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issue with losing un-signed draft pix

Wait, you're upset over potentially losing a forward that has only 22pts in 38 games as a Junior in the NCAA? It's not like he's got good size. And he's not even a center.

So who cares? The guy will be lucky if he can stick in the NHL long term, let alone be a solid contributor. Nothing to get mad about.
 
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Mrfenn92 said:
Detroit still can sign him after his senior year I believe.

Also to say it’s unfair to the team can’t you say the same thing when teams decide not to sign propsects.
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no the prospect doesnt lose anything / isnt owed anything . but the team loses out on an important team building draFT pick because idiots run nhl
 
CallMeShaft said:
Wait, you're upset over potentially losing a forward that has only 22pts in 38 games as a Junior in the NCAA? It's not like he's got good size. And he's not even a center.

So who cares? The guy will be lucky if he can stick in the NHL long term, let alone be a solid contributor. Nothing to get mad about.
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his talent has nothing to do with it . its about a rule that allows a team not getting compensated for losing an important draft pick because a player wont sign .
 
The NHL grand pix finale
CallMeShaft said:
Wait, you're upset over potentially losing a forward that has only 22pts in 38 games as a Junior in the NCAA? It's not like he's got good size. And he's not even a center.

So who cares? The guy will be lucky if he can stick in the NHL long term, let alone be a solid contributor. Nothing to get mad about.
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you’re conveniently leaving out the part that 22pts in 38 games which in 90%+ of those games he did the right things in all zones
 
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It's not unfair at all, the player has every right to pursue his career as he sees fit. Doesn't owe Detroit a damn thing, they understood the risk when they drafted him and shouldn't be compensated whatsoever.
 
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The Sabres missed out on Jimmy Vesey thanks to this bs, and look at Vesey now! Still.. there. Somewhere in the NHL.

It’s an issue, but what isn’t in this league?
 
deca guard said:
his talent has nothing to do with it . its about a rule that allows a team not getting compensated for losing an important draft pick because a player wont sign .
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His talent has everything to do with it. If he was hitting a ppg in his sophomore year, he wouldn't be waiting it out another two years in college. And if he was a better prospect, maybe he signs knowing that Detroit would accommodate him and leave a roster spot open for him.

But he's not a good prospect. And he never was. Most 2nd round picks don't amount to anything. Why you feel that your team should be compensated for not getting anything out of a former 2nd round pick is beyond me.
 
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my post wasnt particularily bout dylan james , it was about the possibility of teams losing draft picks that wont sign with them . now high level prospect trey augustine decided to stay in college another season and can thusly go ufa next august . so if your him why not do so and sign a ufa contract with highest bidder for millions of dollars instead of signing an elc with detroit for 900k ????????? any of you smart asses got the answer for that ???????? mean while detroit loses an extremely valuable draft pick , you know draft pix which are needed to succeed in the nhl . as i said idiots run nhl
 
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deca guard said:
my post wasnt particularily bout dylan james , it was about the possibility of teams losing draft picks that wont sign with them . now high level prospect trey augustine decided to stay in college another season and can thusly go ufa next august . so if your him why not do so and sign a ufa contract with highest bidder for millions of dollars instead of signing an elc with detroit for 900k ????????? any of you smart asses got the answer for that ???????? mean while detroit loses an extremely valuable draft pick , you know draft pix which are needed to succeed in the nhl . as i said idiots run nhl
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There was possibly an idea or a thought in that collection of words.
 
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deca guard said:
my post wasnt particularily bout dylan james , it was about the possibility of teams losing draft picks that wont sign with them . now high level prospect trey augustine decided to stay in college another season and can thusly go ufa next august . so if your him why not do so and sign a ufa contract with highest bidder for millions of dollars instead of signing an elc with detroit for 900k ????????? any of you smart asses got the answer for that ???????? mean while detroit loses an extremely valuable draft pick , you know draft pix which are needed to succeed in the nhl . as i said idiots run nhl
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Trey Augustine is a 2023 draft pick, so Detroit holds his rights until 2027. He can't go UFA after next year.

And even if he eventually chooses to not sign with Detroit, and goes UFA, he still has to sign an entry-level contract, not millions with a highest bidder. That's not how it works.

I'd rather be a smartass than a dumbass.
 
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It's really strange how there is this supposed Russian factor in the draft, beware them!

When the reality is that NCAA guys are the ones you really need to worry about.
 
