Is Leon Draisaitl Gonna Break Nathan Mackinnon's HART

[Duke74]

How much does Makar benefit from MacKinnon? I thought there was a very telling stat that Makar numbers go way down went he is not on the ice with MacKinnon.

If so, this basically negates any talk of MacKinnon's team situation being better than Draisaitl's. It should come down to who simply had the better season without the irritating "VALUABLE TO HIS TEAM!" narratives being overplayed.

How much does McDavid benefit from Draisaitl? Because this year, the advanced stats show that McDavid's numbers dip significantly without Draisaitl while Draisaitl's stay high without McDavid and with glorified ECHL players on his line.

I'm not saying MacKinnon isn't deserving. Both players are. I'm just tired of the "b-b-but he p-p-plays with McJeezuz" argument.

 

[KrisLetAngry]

I think if I was to vote today on the Hart. Is have to give it to Draisaitl.
Has a chance to win the Ross and get 60 goals.

It's a shame Quinn Hughes missed time. I had him as the leader until he went down.

Hellebuyck has to go on an absolute tear to end the season for any chance at winning the Hart. It is notoriously difficult to win as a non forward.

 

[daver]

How much does McDavid benefit from Draisaitl? Because this year, the advanced stats show that McDavid's numbers dip significantly without Draisaitl while Draisaitl's stay high without McDavid and with glorified ECHL players on his line.

Funny how players seem to do worse playing with Draisaitl rather than better Arviddsson, Kaspenen, Foegele, Holloway.

Not sure the constant labeling of Draisaitl's linemates throughout his career as AHLers, 4th liners etc.. makes sense. At some point there should be some players who flourish with Draisaitl.

 

[Duke74]

Funny how players seem to do worse playing with Draisaitl rather than better Arviddsson, Kaspenen, Foegele, Holloway.

Not sure the constant labeling of Draisaitl's linemates throughout his career as AHLers, 4th liners etc.. makes sense. At some point there should be some players who flourish with Draisaitl.

Arvidsson is washed at this point in his career. Kapanen was never a good player with anyone. Draisaitl rarely got any time with Holloway last year and he made Foegele into a 20-goal scorer.

Next?

 

[daver]

Arvidsson is washed at this point in his career. Kapanen was never a good player with anyone. Draisaitl rarely got any time with Holloway last year and he made Foegele into a 20-goal scorer.

Next?

Kaspanen has his lowest PPG by far this year since his sophomore season. He was a consistent 0.50 to 0.60 PPG player.

Arvidsson has gone from 0.83 to 0.40 PPG.

Foegle has 19 goals so far this year and Draisaitl assisted only on 7 of his goals last year.

Next?

 

[Duke74]

Kaspanen has his lowest PPG by far this year since his sophomore season. He was a consistent 0.50 to 0.60 PPG player.

Arvidsson has gone from 0.83 to 0.40 PPG.

Foegle has 19 goals so far this year and Draisaitl assisted only on 7 of his goals last year.

Next?

Kapanen only played with Draisaitl for 5-10 games until Arvidsson returned from injury and he went to the fourth line. Small sample size.

Arvidsson has had back surgery and is barely a shadow of the player he once was. He was injured yet again this year, which further hampered his productivity.

Foegele was obviously unhappy in Edmonton as he stated later in an interview. Not necessarily anything to do with Draisaitl as he spent large portions of the year on the third or fourth line. This year, he plays higher in the lineup and hence more points.

 

[Pip]

Funny how players seem to do worse playing with Draisaitl rather than better Arviddsson, Kaspenen, Foegele, Holloway.

Not sure the constant labeling of Draisaitl's linemates throughout his career as AHLers, 4th liners etc.. makes sense. At some point there should be some players who flourish with Draisaitl.

Holloway? How much did he even play with Draisaitl last year?

And Kapanen is a replacement level player, hence why he was on waivers this year.

Arvidsson is as close to a legit winger he’s had and it’s clear he’s a shell of his former self whether he’s playing with Draisaitl or not.

