Islanders -- Lighthouse project | Page 14 | HFBoards - NHL Message Board and Forum for National Hockey League
Toggle sidebar

Islanders -- Lighthouse project

Status
Not open for further replies.
the lease agreement is good, because it puts the pressure squarely on the ToH. They alone are holding up the works.

Personally, I don't see why this is so hard to get underway. We're talking six years?

I do have my concerns about what this really means for the Islanders, and what protections we get from SMG in the future. As I understand it, we're going to extend the current SMG lease 10 more years? Isn't that another 10 of slavery? I understand the Islanders/arena as a loss leader for the project... but that only works if Wang stays on in a Karamanos-type role; or Atlanta Spirit Group like owner. Where the HRR ledger is meaningless, he'll spend from Lighthouse revenues to make the team competitive.

What assurances do we have that we'll have financial independence from SMG and become what we SHOULD be, and USED to be: a large market team with ample resources.
 
i think its only fitting that Wang threatens to move the team to Hamilton :sarcasm:
Kc doesnt have as much leverage anymore
 
KevFu said:
the lease agreement is good, because it puts the pressure squarely on the ToH. They alone are holding up the works.

Personally, I don't see why this is so hard to get underway. We're talking six years?

I do have my concerns about what this really means for the Islanders, and what protections we get from SMG in the future. As I understand it, we're going to extend the current SMG lease 10 more years? Isn't that another 10 of slavery? I understand the Islanders/arena as a loss leader for the project... but that only works if Wang stays on in a Karamanos-type role; or Atlanta Spirit Group like owner. Where the HRR ledger is meaningless, he'll spend from Lighthouse revenues to make the team competitive.

What assurances do we have that we'll have financial independence from SMG and become what we SHOULD be, and USED to be: a large market team with ample resources.
Click to expand...


You know why it has taken 6 years+. Because the red tape and BS that takes place on LI. I used to live there and I witnessed it first hand. Every politician gets in the way of progress. They make everything a long drawn out process, its really frustrating and annoying.
 
KevFu said:
the lease agreement is good, because it puts the pressure squarely on the ToH. They alone are holding up the works.

Personally, I don't see why this is so hard to get underway. We're talking six years?

I do have my concerns about what this really means for the Islanders, and what protections we get from SMG in the future. As I understand it, we're going to extend the current SMG lease 10 more years? Isn't that another 10 of slavery? I understand the Islanders/arena as a loss leader for the project... but that only works if Wang stays on in a Karamanos-type role; or Atlanta Spirit Group like owner. Where the HRR ledger is meaningless, he'll spend from Lighthouse revenues to make the team competitive.

What assurances do we have that we'll have financial independence from SMG and become what we SHOULD be, and USED to be: a large market team with ample resources.
Click to expand...

I haven't read or heard anything about Wang's group and SMG, even starting negoiations yet.

I know SMG wants to be part of the Lighthouse project.

I doubt Wang agrees to the same one-sided deal, that SMG has enjoyed for the past few decades.If no agreement can be reached,I think we'll see the County condemn the current lease,voiding the last 6 yrs of SMG's deal at the Coliseum.I'm not sure if SMG would still have to be paid a fee or who would decide the amount.


SMG is not a major player here imo.
 
CREW99AW said:
A really informative Newsday article.



http://www.newsday.com/long-island/wang-s-lighthouse-project-slow-going-from-the-start-1.1479236
D'Amato and Wang would meet again. As Wang's vision for the land began to take shape, D'Amato, a powerful lobbyist and then board member of Computer Associates, the software company Wang founded, sat down to lunch with Wang at a favorite Westbury haunt, Giulio Cesare. Also at the lunch was D'Amato's brother, Armand, a lawyer and lobbyist.

D'Amato, a Republican, had another request of Wang: Bring Armand into the project, according to a source familiar with the meeting.



Hoped to keep politics out

Wang's answer was an emphatic "no," sources have told Newsday. Wang, they said, hoped to keep politics out of a venture that he envisioned would fundamentally change Long Island, bringing thousands of jobs and millions of dollars in economic growth and tax revenue along with it.



By all appearances, Wang has lost more than money as he has tried to push his project along. During these five years, his one-time ally, Alfonse D'Amato - still a powerful voice in Nassau GOP circles - turned against the project.