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Is it fair that a team finishing behind where they selected that original draft pick now has to wait an extra pick before they get a their selection? Would it be fair if the player they wanted now gets taken because a team got a free pick before them? I understand fans being mad about it, but that's not a solution. You can't just be handed a draft pick where you selected that player.
 
deca guard said:
my post wasnt particularily bout dylan james , it was about the possibility of teams losing draft picks that wont sign with them . now high level prospect trey augustine decided to stay in college another season and can thusly go ufa next august . so if your him why not do so and sign a ufa contract with highest bidder for millions of dollars instead of signing an elc with detroit for 900k ????????? any of you smart asses got the answer for that ???????? mean while detroit loses an extremely valuable draft pick , you know draft pix which are needed to succeed in the nhl . as i said idiots run nhl
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The player (assuming he's under 25 years old) would still have to sign an ELC if he were to go the August 15th route. The rare high end guys might cost themselves a little money in the short run if they were to go the August 15th route since they'd be delaying their RFA clock.

Typically not that many players of consequence go the August 15th route for the NHL or NHLPA to make it an issue that either side wants to change in the CBA. The NHL can't unilaterally change the rule without the NHLPA agreeing. And with negotiations, the NHLPA would want a concession elsewhere if they were to agree to the change.

I get a headache whenever I read through the language of the CBA. One problem is how/whether you make a designation between a Justin Schultz situation (refused to sign with Anaheim) vs. a more garden variety situation like Ottawa not wanting to commit an ELC to 2018 2nd rounder Johnny Tychonick.

And then does this amended rule only apply to NCAA prospects? The unsigned 1st round rule applies to all (non-Russian) prospects. And then does this rule apply beyond the 2nd round? Henry Thrun was a 4th round pick who declined to sign with Anaheim, but they were able to trade him for a 3rd before his rights expired. New Jersey drafted Case McCarthy in the 4th round but didn't want to commit an ELC. Alex Kerfoot was a 5th round pick but didn't want to sign with the Devils.

I used to have a running list of the August 15th guys (who signed elsewhere) and it wasn't that long a list. If the prospect is intriguing, a team will be typically able to trade his rights for something.

Edit: Found the list:

giphy.gif


Seniors - August 15th
----------------
2006: RD Nate Guenin (NYR=>PHI) - signed August 16th
2010: RD David Fischer (MON=>N/A)
2012: C Daultan Leveille (ATL/WPG=>N/A)
2014: C Kevin Hayes (CHI=>NYR) - August 20th
2016: LW Jimmy Vesey (NSH/BUF=>NYR) - August 19th, Thomas Di Pauli (WSH=>PIT) - August 19th
2017: LD Doyle Somerby (NYI=>CLB) - August 23rd, C Alex Kerfoot (NJD=>COL) - August 23rd, LD Will Butcher (COL=>NJD) - August 27th
2019: RD Chase Priskie (WSH=>CAR) - August 16th
2020: C Matt Filipe (CAR=>BOS) - August 17th, LW Cam Morrison (COL=>CHI) - August 18th, LD Ryan Shea (CHI=>DAL) - August 19th
2022: RD Jack St. Ivany (PHI=>PIT) - August 20th
2023: C John Farinacci (ARZ=>BOS) - August 16th, C Jay O'Brien (PHI=>AHL) - August 23rd

Juniors - played a D+1 season in a lower league before joining NCAA
----------------
2008: RW Blake Wheeler (PHX=>BOS)
2012: RD Justin Schultz (ANA=>EDM)
2017: G Cal Petersen (BUF=>LAK)
 
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Since 2nd round picks do not make the NHL more often than not, I could see teams gaming this system to get redos on busts
 
deca guard said:
my post wasnt particularily bout dylan james , it was about the possibility of teams losing draft picks that wont sign with them . now high level prospect trey augustine decided to stay in college another season and can thusly go ufa next august . so if your him why not do so and sign a ufa contract with highest bidder for millions of dollars instead of signing an elc with detroit for 900k ????????? any of you smart asses got the answer for that ???????? mean while detroit loses an extremely valuable draft pick , you know draft pix which are needed to succeed in the nhl . as i said idiots run nhl
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They also seem to post on HFBoards.
 
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Brodeur said:
I get a headache whenever I read through the language of the CBA. One problem is how/whether you make a designation between a Justin Schultz situation (refused to sign with Anaheim) vs. a more garden variety situation like Ottawa not wanting to commit an ELC to 2018 2nd rounder Johnny Tychonick.
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Bingo. There needs to be some protection for a kid to not have their draft rights held hostage forever. Just from a general fairness standpoint. They can't force a team to sign their former draft pick, the Schultz situation is just the other side of it. Most August 15th guys are ones that the drafting team just didn't want to sign to an ELC.
 
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This is funny. Of all the prospects to be upset at, this aint it. Teams have lost legit top prospects this way for years.
 
OrangePMD said:
Trey Augustine is a 2023 draft pick, so Detroit holds his rights until 2027. He can't go UFA after next year.

And even if he eventually chooses to not sign with Detroit, and goes UFA, he still has to sign an entry-level contract, not millions with a highest bidder. That's not how it works.

I'd rather be a smartass than a dumbass.
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Their imagined outrage is more important than reality.

Welcome to HF.
 
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