Is the scoring 'Renaissance' here to stay?

[Le Barron de HF]

Hello all,

Pretty simple question:
Is the increase of scoring and goal per game here to stay or you expect a regression back to 2010-16 level of scoring coming very soon? If so what do you think will be leading factors? Goalies demanding changes? Copycat league influencing roster decisions? Rule changes?

Discuss

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[MNRube]

Rule changes: namely interference and hooking being called more. Also restrictions on goaltending equipment.

Growth of the game. The players from less traditional markets tend to be more skill-oriented. They don’t play elite competition as often growing up and make up for it with more skills-based training.

Technology. Sticks are much better and pucks fly off of them with increased velocity & accuracy.

Goaltending plateaus. Advances in goaltending haven’t kept up with scoring.

 

[KareemTrustfund]

They shrunk all the goalie gear in 2017-18 and unless they plan on undoing that scoring will remain much easier now compared to pre 2017.

 

[StammerHammer]

Pretty simple answer: Yes

 

[jigglysquishy]

Scoring has oscillated up and down for 100 years.

In 2016 hfboards was convinced the NHL would stay low scoring.
In 2006 hfboards was convinced the NHL would stay high scoring.

The truth is scoring will drop again. And will go back up again too.

 

[Russian_fanatic]

Scoring has oscillated up and down for 100 years.

In 2016 hfboards was convinced the NHL would stay low scoring.
In 2006 hfboards was convinced the NHL would stay high scoring.

The truth is scoring will drop again. And will go back up again too.

Who can forget in 2015 when HFBoards was saying scoring will never increase again because "goalies are more advanced now"

I also remember in 2006 when we said "the game is more open, the deadpuck era is gone!"

Defenses + Goalies will adapt like they always do, and this discussion will be back in the next 10 years.

 

[tabness]

Scoring has oscillated up and down for 100 years.

In 2016 hfboards was convinced the NHL would stay low scoring.
In 2006 hfboards was convinced the NHL would stay high scoring.

The truth is scoring will drop again. And will go back up again too.

Who can forget in 2015 when HFBoards was saying scoring will never increase again because "goalies are more advanced now"

I also remember in 2006 when we said "the game is more open, the deadpuck era is gone!"

Defenses + Goalies will adapt like they always do, and this discussion will be back in the next 10 years.

exactly HF recency bias even extends beyond players to meta hockey things

HF impressively allows you to live in the moment while being on your phone

 

[TheDawnOfANewTage]

Rule changes: namely interference and hooking being called more. Also restrictions on goaltending equipment.

Growth of the game. The players from less traditional markets tend to be more skill-oriented. They don’t play elite competition as often growing up and make up for it with more skills-based training.

Technology. Sticks are much better and pucks fly off of them with increased velocity & accuracy.

Goaltending plateaus. Advances in goaltending haven’t kept up with scoring.

I’d emphasize those last two, and add that guys like McDavid grew up watching Crosby, who grew up watching Lemieux and Gretzky. Generational learning and improvement, and now the strategies, fitness, and conditioning are all so dialed in as well. Bedard and Matthews grew up messing around with more modern sticks, they learned that whippy wrister at a young age and that technology/skill itself is a bit of a game changer. They’re the best at it, but you’ll see some random defensemen wire pucks bar down like they’re Sakic reincarnated. Goalies, meanwhile, have to be better positionally, quicker, with absolutely no holes- it just hits a limit, and I think they’re largely there. There’s a reason we don’t see dominant stretches like we saw from Roy or Brodeur any more.

TL;DR- Growing up with better tech, training, and strategies benefits skaters more than goalies, scoring will grow more.

 

[SnowblindNYR]

I worry that the Panthers' eye bleeding style will force teams to try to imitate and the league will become more defensive.

 

[JPeeper]

Scoring will remain high as long as the NHL keeps getting stud prospects every year. Bedard, Celebrini, we have Hagens coming, then McKenna, and obviously all the other top guys like next year's top 5 is loaded with potential franchise centers.

When your Norris d-men are all offensive guys who barely know what's happening in their own zone scoring will stay high.

 

[Fred22406Capsfan]

They shrunk all the goalie gear in 2017-18 and unless they plan on undoing that scoring will remain much easier now compared to pre 2017.

Biased Caps fan here, but am I 'bad' for saying I hope it stays as is until Ovi passes Wayne?

 

[Dread Clawz]

I worry that the Panthers' eye bleeding style will force teams to try to imitate and the league will become more defensive.

Panthers have an exciting style, not eye-bleeding. How can you say that? Panthers F's forecheck like crazy and their D are constantly pinching. This style also leads to at least 1-2 breakaways against per game, which is also exciting to watch.

 

[SnowblindNYR]

Panthers have an exciting style, not eye-bleeding. How can you say that? Panthers F's forecheck like crazy and their D are constantly pinching. This style also leads to at least 1-2 breakaways against per game, which is also exciting to watch.