D'Amato made that clear at a Republican fundraiser in 2005 when he said the Lighthouse would turn Nassau into the sixth borough of New York City.
Click to expand...

I really hope Wang can get this deal done. I feel bad for this guy.
 
CREW99AW said:
I haven't read or heard anything about Wang's group and SMG, even starting negoiations yet.

I know SMG wants to be part of the Lighthouse project.

I doubt Wang agrees to the same one-sided deal, that SMG has enjoyed for the past few decades.If no agreement can be reached,I think we'll see the County condemn the current lease,voiding the last 6 yrs of SMG's deal at the Coliseum.I'm not sure if SMG would still have to be paid a fee or who would decide the amount.


SMG is not a major player here imo.
Click to expand...

I'm pretty sure the contract Nassau County gave SMG to manage NVMC includes rights to manage any venue on that site.


Wang is going to have to negotiate with them for the new arena. Wang's stated he'll extend the lease with them for 10 years, provided its under new terms.

ToH wants the Islanders to commit to 30 years. Wang, I believe, is trying to protect the team from an unfavorable, shortsighted lease like the team just went through (Surely there's a way to commit to 30 years they have to stay on Long Island, with re-negotiation of terms on the lease every 10 years).

As far as condemning the current lease, there's no chance of that happening. That thing is iron clad. The only way it IS terminated is if Wang is not approved to develop the land. And there's simply no way that's going to be final prior to the end of the lease. ToH can string this along for decades if they want.

I believe there's a hotel in the county which has been tangled up in zoning/redevelopment issues since the late 80s (I could be wrong on that, though). The town's stance will be "hold on, we're not saying no, we just need more studies" until 2015.
 
doug mckenzie said:
i think its only fitting that Wang threatens to move the team to Hamilton :sarcasm:
Kc doesnt have as much leverage anymore
Click to expand...

Please don't tease me like that, especially after my passionate pitch for the Islanders to pursue a partnership in the Barclay's Center project. I trust that it is pure speculation, and that Wang hasn't actually stated or implied a threat to move to Hamilton?
 
KevFu said:
As far as condemning the current lease, there's no chance of that happening. That thing is iron clad. The only way it IS terminated is if Wang is not approved to develop the land. And there's simply no way that's going to be final prior to the end of the lease. ToH can string this along for decades if they want.
Click to expand...
Not quite - the lease is pretty ironclad in terms of breaking it - but not w.r.t. the County condemning it and acquiring it under Eminent Domain - which is exactly what the Lighthouse development agreement calls for.

Wang is to negotiate with SMG to acquire the lease. If he can't, then the County agrees to aquire it through eminent domain and assign it to Wang.

CREW99AW posted this link earlier in this thread - the Development Memorandum of Understanding (MOU) between Lighthouse and the County:

http://www.nassaucountyny.gov/agencies/Coliseum/docs/Coliseum_MOU_Final_Revised_BAFO_5-12-06.pdf

SMG Lease Buyout / Condemnation:

Lighthouse agrees to use diligent efforts to negotiate the acquisition of the SMG
Lease. In the event Lighthouse notifies the County that it will be unable to
obtain an assignment of the SMG Lease the County shall, after consultation with
Lighthouse, take such steps as are mutually agreed upon by the County and
Lighthouse, to condemn the SMG Lease by eminent domain. A condition to the
County’s obligation to commence the condemnation proceedings will be receipt
of a guaranty from Charles Wang and Reckson Associates of payment of all
amounts incurred by the County in connection therewith and an indemnity
against any loss, liability, damage, claim, cost or expense in connection
therewith.

If the SMG Lease is acquired, condemned or otherwise terminated, Lighthouse
shall be responsible for all of SMG’s obligations thereunder.
Click to expand...
 
kdb209 said:
Not quite - the lease is pretty ironclad in terms of breaking it - but not w.r.t. the County condemning it and acquiring it under Eminent Domain - which is exactly what the Lighthouse development agreement calls for.

Wang is to negotiate with SMG to acquire the lease. If he can't, then the County agrees to aquire it through eminent domain and assign it to Wang.