 

[McFlash97]

Kaspanen has his lowest PPG by far this year since his sophomore season. He was a consistent 0.50 to 0.60 PPG player.

Arvidsson has gone from 0.83 to 0.40 PPG.

Foegle has 19 goals so far this year and Draisaitl assisted only on 7 of his goals last year.

Next?

Buddy, just stop man. Draisaitl would have turned Holloway into a 40 goal scorer or 80 point player this season if they played. Holloway was on the precipous of breaking out.

 

[Pass the Saitl Sauce]

Buddy, just stop man. Draisaitl would have turned Holloway into a 40 goal scorer or 80 point player this season if they played. Holloway was on the precipous of breaking out.

I honestly thought Holloway last year could have scored 20-20 easy if stapled to Drai like podz is here and had Holloway as a 30-30 this season if he stayed and was stapled to Drai like podz has been this season. Hell he probably deserves a shot on the PP above nuge here

2m it should have been an instant match. Other than the Drai contract I would have prioritized getting Holloway on a 3x3 contract or even a second year if possible before signing Henrique, skinner, and Arvidsson but management kept saying “it will get done”

Losing broberg is debatable at his cap hit but what we got in return is poor either way.

Edit: thought this was the oilers board for a moment lol Drai has piss poor wingers other than the ghost of mcdavid

 

[ijuka]

You are never going to win the "who had the better linemates" argument when over 50% of your point shares in your career are with a player who could be Top 5 (or better) all-time.

I would ignore those use that argument to pump up Mac. I don't think the voters are going decide based on that anyways.

I wasn't denying that he has better linemates around 50% of the time. He clearly has worse ones the other 50%, though.

Seems like a difficult concept to grasp.

 

[BertMcDrai]

Funny how players seem to do worse playing with Draisaitl rather than better Arviddsson, Kaspenen, Foegele, Holloway.

Not sure the constant labeling of Draisaitl's linemates throughout his career as AHLers, 4th liners etc.. makes sense. At some point there should be some players who flourish with Draisaitl.

He made Yamamoto a 20 goal scorer...and guess what he isn't in the NHL anymore at 26 years old.
Let that sink in, he is playing in the AHL with 26...that has to be his prime years.
As always you aren't good informed.

 

[bleedthenorth]

what's with all the debating? MacKinnon's only in the convo cause he's about the break the only record he'll ever own; most EN points in a season.

 

[BertMcDrai]

Kaspanen has his lowest PPG by far this year since his sophomore season. He was a consistent 0.50 to 0.60 PPG player.

Arvidsson has gone from 0.83 to 0.40 PPG.

Foegle has 19 goals so far this year and Draisaitl assisted only on 7 of his goals last year.

Next?

Kapananen was 0.3 PPG last year...what are you talking?
22 points over a almost full season (73gp).
He was 0.1 PPG this year before traded to the Oilers...take a calculator if you have trouble with numbers it's not a shame.
As always you aren't a good informed or you don't want to be.

Foegele had his best year with the Oilers and this only with partial time with Drai.
It was the first time he had 0.5ppg in his 7th career year.

Arvidsson has had surgery and was injured half the season, how can you evaluate that?
Not really possible.

 

[daver]

I wasn't denying that he has better linemates around 50% of the time. He clearly has worse ones the other 50%, though.

Seems like a difficult concept to grasp.

I would say that quality of linemates has never mattered much in Hart voting so it's just noise by fans of both teams. MVP talk is usually just noise anyways. The player who had the best season on a playoff team is the unofficial criteria.

The gap between a player and the 2nd best scorer on the team is usually something that gets considered by voters when you have players with similar production.

Don't be surprised if the voters prefer Mac given that you know who is on Drai's team. They may not look closely enough to see that for the first time in his career, you can argue that it is Draisaitl carrying McDavid vs. the other way around. But that can change at any time.

If they do look closely, they will see that it is Makar who really benefits from being on the ice with Mac, not the other way around.

