Its so clear we have to get some grindyness (toughness and thugness)

[Trapper]

And Brad Marchand!

You don’t need to be 6’4. This is such a bad comparison to aggressive and intense. Heavy compete comes in different sizes. So does passive.

 

[Nylander88]

Wouldn't hate seeing a healthy Garrett Wilson on a line with Gauthier-Spezza.

 

[Ratboy]

Coachcorner isn't wrong. I foresee a time when we trade some skill for some grit and slightly less skill.

Hockey is still a violent sport where you can physically intimidate opponents and we need to answer the bell when that happens. I'm not saying we need a team of goons or just a colton Orr but we need some grit on each line I'd say.

Dubas says he won't do that but people do change their minds and if he doesn't adapt at some point he fails darwins challenge.

I really hated seeing Drouin take the piss with no rebuttal. It's kind of pathetic.

 

[Duffman955]

Washington
St.Louis
Boston
Vegas

All teams that play a hard nose game. All teams that have skilled players surrounded by grit

All teams that made deep playoff runs

 

[Stephen]

You don’t need to be 6’4. This is such a bad comparison to aggressive and intense. Heavy compete comes in different sizes. So does passive.

But the point remains. Let’s get some physically dominant 6’4” personnel.

 

[Stephen]

Coachcorner isn't wrong. I foresee a time when we trade some skill for some grit and slightly less skill.

Hockey is still a violent sport where you can physically intimidate opponents and we need to answer the bell when that happens. I'm not saying we need a team of goons or just a colton Orr but we need some grit on each line I'd say.

Dubas says he won't do that but people do change their minds and if he doesn't adapt at some point he fails darwins challenge.

I really hated seeing Drouin take the piss with no rebuttal. It's kind of pathetic.

We have enough dangle but we need straight to the net bulldozers to complete the job and a couple of redwoods on defense.

 

[Stephen]

Carolina is a good example of a skilled team that’s not particularly physical but what they do have is a strong defensive backbone with is a foundation for their skill game. We don’t have that ballast.

 

[All Mod Cons]

This guy doesn't get it either. I think some people are being stupid on purpose. I assume he doesn't actually listened to the criticisms and once again just hear "we need goons", "we need tall people" or "heavy people" etc.

Like is this guy actually believing some fans want the Leafs to sign Yao Ming to bump up the height average? Or is his suggesting the Leafs play anything remotely like the Bruins do?

Is he thinking some fans want more Justin Brazeau and less Brad Marchand?

Or is he just being a typical skill at all costs type person?

 

[Menzinger]

This guy doesn't get it either. I think some people are being stupid on purpose. I assume he doesn't actually listened to the criticisms and once again just hear "we need goons", "we need tall people" or "heavy people" etc.

Like is this guy actually believing some fans want the Leafs to sign Yao Ming to bump up the height average? Or is his suggesting the Leafs play anything remotely like the Bruins do?

Is he thinking some fans want more Justin Brazeau and less Brad Marchand?

Or is he just being a typical skill at all costs type person?

There are literally comments in other threads where posters here will dismiss a player based on 1-2 inches of height. So theres definitely a contingent of this fanbase that's still fixated on the raw measurements and weight of players

 

[Menzinger]

The last two Stanley Cups were played by

St.Louis Blues vs Boston Bruins
Washington Capitals vs Las Vegas Knights

But I’m sure there’s people here who still want more Marincin’s on this team

And the Pens have won two cups in the last five years-hardly a tough grinding team.

Imo folks need to stop thinking theres thisnclesr cut formula to building a cup winning team other than get good players

 

[Kiwi]

And the Pens have won two cups in the last five years-hardly a tough grinding team.

Imo folks need to stop thinking theres thisnclesr cut formula to building a cup winning team other than get good players

Their "skill" guys play greasy tough games

Crosby is one of the most functionally tough hockey players you will ever see, he plays like Hyman in the corners and has high end skill, Malkin is one of the best under the radar greasy players in the game today

If our "skill" guys played like that we wouldn't have the problems we currently seem to be showing

Us and the Pens shouldn't be mentioned in the same sentence

 

[Menzinger]

Their "skill" guys play greasy tough games

Crosby is one of the most functionally tough hockey players you will ever see, he plays like Hyman in the corners and has high end skill, Malkin is one of the best under the radar greasy players in the game today

If our "skill" guys played like that we wouldn't have the problems we currently seem to be showing

Us and the Pens shouldn't be mentioned in the same sentence

Well.the big gap here is experience more than anything else. The main. Pens guys had gone through the grind of the playoffs many times before. I think its something that's as learned as it is supposed "natural" instinct

 

[Kiwi]

Well.the big gap here is experience more than anything else. The main. Pens guys had gone through the grind of the playoffs many times before. I think its something that's as learned as it is supposed "natural" instinct

There is a reason Crosby is one of the finest players of his generation, not many players with high end skill have a Hyman like mentality and work ethic, Malkin isn't as good but he's a greasy plus skill mix that has elevated him to one of the best players in hockey history

You can develop situational toughness to some extent but if you still need that in your make-up to some extent to take you to the next level

There is a reason our 'skill' guys look great with Hyman, he's limited but he plays in a way that they either can't or won't, I'd kill for a couple more Hyman's on this team

That's my idea of "toughness"

 

[All Mod Cons]

And the Pens have won two cups in the last five years-hardly a tough grinding team.