CREW99AW posted this link earlier in this thread - the Development Memorandum of Understanding (MOU) between Lighthouse and the County:

http://www.nassaucountyny.gov/agencies/Coliseum/docs/Coliseum_MOU_Final_Revised_BAFO_5-12-06.pdf
Click to expand...

This is something, as an Islander fan, I'm quite familiar with. The problem is the timeline. There's simply zero reason for the ToH (Town of Hempstead), which has proven its acumen for delays, to assign that lease to Wang prior to 2015. The ToH could very easily say "we need more studies/drafts of environmental impact plans" prior to zoning approval.

The whole hangup by the ToH is quite simply, "we're not going to approve something before we have to" there's tons of ways for them to stall. Traffic and water are the two primary means. The lease can be assigned to Wang (or voided) if the ToH/Nassau County is ready to go ahead with the project and the SMG/Wang negotiations are at a standstill/impasse (or if the ToH flatly rejects Wang's bid to build, the lease is voided).

The politics involved allow the ToH to bring that timeline up until the last possible second.

It's going to play out in three ways:
#1 - ToH says "ok, build." and SMG/Wang are at an impasse, at which the lease is condemned and assigned to Wang. This would most likely take place a mere days before the current lease expires. A last second approval.

#2 - ToH says "No, you can't build" which voids the lease and makes the Islanders a franchise Free Agent to play anywhere. Again, this would only take place the day the SMG lease expires.

#3 - The lease expires, and the Islanders say "We still have no decision? We're out of here!" at which point, the ToH says "fine, the lease is assigned to you, build and stay" and Wang says either "ok, we're building" or "F-You, we're going to Brooklyn/KC/elsewhere."

As an Islander fan, I've been waiting on a new arena announcement since 1995. I understand the politics and I understand the reality. This will be a last minute decision. There will only be a resolution on the last possible day, at the last possible minute, and you'll have to deal with me talking about this (and I will be freaking out the last year) for another six years.

if the Islanders get this thing done and a shovel in the ground by 2012, 2013, 2014, I'll do cartwheels. I expect to be on pins and needles until the last possible second.
 
KevFu said:
This is something, as an Islander fan, I'm quite familiar with. The problem is the timeline. There's simply zero reason for the ToH (Town of Hempstead), which has proven its acumen for delays, to assign that lease to Wang prior to 2015. The ToH could very easily say "we need more studies/drafts of environmental impact plans" prior to zoning approval.

The whole hangup by the ToH is quite simply, "we're not going to approve something before we have to" there's tons of ways for them to stall. Traffic and water are the two primary means. The lease can be assigned to Wang (or voided) if the ToH/Nassau County is ready to go ahead with the project and the SMG/Wang negotiations are at a standstill/impasse (or if the ToH flatly rejects Wang's bid to build, the lease is voided).

The politics involved allow the ToH to bring that timeline up until the last possible second.

It's going to play out in three ways:
#1 - ToH says "ok, build." and SMG/Wang are at an impasse, at which the lease is condemned and assigned to Wang. This would most likely take place a mere days before the current lease expires. A last second approval.

#2 - ToH says "No, you can't build" which voids the lease and makes the Islanders a franchise Free Agent to play anywhere. Again, this would only take place the day the SMG lease expires.

#3 - The lease expires, and the Islanders say "We still have no decision? We're out of here!" at which point, the ToH says "fine, the lease is assigned to you, build and stay" and Wang says either "ok, we're building" or "F-You, we're going to Brooklyn/KC/elsewhere."

As an Islander fan, I've been waiting on a new arena announcement since 1995. I understand the politics and I understand the reality. This will be a last minute decision. There will only be a resolution on the last possible day, at the last possible minute, and you'll have to deal with me talking about this (and I will be freaking out the last year) for another six years.

if the Islanders get this thing done and a shovel in the ground by 2012, 2013, 2014, I'll do cartwheels. I expect to be on pins and needles until the last possible second.
Click to expand...

Actually, Town of Hempstead has nothing to do with lease - the lease is between Nassau County and SMG. Yes, ToH can block/delay the development - but theoretically the County could condemn/acquire the lease before 2015 and/or ToH approval (as long as they have the protections of the MOU that Lighthouse will assume the obligations). They would have a better defense against any SMG challenge to eminent domain if it is part of a larger development with a higher civic good - but in the wake of the Kelo decision, it would be legal for the County to condemn the lease under eminent domain and assign it's rights directly to a private developer.

