22 team attendance at hockeydb.com

Attendance for the National Hockey League for the 2021-22 season

www.hockeydb.com

Yet season ticket holders are up now that the team is looking good.

 

[hbk]

Yet season ticket holders are up now that the team is looking good.

Up in AZ as well. Despite the smaller venue. Revenues were 4x what they were a year ago according to last report. .

 

[PainForShane]

We are both talking about how adding Chychrun could effect the cap situation. I've been through these cap calculations scores of times for 2023-24. I created a spreadsheet that I use to do "what if" scenarios and they can be done quickly. I have a few different spreadsheets where I modeled acquiring Chychrun and then made other roster adjustments.

If we resign Debrincat at $8.5 m, and Zub at $4.5 m, plus give Pinto a new contract, we are likely going to have a cap around $81 million conservatively. Zaitsev is already traded and his salary is subtracted in this model. This model also includes replacing vet defenders like Hamonic & Holden with ELCs (Thomson & JBD), not resigning Talbot and replacing him with Sogaard (another ELC), and going with a 4th line composed of all ELCs/league minimums (except Motte). Naturally Stutzle's $8.35 m is included as well as the core players (Chabot, Tkakchuk, Batherson, Norris, etc.).

So, we would end up with $85 - $86 m cap if we add Chychrun's $4.6 m. So, unless the cap goes up to $85 m in 2023-24 or more, we are going need to do some more major roster surgery to acquire Chychrun even with moving Zaitsev (& his salary) factored already in to this process, or alternatively, forgo doing the trade. Plus, we don't know if the owners intend to spend to cap either.

I'm guessing they are trying to figure out how to move Zaitsev at a lower cost and so far they are loathe to trade away pieces like Pinto, Grieg and Sanderson. I guess the thinking is they will move Zaitsev later, either at the TDL or next summer during the off season (possibly/likely after the signing bonus has been paid). They'll run with some ELCs to fill some slots on defense next year and give them some ice time this year to help with transition.

Sounds good, thanks for sharing your thoughts. They all make sense (as I'm sure you know already, obvi you don't need me to tell you that). Longer post but enjoy having these more well-thought out discussions rather than the nonsense you sometimes see on the main boards (and that I replied to a short while ago smh)

Anyway I would push back on two macro level things:

1) I really disagree that you can assume Zaitsev will be able to be easily dumped. A lot of ppl here are talking about, "what is the cost to dump Zaitsev" but everyone seems to be forgetting you also need 2 willing trade partners. If you take a quick look at everyone's cap, imo right now really only AZ and BUF can take on dumps (maybe Anaheim / Chicago I guess), and for us this year... I mean we have enough defenders and ideally some of our D prospects like Koly and Soderstrom (and Dineen, ugh) will be ready to see more NHL time. I mean, sure if you pay us enough we'll take Zaitsev but it means messing up our roster for this year and maybe the future, that drives the cost up even more than it already is.

If you're talking about next summer, Chicago definitely enters the discussion but maybe BUF goes away -- could easily see a future where Tage Thompson and Skinner each score 35-40 again, if all their young guys Cozens / Krebs / Power / Dahlin / Joki etc take another step or two, UPL is waiting in the wings and suddenly this team is not terrible anymore. A lot of ifs but BUF's prospects are actually good players, at some point they should develop and the standings should reflect that. Regardless, just realized they haven't really been active in taking on bad contracts so maybe they were never really an option anyway. Seems a bit weird, but I digress.

Anyway re: contracts, looking at it another way if it were easy to dump bad contracts, everyone would be doing it, players like Kerfoot, Nyqvist, Benn / Seguin, Hornqvist etc would all be on different teams, we've all been hearing about those guys for YEARS. And Patches and MAF were both at least all-star level when they were traded (MAF had just won the Vezina), they would've got some sort of return. All that to say I wouldn't assume you can easily dump Zaitsev's contract, esp if AZ decides they're not interested for whatever reason. Such as some version of "we won't take Zaitsev unless it's part of a Chychrun package which also includes X, Y, Z" which honestly wouldn't be the most surprising thing in the world.

2) When you see "major roster surgery" upcoming I really don't, at least not compared to other teams who are really in cap trouble. Again, not as familiar with the Sens so if you're saying total cap of around 85-86 with one of Chychrun or Zaitsev sure let's go with that. Assuming that number is true, all that needs is trading Mathieu Joseph and his multi-year ~3m salary, that gets you almost all the way there esp when you consider you might be able to save another 1m bc you don't need to roster a 7th D (the ELC guys are all waiver exempt, this assumes JBD instead of Brannstrom, not sure if that's realistic).

But either way I wouldn't describe that as major roster surgery. Joseph's playing bottom 6, losing him wouldn't blow up your team -- roster-wise it seems like someone like Grieg could probably take Joseph's roster spot without too much pain in the short term. And from a business perspective, yes Joseph just signed a 4 year deal but he had to go all the way to arbitration to get it, I'm sure Dorion didn't want to pay him as much as he did.