Imo folks need to stop thinking theres thisnclesr cut formula to building a cup winning team other than get good players

Malkin is a dirty player to play against (not a slant on him), and Crosby absolutely, 100% is comfortable and very good at playing the grinding type of hockey required in the playoffs. And that's their two best players

 

[DavePoulin4PM]

Well.the big gap here is experience more than anything else. The main. Pens guys had gone through the grind of the playoffs many times before. I think its something that's as learned as it is supposed "natural" instinct

The Penguins had gone through the grind many times? Crosby and Malkin made cup finals in year 3.

Matthews Marner and co couldn’t even win a playoff series by year 3. Try harder, buddy.

 

[thewave]

The Penguins had gone through the grind many times? Crosby and Malkin made cup finals in year 3.

Matthews Marner and co couldn’t even win a playoff series by year 3. Try harder, buddy.

They made it back in year 4 and won. Two cup appearances in 4 years.

 

[Its not your fault]

There's toughness and strong. The farm and growing up working at a young age makes you tough. Hitting the Gym makes you strong. The games is now Strong and Fast. Most kids don't help like they used to on the farm or their families can't afford to do both. Most non eligible competitive players go to the gym when before the gym was mostly a run and practice.

 

[moon111]

Think the toughness is a leadership thing.
Nikolai Borschevsky would look like Wendel Clark compared to this lot.
But the entire team was 'pumped' in the direction of leadership.
In Toronto, the leadership is to be highly skilled, turn the puck over constantly,
score a lot of points against weak teams and utterly fail against top teams whether
in the regular season or the playoffs. Everyone follows this mantra.

 

[HamiltonNHL]

They’re the 8th heaviest team in the league

They dont look it. Must be fat.

 

[LeafSteel]

I don’t know why this is so hard to grasp.

Our team is skilled and soft. Our guys with size don’t use it nearly enough, with Muzzin being the only one who is consistent.

Our guys back down and skate away from scrums, with nary a face wash to be seen. That left with Nazzy.

I love the skill but man I would love a couple of guys who brought some abrasive attitudes to the team.

Given the choice, signing Kapanen vs. Ferland, I know what side of that fence I fall on.

Love our skill, but we have too much of the same and not enough of the sandpaper, and I blame Dubas for that. He’s had opportunities to add it and he just doesn’t. It doesn’t fit his vision and I don’t see it changing anytime soon, unless it comes from Shanahan.

 

[ICECOLDBEER]

Totally agree with this need some grit. Matthews gets into positions where he could put the other teams D through the boards. But what does he do? He slows and looks to try and pick their pocket/intercept their pass. Not saying he needs to cream everyone but when you have an opportunity to make contact finish the damn check!!!!

Nylander plays every game trying to avoid any contact at all costs. He's a good enough player that when he has the puck on his stick that it works for the most part as he usually finds an open man. But he's pretty much unwilling to take a hit to make a play and rarely drives to the net. Without the puck he is hopeless to get it back. He's quite happy to let opposing teams D get the puck out of the zone as long as he doesn't have to make contact. He might try a stick check or to steal the pass like Matthews but he's not nearly as good at it. Need these guys to actually start competing but i'm not sure we ever will.

 

[darrylsittler27]

This team is one of the wimpiest I have ever seen, with no pushback. Take your analytics and shovel it.

 

[Maple Leaf]

This team is one of the wimpiest I have ever seen, with no pushback. Take your analytics and shovel it.

I have given up. It might be over

 

[Stephen]

This team is one of the wimpiest I have ever seen, with no pushback. Take your analytics and shovel it.

What's crazy is how little pride they have as a group when getting routed 7-3 at home against a team that you're supposedly trying to beat in the division.

How is it acceptable that Stamkos and Kucherov are skating to the bench with big smiles on their faces? The customary hockey response is you start scrumming and making the remaining 10 minutes of the game a physical nightmare.

All the new age people can scoff at this old school garbage, but you simply can't have teams coming in to town remarking on how they have a fondness for playing in front of the Toronto crowd.

 

[Stephen]

Totally agree with this need some grit. Matthews gets into positions where he could put the other teams D through the boards. But what does he do? He slows and looks to try and pick their pocket/intercept their pass. Not saying he needs to cream everyone but when you have an opportunity to make contact finish the damn check!!!!

Nylander plays every game trying to avoid any contact at all costs. He's a good enough player that when he has the puck on his stick that it works for the most part as he usually finds an open man. But he's pretty much unwilling to take a hit to make a play and rarely drives to the net. Without the puck he is hopeless to get it back. He's quite happy to let opposing teams D get the puck out of the zone as long as he doesn't have to make contact. He might try a stick check or to steal the pass like Matthews but he's not nearly as good at it. Need these guys to actually start competing but i'm not sure we ever will.

Matthews needs to take a page from every gentle big man in the game and just snap once in a while. Needs to put a defenseman into the boards with authority, get the stick up high on someone. You earn that respect and it buys you more ice, which makes you more effective.