But the bottom, and important, line is that if the Lighthouse development / renovated NVMC becomes a reality, the onerous SMG lease will be history - the Isles will either have a renegotiated favorable lease through SMG or will control the lease directly. In either case they will receive most/all of the revenue streams now being leeched off by SMG and their financial situation will be eminently brighter.

I'm real curious to see the Lease Agreement announcement scheduled for today with Suozzi/Wang/Rechler.

As a disclosure - I'm well aware of LI politics, and have been doing as much as I can to follow this soap opera from afar - I grew up on LI and my family was a STH during the glory years.
 
Newsday piece on the lease agreement to be announced today:

http://www.newsday.com/long-island/...ould-keep-islanders-on-li-till-2030-1.1489957

Lighthouse lease would keep Islanders on LI till 2030

September 30, 2009 By EDEN LAIKIN. AND RANDI F. MARSHALL

Under the proposed lease between Nassau County Executive Thomas Suozzi and The Lighthouse developers, expected to be announced Thursday, the New York Islanders would be playing hockey on Long Island until 2030.

But The Lighthouse project still has many hurdles to overcome before it becomes reality and the 99-year proposed lease itself requires County Legislature approval.

>> Click here to see plans for the Lighthouse project

If the agreement is approved, Lighthouse partners Charles Wang and Scott Rechler would pay Nassau County $1.5 million a year to lease the 77-acre property around Nassau Coliseum, sources said.

Many of the provisions of the proposed lease, they said, were contained in a similar agreement drawn up in 2005 by Wang and Suozzi. The release of the new lease comes two days before Wang's Oct. 3 deadline for significant progress on the project. The new lease was needed because some terms of the 2005 lease changed after the county decided to let other developers bid on the land.

...

Like the new lease, the 2005 lease gave Nassau County $1.5 million in annual rent. At the time, Nassau County officials said they were losing as much as $1.4 million a year in repairs and maintenance on the Coliseum alone. Under the 2005 lease and the new lease, according to sources, Wang took on all repairs and maintenance and got all revenue from ticket sales, parking and concessions.
Click to expand...

And the best thing - not a single mention of SMG.
 
kdb209 said:
But the bottom, and important, line is that if the Lighthouse development / renovated NVMC becomes a reality, the onerous SMG lease will be history - the Isles will either have a renegotiated favorable lease through SMG or will control the lease directly. In either case they will receive most/all of the revenue streams now being leeched off by SMG and their financial situation will be eminently brighter.
Click to expand...

Does this happene once the Lighthouse project is approved (rezoned) by TOH or when the NVMC gets renovated? The latter could take 3 years and the current SMG lease ends in 6 years.

If TOH approves, when can NYI control the revenue streams currently controlled by SMG?
 
According to Newsday,Murray's office wants a meeting to discuss making changes to the project.

Is this just posturing on the ToH's part?Are the trying to head off criticism,that they intentionally killed the project?
I know that Wang's said it has to be all or nothing with this project,but isn't 75%-80% of a $3.7b project,better then no project at all?


http://www.newsday.com/sports/hocke...off-the-ice-1.1496445?localLinksEnabled=false
That's because Wang was supposed to learn whether his Oct. 3 deadline to receive word from the Town of Hempstead on the Lighthouse project has been met. But Hempstead Supervisor Kate Murray said she phoned Charles Wang on Friday afternoon requesting a meeting to discuss "amending" the proposed Lighthouse project.

Murray said that Wang was amenable to a meeting and said he would call her Monday or Tuesday to schedule one.

Wang had set a deadline to find out if he has a legitimate chance to replace the crumbling, antiquated Nassau Coliseum with a gleaming new facility, or whether he'll have to begin entertaining offers from other suitors looking to give the Islanders a home. "Give me a 'yes' or a 'no,' " Wang has implored Town of Hempstead supervisor Kate Murray.
 
The "deadline" was just for Wang to amp up pressure with.