I can't stand the way they play hockey. I don't find heavy forechecking teams exciting at all. There is just no fluidity to the game at all. It's painful to watch. I won't bore you with any other series but when they played their game in the SCF, particularly game 7 it was just awful to watch. They're basically the 2012 LA Kings of 2024. I like skilled hockey not guys humping the boards for 60 minutes.

 

[Dread Clawz]

I can't stand the way they play hockey. I don't find heavy forechecking teams exciting at all. There is just no fluidity to the game at all. It's painful to watch. I won't bore you with any other series but when they played their game in the SCF, pqarticularly game 7 it was just awful to watch. They're basically the 2012 LA Kings of 2024. I like skilled hockey not guys humping the boards for 60 minutes.

When you say eye-bleeding I think the trap. The way the Panthers play is the opposite of the trap. The kind of hockey you are describing is less exciting to me than what the Panthers do, which is all-out aggressive. Unless you are talking the Oilers, and they are the only team that can play that way. Give me a 2-1 game 7 instead of a 5-4 one.

 

[blundluntman]

Nothing lasts forever but it'd be nice if it stuck around for a while. From 1969 to 1997, there wasn't a single Art Ross winner that scored less than 120 points over a full season. I wouldn't mind going through a similar phase for the next 20+ years

 

[ijuka]

Who can forget in 2015 when HFBoards was saying scoring will never increase again because "goalies are more advanced now"

I also remember in 2006 when we said "the game is more open, the deadpuck era is gone!"

Defenses + Goalies will adapt like they always do, and this discussion will be back in the next 10 years.

They will adapt via rule / refereeing changes, the way they did for both of those examples?

 

[The Panther]

As others have said, it always goes up and down. It's up now, it'll go down again at some point.

One factor in the recent upswing that sometimes gets overlooked in scoring levels is simply league parity. Generally, when parity is higher, scoring goes down. As an example, see the 1986-87 season. Overnight, it suddenly was the highest parity season in 54 years os something and, accordingly. scoring went way down. Conversely, see the early 70s when scoring suddenly started exploding due to the extreme lack of parity.

It strikes me that. with trades being rarer and harder to make now, that more clubs are resigned to losing for longer periods. Accordingly there's less parity now. (I believe 2021-22 had the lowest parity in many years.) This drives up scoring.

 

[NVious]

I'm sick and tired of these hot shot young punks scoring 150+ points, doing their stupid girddeys or whatever and scoring lacrosse goals.

Where is the clutching, where is the grabbing? I want a Jamie Benn hitting 80 points for a massive season, I want Jonathan Toews being a goal scoring superstar while hitting 34, I want John Tavares to be considered moderately fast again.

#BringBackTheOldNHL

 

[Dr Salt]

It depends on how the league rules affect goalies more than anything atp IMO, wouldn't be surprising to see them try to keep scoring up artificially compared to the more natural swings of the past

 

[The Gr8 Dane]

Bring back defence and goaltending

 

[SnowblindNYR]

When you say eye-bleeding I think the trap. The way the Panthers play is the opposite of the trap. The kind of hockey you are describing is less exciting to me than what the Panthers do, which is all-out aggressive. Unless you are talking the Oilers, and they are the only team that can play that way. Give me a 2-1 game 7 instead of a 5-4 one.

To me there's no flow to the game and some people love watching aggressive board play. That style doesn't interest me.

 

[Russian_fanatic]

I'm sick and tired of these hot shot young punks scoring 150+ points, doing their stupid girddeys or whatever and scoring lacrosse goals.

Where is the clutching, where is the grabbing? I want a Jamie Benn hitting 80 points for a massive season, I want Jonathan Toews being a goal scoring superstar while hitting 34, I want John Tavares to be considered moderately fast again.

#BringBackTheOldNHL

I understand some people might like 150 point seasons, as does myself. I don't think there's anything wrong with wanting more defense, physicality, and board play in the game. What we need to do is eliminate cheap shots and dirty plays. Quite frankly the game has gotten to a point where it gets stale if no one in scoring.

Also put some respect on Jamie Benn's name. If you where to plant prime Benn into today's NHL he's scoring between 50-55 goals while posting 100+ points. One of the best modern power forwards in recent memory. His Art Ross win isn't a blemish on the league, it's not his fault he outscored the competition. If Martin St. Louis can lead the league in scoring in the PEAK of the DPE (03/04) nobody has an excuse.

 

[Michael Farkas]

Shameless self-promotion, but scoring going up can be a product of a number of things. One of them is scoring/shooting techniques and concepts, another one is the evolution of goaltending. I talked about both in this video - it's mostly "how we got here", so to speak - but it also talks about the current and a hint at the future...

 

[Masked]

Scoring always goes up after expansion and then declines as the supply is developed to meet the increased demand.

 

[jigglysquishy]

Shameless self-promotion, but scoring going up can be a product of a number of things. One of them is scoring/shooting techniques and concepts, another one is the evolution of goaltending. I talked about both in this video - it's mostly "how we got here", so to speak - but it also talks about the current and a hint at the future...

This is the Mike Farkas greatest hits.

Insightful.

Oodles of examples and video footage.

Late 90s/early 00s memes.

Absolutely shitting on Tim Thomas.