Is There a Case For Kucherov > Ovechkin?
- Thread starter Danarqhy
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Is there a case for Crosby if Ovechkin breaks Gretzky's record. Being NHL's all-time leading goal scorer is that big a deal.
Staniowski
Registered User
No, it doesn't imply that at all. But thete are very few players ever who can pass and make plays lije Kucherov. It's a very short list
I agree with you that Ovechkin will be remembered better than Kucherov (unless Kucherov ends up winning about 5 scoring titles, which is unlikely considering his age), but that doesn't mean Ovechkin has been the better player. I think it's Kucherov.
Alexander the Gr8
Registered User
You quoted me from 3 years ago, but my opinion hasn’t really changed. The gap did get smaller though, but Ovechkin is still comfortably ahead.
Alexander the Gr8
Registered User
Very few players can pass as well as Kucherov, but none score as well as Ovechkin. I still disagree with the assessment that Kucherov is a better player. He puts up more points via assists but that’s about it.
He’ll be 32 this off-season. I think he’ll age well, but he’s at an age where a drop off from top 5 player to regular first liner can happen quickly
I am not exposed
Registered User
Ovi is the better goalscorer.
Kucherov is the better overall player.
Kucherov is the better overall player.
VinikToWinIt
Number 1 Bull****
I won’t claim that he’s the greatest playmaker of all time, but I do want to point out that he set the assist record by a winger by 13(!) last season.
He also has a season that puts him at 2nd place, tied with Jagr.
He has another season that places him 4th, after himself, himself, Jagr, and Huberdeau.
His assist total this season would be 13th all time… and he’s played 68 games.
He is honestly making a case for the best playmaker at his position, ever.
Yeah realistically, Kucherov from 2017-present is better than Ovechkin was outside of 2007-10, and Kucherov now at his absolute peak is fairly close with peak Ovechkin as well, don’t see how that can be denied now. He is a point producing machine in the regular season and playoffs for nearly a decade now.
TheGuiminator
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It’s certainly up for debate if he wins a third Art Ross, second Hart, and second Lindsay.
He’s also a better point producer and has a stronger playoff resume than Ovechkin
He’s also a better point producer and has a stronger playoff resume than Ovechkin
It's also getting more and more apparent, that way too many people on this board just haven't watched enough of young ovechkin. He was an actual phenomenon as far as goal scoring, physicality, and availability. His highlight reel is still unparalleled. The first 2 years his teams were complete shite, and were always top heavy until MacLellan took over. Kucherov is a great player, but comparing him to Ovie is like comparing Point to Crosby. The 2 comparisons just aren't close.
Kuch aleady has the most 100 point seasons by any russian player (5).
And he is still going strong.
And he is still going strong.
Video Nasty
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Or people did watch him, can think Ovechkin’s peak was more impressive, but also be swayed or place higher value in Kucherov’s longevity of being at or near the top.
That all-around animal who controlled the game and was quite frankly better than Crosby ever was, is long gone and died a premature death at the age of 24.
I can't believe you just used longevity as an argument against Ovechkin. Lol. Ovie has been the best goal scorer throughout his 20 years. He's 2nd this year per 60.
Alex Ovechkin from 2010-2018 (ages 25-33):
RS 688 games, 389 goals, 682 points
PO 93 games, 41 goals, 77 points
1x Hart, 1x Hart Runner-Up, 3x first team all-star, 6x Rocket Richard, 1x Conn Smythe, 1x Stanley Cup, 3x President's Trophy
Nikita Kucherov from 2016-Now (ages 23-31, with one more end-of-season award cycle to go):
RS 582 games, 284 goals, 829 points
PO 102 games, 31 goals, 125 points
1x Hart, 1x Hart Runner-Up, 1x Lindsay, 3x first team all-star, 2x Ross, 2x time league assist leader (no trophy for that but still), 2x Stanley Cup, 1x President's Trophy
Take out Ovi's 5 best years and he's still IMO slightly ahead of Kucherov. I already knew Ovi and Crosby played so long that people forgot how good they were at the beginning of their careers, I guess it's been so so long that people forget how good they were in the middle too.
As for peak vs. peak, let me know when Kucherov wins back-to-back Harts and back-to-back-to-back Lindsays.
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Video Nasty
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I’m not using longevity against Ovechkin, but I am intimating that he shouldn’t have stopped putting up 100 point seasons after the tender age of 24, let alone 90 point seasons, struggle to score 1 PPG, see his assist totals get lopped in half nearly overnight, and never be a legitimate Art Ross threat again.
Someone who truly watched him during late-2007 through early-2010 shouldn’t be completely mesmerized by the player we’ve had from after that. One thing to regress overnight from 29 to 30, another to have it happen from 24 to 25.
McShogun99
Registered User
If you were doing an NHL Mount Rushmore then Ovechkin would be one of the players that people argue about being on it. No one will argue for Kucherov to be on it.
He won a Hart trophy at 27 and was the runner up at 29!!!! He won a Conn Smythe at 32!!! Did the 2010s just not happen????
It's funny how this never goes the other way too. Kucherov had his first season above ppg at age 23. Ovehckin had 2 Harts, 2 Lindseys, a Ross, a Calder, and 2 Rockets at that time. Kucherov at age 22 had 66 points, Ovechkin had 65 goals
Video Nasty
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Neither belong on it. Despite the post-lockout generation’s insistence, despite as close as players like Crosby and Ovechkin have gotten, the only one with a legitimate case to remold Hockey’s Mount Rushmore is McDavid.
Gerulaitis
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Video Nasty
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I’m just not as impressed as you are. I saw him play as well. I mourn the five year early loss of the player he was. Ovechkin pre-Olympics and after are entirely different players and might as well be from different planets.
I’m not particularly wowed with him winning an additional Hart and runner up nomination during seasons where the top end talent among top forwards was some of the all-time worst for the NHL. While he’s about to earn the career goals record and should be applauded for doing so, I’m just as unfazed by his total number of Rockets because he didn’t have a single legitimate consistent threat. His one true threat for the trophy, Stamkos, had his trajectory altered right as the two were trading the trophy back and forth. Zero doubt in my mind that Stamkos plucks at least three of Ovechkin’s nine Rockets.
I’m far more impressed by how long Kucherov has been performing like this and has been doing so against the likes of players like McDavid and MacKinnon, while not disappearing from scoring races far earlier than he should have.
That’s just not the case any longer. Kucherov is a magician with the puck on an all-time level. His best in the playoffs rivals Crosby in career and peak (both better than Ovechkin here btw), and he’s going for his 3rd Art Ross against two players who look like they should be lapping Kucherov in scoring with their skating ability and physical talent.
Peak Ovechkin would be lucky to win an Art Ross against Kucherov these past few seasons, maybe 2009-10 in a full season would’ve been the only time he had a chance.
Brother you just listed all their awards like I’m not aware Ovechkin’s the greatest goal scorer of all-time.
Did you happen to look at the points scored you just posted for each of them here?
Thanks for proving my point!