If he had a Yes by Oct. 3, great. But he knew damned well there wouldn't be a "no." There won't be a no until the SMG lease expires. Nassau gave the Islanders an out... if he gets told he can't build, the county will void the SMG lease and they can leave before 2015.
 
KevFu said:
The "deadline" was just for Wang to amp up pressure with.

If he had a Yes by Oct. 3, great. But he knew damned well there wouldn't be a "no." There won't be a no until the SMG lease expires. Nassau gave the Islanders an out... if he gets told he can't build, the county will void the SMG lease and they can leave before 2015.
Click to expand...

As much as i would hate the Isles to go, i think he is going to use the next 5 years to prepare for a move. 30 mil a year is ruffling his feathers.
 
CanadaBacon said:
As much as i would hate the Isles to go, i think he is going to use the next 5 years to prepare for a move. 30 mil a year is ruffling his feathers.
Click to expand...

I think he's using the next five years to get the Town of Hempstead to say "yes" or give someone else in NY (Brooklyn, Queens, Suffolk) time to build an arena so he can stay in the area and collect that massive TV deal.

ToH will wait til the last second to say "no, you can't build"... unless they had a massive reason to. By declaring himself a free agent, and by later leaking that the team is close to a deal in (Brooklyn, KC, wherever), he might get that "yes."

The Penguins didn't their deal until the team had a foot out the door. Wang's doing it now so that he's got a new place at the end of the lease and doesn't have to wait nine years until the first game in a new arena.
 
KevFu said:
I think he's using the next five years to get the Town of Hempstead to say "yes" or give someone else in NY (Brooklyn, Queens, Suffolk) time to build an arena so he can stay in the area and collect that massive TV deal.

ToH will wait til the last second to say "no, you can't build"... unless they had a massive reason to. By declaring himself a free agent, and by later leaking that the team is close to a deal in (Brooklyn, KC, wherever), he might get that "yes."

The Penguins didn't their deal until the team had a foot out the door. Wang's doing it now so that he's got a new place at the end of the lease and doesn't have to wait nine years until the first game in a new arena.
Click to expand...

I really really hope you are right. Sincerely
 
CanadaBacon said:
I really really hope you are right. Sincerely
Click to expand...

You and me both.

It's going to get interesting on here when Bettman supports Wang in his threat to relocate the team.

Because if he supports Wang's bluff to Kansas City, it's "oh, he'll let the Islanders move within the US, but won't let someone move to Canada!"

If his bluff is to Winnipeg/Hamilton, then we'll have to hear all kinds of crazy stuff when the Islanders stay put.
 
KevFu said:
You and me both.

It's going to get interesting on here when Bettman supports Wang in his threat to relocate the team.

Because if he supports Wang's bluff to Kansas City, it's "oh, he'll let the Islanders move within the US, but won't let someone move to Canada!"

If his bluff is to Winnipeg/Hamilton, then we'll have to hear all kinds of crazy stuff when the Islanders stay put.
Click to expand...


But that is actually true :naughty:
 
KevFu said:
You can view it through nationalist glasses. I'll take note that the best interest of owners rights/ability to make money is how Bettman places his loyalties. Since they pay his salary, its probably a wise move.
Click to expand...

Come on, you can honestly say that adding a Canadian team is in GB "plans" to grow the game.
 
KevFu said:
I think he's using the next five years to get the Town of Hempstead to say "yes" or give someone else in NY (Brooklyn, Queens, Suffolk) time to build an arena so he can stay in the area and collect that massive TV deal.

ToH will wait til the last second to say "no, you can't build"... unless they had a massive reason to. By declaring himself a free agent, and by later leaking that the team is close to a deal in (Brooklyn, KC, wherever), he might get that "yes."

The Penguins didn't their deal until the team had a foot out the door. Wang's doing it now so that he's got a new place at the end of the lease and doesn't have to wait nine years until the first game in a new arena.
Click to expand...

things are finally coming to a breaking point and I couldnt be happier
moneybags new owner of the Nets can buy the isles to co-tenant the Brooklyn Yards arena and he'll have a hell of an up and coming product in the Islanders to sell
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Users who are viewing this thread

Total: 1 (members: 0, guests: 1)

Latest posts

Ad

Ad

Top Bottom