Anyway re: cap I'd ask you to take maybe 10-15 mins to poke around Capfriendly to look at other teams' situations, I think you'll find most teams are in way more cap trouble then the Sens will be in 2023-2024. Certainly other teams are in more long term trouble because you guys have a lot of cap falling off in summer 2024 (Murray retention, Bobby Ryan, MDZ) and imo are pretty well set up for the future after that.

So yeah! Those are my opinions and maybe they are wrong. And maybe you disagree and if so that is ok. But, thx for taking the time / sharing where you're coming from, feels good to use these forums for actual discussion for once (even if the posts are long). Really appreciated from over here

 

[rt]

AZ and OTT fans slinging mud is like two jockeys fist fighting about who wins runner-up in the World’s Tallest Midget challenge.

Could anyone care less?

 

[ReginKarlssonLehner]

So more than DeBrincat trade Sens just made, why..

Zaitsev is included in that trade.

 

[Akrapovince]

That looks like a deal to me. I’d do it.

Would 2024 Ottawa 2nd also work for you?

 

[GCK]

That looks like a deal to me. I’d do it.

I think Ottawa gets far more value out of Greig on an ELC for 3 years than Chykrun for 3 years especially with the 7M in Chykrun’s 3rd year. The Sens need to watch spending as much as caphit.

 

[rt]

Would 2024 Ottawa 2nd also work for you?

Sure

 

[AvroArrow]

Edmonton should be all over this.

Their fans seem more than happy with their blue line, even if they were to make a proposal what can they really offer ?

 

[Coyotes19c]

Their fans seem more than happy with their blue line, even if they were to make a proposal what can they really offer ?

Might hurt but EDM absolutely has the assets.

 

[armani]

AZ and OTT fans slinging mud is like two jockeys fist fighting about who wins runner-up in the World’s Tallest Midget challenge.

Could anyone care less?

One legged men in an ass kicking contest.

 

[SensFan1010]

The issue I have with Chychrun is he seems to be very injury prone and a lot of people are looking past this. Sure he is a top defencemen but thats when hes healthy

 

[SaltyElkHunter]

The issue I have with Chychrun is he seems to be very injury prone and a lot of people are looking past this. Sure he is a top defencemen but thats when hes healthy

That’s why his value is most likely 2/3 of what is currently being asked. Hence why he hasn’t moved yet.

 

[SR]

A player who has been wasting his career playing in a wasteland known as Arizona now wants to be on a real team with an actual fanbase. Shocking.

Says the blackhawks fan.

You guys were f***ing garbage for years and years. Horrible attendance for years, might have been even worse than Arizona or Florida. Welcome to the basement again with no assets whatsoever to show for it aside from 20 mil locked up in a couple guys at the twilight of their careers.

 

[rt]

Their fans seem more than happy with their blue line, even if they were to make a proposal what can they really offer ?

As a Yotes fan, I’d do Foegele, Bourgault and the ‘23 1st for Chychrun.

 

[KevinRedkey]

I'd trade Greig/Pinto + 2024 1st (top 3 protected) + another B asset (2nd?) if they also take Zaitsev.

I prefer Pinto BUT he has a higher ceiling than Greig and may play himself out of the 3C role pretty quickly in Ottawa (and has nowhere to go). Greig plays a better bottom 6 type game, and will be cost controlled longer. Plus he can play LW if needed

 

[playasRus]

1) I really disagree that you can assume Zaitsev will be able to be easily dumped. A lot of ppl here are talking about, "what is the cost to dump Zaitsev" but everyone seems to be forgetting you also need 2 willing trade partners. If you take a quick look at everyone's cap, imo right now really only AZ and BUF can take on dumps (maybe Anaheim / Chicago I guess), and for us this year... I mean we have enough defenders and ideally some of our D prospects like Koly and Soderstrom (and Dineen, ugh) will be ready to see more NHL time. I mean, sure if you pay us enough we'll take Zaitsev but it means messing up our roster for this year and maybe the future, that drives the cost up even more than it already is.

So yeah! Those are my opinions and maybe they are wrong. And maybe you disagree and if so that is ok. But, thx for taking the time / sharing where you're coming from, feels good to use these forums for actual discussion for once (even if the posts are long). Really appreciated from over here

Agreed with most of what you're saying, if not all. On the bolded part, depends how you define "easily". Yes it'd be easy to dump Zaitsev if you attach a 1st + 2nd with him today - but who is willing to give up that much for 7M cash, 4.5M AAV x 2 y cap?

I think market has set the price at 2nd + 2nd for this dump. If Ottawa has to choose between 2nd + 2nd vs x? they may choose 2nd + 2nd, for example over Chychrun today. They may choose to lose 2nd + 2nd if it's instead of, say, DeBrincat 9M x 8 years next summer. The hope is that by next summer, it's no longer the cost of 7M cash, 4.5M AAV x 2 cap relief, but instead 4.5M cash/4.5M cap x 1y, or even better, 2.5M cash/4.5M cap x 1y, which may only cost a 2nd + 4th for example for an "easy" dump, because 2.5M cash with no long term cap constraint is probably considered acceptable by most teams for a 50th OA pick.