 

[daver]

He made Yamamoto a 20 goal scorer...and guess what he isn't in the NHL anymore at 26 years old.
Let that sink in, he is playing in the AHL with 26...that has to be his prime years.
As always you aren't good informed.

Draisaitl assisted on six of those 20 goals, McDavid on seven.

Here is what should be considered "making somebody a 20 goal scorer". In 2013, Crosby was making Chris Kunitz a Top 3 goalscorer in the league by assisting on sixteen of his 20 goals.

 

[sbhnur]

Funny how hard some people search for negatives...

Maybe just watch some games and accept how good this Drai guy is? He is voted by his peers year by year the passer in the league and constantly goes for 40+ goals every season. And if people actually watch him they soon trash this McDavid factor stuff bc it's so obvious how good he is. Makes McDavid often the second best player on his team. What else could he do - score 70+70?

 

[BertMcDrai]

Draisaitl assisted on six of those 20 goals, McDavid on seven.

Here is what should be considered "making somebody a 20 goal scorer". In 2013, Crosby was making Chris Kunitz a Top 3 goalscorer in the league by assisting on sixteen of his 20 goals.

Then take a look at their ice time together, Crosby and Kunitz spent over 1000min together while Drai only 600min this season...if you pro rate it they are only separated by a gigantic 5 assists...
You are comparing Kunitz who played over 1000 NHL games to Yamamoto who is out of the league with 26 years...all you are doing as always is proving me right and not wrong...you are bringing always up half true cherry pick stats which are completely irrelevant if someone make the close research...as always.

 

[tfwnogf]

Draisaitl assisted on six of those 20 goals, McDavid on seven.

Here is what should be considered "making somebody a 20 goal scorer". In 2013, Crosby was making Chris Kunitz a Top 3 goalscorer in the league by assisting on sixteen of his 20 goals.

Is this guy really comparing Yamamoto to Olympian Chris Kunitz? Holy desperation.

 

[josra33]

Kapanen only played with Draisaitl for 5-10 games until Arvidsson returned from injury and he went to the fourth line. Small sample size.

Arvidsson has had back surgery and is barely a shadow of the player he once was. He was injured yet again this year, which further hampered his productivity.

Foegele was obviously unhappy in Edmonton as he stated later in an interview. Not necessarily anything to do with Draisaitl as he spent large portions of the year on the third or fourth line. This year, he plays higher in the lineup and hence more points.

You move the goalposts any farther, no one will miss field goals ever again.

 

[daver]

Is this guy really comparing Yamamoto to Olympian Chris Kunitz? Holy desperation.

Holy incomprehension.

 

[daver]

Then take a look at their ice time together, Crosby and Kunitz spent over 1000min together while Drai only 600min this season...if you pro rate it they are only separated by a gigantic 5 assists...

So you agree that giving Draisaitl credit for making Yamamoto a 20 goal scorer made no sense, right?

 

[tfwnogf]

Holy incomprehension.

That's what you were doing tho. Why mention that about 2013 Crosby like it matters about anything. You make a habit of bringing up irrelevant information to prop up your bias. Doesn't fool anybody though.

Next?

 

[Duke74]

You move the goalposts any farther, no one will miss field goals ever again.

You must be confused. It's the other poster who's moving goalposts. I'm just, you know, providing FACTS.

 

[Duke74]

Draisaitl assisted on six of those 20 goals, McDavid on seven.

Here is what should be considered "making somebody a 20 goal scorer". In 2013, Crosby was making Chris Kunitz a Top 3 goalscorer in the league by assisting on sixteen of his 20 goals.

You're so obsessed with Draisaitl you've devoted extensive time to scouring through obscure stats, many of which constitute small sample sizes, and trying to present them in a way that discredits him.

In addition to a home in Edmonton and Mallorca, Draisaitl also owns real estate in your head...

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

Edmonton is such a poorly run team that it's a miracle they're even in a playoff spot.

Colorado has some of the best management in the league. There's your award right there.