Is Connor Mcdavid a "tier above" Sidney Crosby as a player?

Is Connor Mcdavid a "tier above" Sidney Crosby as a player?


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Arthur Morgan

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You tell me….there seems to be a lot of insecure Crosby fans for someone who is supposed to be a “top 5” player all time. Apparently he can’t be top 5 without being superior to McDavid about things like…winning, leading, you know…stuff you can’t measure or use. Because we all know it’s not all about points and McDavid apparently is nothing but points….
why is it such a big deal to huge McDavid fans? let him get there. so quick to just automatically place him above the greats, what exactly has McDavid done to deserve placement over Crosby?

and I dont know your the one who said threaten Crosby's legacy so please explain. how in the world is McDavid threatening Crosby's legacy?
 

GreatGonzo

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Best playoff performer who never led his team in scoring in a cup win
He’s also got to be considered the “best player” despite losing scoring titles to guys like Kane, Benn, and McDavid.
why is it such a big deal to huge McDavid fans? let him get there. so quick to just automatically place him above the greats, what exactly has McDavid done to deserve placement over Crosby?

and I dont know your the one who said threaten Crosby's legacy so please explain. how in the world is McDavid threatening Crosby's legacy?
Are you new around here? Just read this thread along with the thread @daver made in the history section. It’s full of it.
 

Frank Drebin

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He’s also got to be considered the “best player” despite losing scoring titles to guys like Kane, Benn, and McDavid.

Are you new around here? Just read this thread along with the thread @daver made in the history section. It’s full of it.
I have been on hf boards for 20 years
I try not to get sucked into this stupidity but I failed with this thread
I just think these comments will look so funny looking back
Every time I come back to this thread there is new material, it’s amazing
 
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Arthur Morgan

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He’s also got to be considered the “best player” despite losing scoring titles to guys like Kane, Benn, and McDavid.

Are you new around here? Just read this thread along with the thread @daver made in the history section. It’s full of it.
Im not going to read through 77 pages to try and understand your thinking you said it. so explain it...... why would you say something like that if you cant even answer a simple question so in what way exactly is McDavid threatening Crosby's legacy?
 

GreatGonzo

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Im not going to read through 77 pages to try and understand your thinking you said it. so explain it...... why would you say something like that if you cant even answer a simple question so in what way exactly is McDavid threatening Crosby's legacy?
It’s the simple fact that they can’t handle that McDavid may or may not be “better” Crosby. And their takes are usually, no…because Crosby is a WINNER and a LEADER. All while McDavid only Collects perosnal trophies and fancy stats. It’s that simple. McDavid is ALL offense while Crosbys “all around” play is clearly superior.

Even when McDavid was beating Crosby is the scoring race. It wasn’t definitive that he was THE best player, because Crosby gets a “grace period.”

Does that cover it for you?
 

Video Nasty

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I didnt really come here often back then, I was on some other Leafs related forum so I dont know how it was here but I dont understand the payback part

I lurked and people were awfully quick to crown Crosby because the game was supposedly bigger, better, and more advanced than the ancient past of seven years since Gretzky had played.

You can still see some residue of it to this day with how frozen in time Crosby supporters view the first dozen or so years of his career. No one before or after can ever be better.

Now they’re getting a taste of their medicine, except McDavid really is better than Crosby.
 
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Arthur Morgan

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I lurked and people were awfully quick to crown Crosby because the game was supposedly bigger, better, and more advanced than the ancient past of seven years since Gretzky had played.

You can still see some residue of it to this day with how frozen in time Crosby supporters view the first dozen or so years of his career. No one before or after can ever be better.

Now they’re getting a taste of their medicine, except McDavid really is better than Crosby.
I viewed Crosby the way I view McDavid now in the beginning of his career. I dont understand the taste of their own medicine,

I guess if you want awards and slightly higher point totals then you go with McDavid. if you wanna win championships you go with Crosby. he's just the more complete player
 

Video Nasty

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I viewed Crosby the way I view McDavid now in the beginning of his career. I dont understand the taste of their own medicine,

I guess if you want awards and slightly higher point totals then you go with McDavid. if you wanna win championships you go with Crosby. he's just the more complete player

That excuse is only going to be valid for so long.

When McDavid retires with 7+ Art Rosses, 4-5 Harts, 5-6 Lindsays, 2000+ points, and a few Cups/Conn Smythes, with all the other accomplishments he’s had and yet to come, it will be crystal clear who was better for longer.
 

One Winged Angel

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Howe had 4 Art Ross wins (including 3x setting/tying the scoring record) and 2 Hart wins (some super goofy voting patterns back in the day). The Conn Smythe didn't exist in Howe's first 9 years, but he led the playoffs in scoring 3 times including setting the single season playoff scoring record.

Orr had 2 Art Ross wins, 3 Harts, and 8 Norris trophies and 2 Smythes in his first 9 seasons.

In Mario's first 9 season he had 3 Art Ross wins, 2 Harts, and 2 Smythes.

Gretzky is in another realm with his first 9, 7 Art Ross trophies, 8 Harts, 2 Smythes.
Howe’s first 4 years were nothing special, while McDavid won the Ross and Hart in his second year.

It’s tough to make comparisons with Orr because he revolutionized the game. You can point to Harvey before him, but Orr completely changed the sport as we know it.

Mario is interesting because he had a Gretzky problem in the 1st 9 of his career.

McDavid was the alpha right away.
 

One Winged Angel

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Nuh uh, Hasek/Jagr/Lidstrom/Beliveau/Ovechkin will!

Hasek, Jagr and Lidstrom you could entertain arguments for, but Beliveau and Ovechkin, no way.

Did you know Ovechkin has more trophies than McDavid, and likely will have the goal record when it’s all over?

McDavid is 9 seasons in, 26 years old and could pass Ovechkin’s current total in points in about 5 years. Plus he’s going to probably accumulate at least another 3 Art Ross, probably more and another Hart or two in that time.

Ovechkin can have Gretzky’s goal record, but McDavid is likely going to be the 2nd player to break 2,000 points lol.

Or how about Hasek with his run between 94-01? 6 Vezina, 2 Hart, 2 Pearson.

I will die on the hill that Hasek is the best goalie ever. That type of run of dominance in the era in which the Vezina has been voted on (post-83) is unseen by any other goalie. Absolutely insane run.

And if not for injury in 99-00, he would’ve won it for a 7th time in 8 years.

I think if you want to put McDavid as #5 all time that's fair. But its also fair if someone puts one of the above names there as well. McDavid isn't clear cut enough to gain any sort of consensus as de facto #5.

I never said right now. I said he will likely go down as a top-5 player of all time when it’s all said and done.
 
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GreatGonzo

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I viewed Crosby the way I view McDavid now in the beginning of his career. I dont understand the taste of their own medicine,

I guess if you want awards and slightly higher point totals then you go with McDavid. if you wanna win championships you go with Crosby. he's just the more complete player
Yes this sums up everything perfectly :laugh: because it’s that cut and dry….

“He’s just more complete”….how? Why? No reason…he’s Crosby. He wins. That’s all that matters.
2006-2017..
Well let’s look at this, shall we?

He wasn’t the best player in the world in 2006, he wasn’t even the best rookie.

2008-10 belongs to Ovechkin. 2012 I’m going to give to Malkin because 22 games isnt nearly enough. 2011 is iffy but I get it, he was running away with it anyway. So from 06-10, we have 2 years where he was considered the “best.”

2013 and 2014, absolutely. 2015-17, well that’s where it gets tricky. Crosby didn’t win any Harts scoring titles during this time(something that made him the “best” player all the previous years). Instead, we now have a playoffs vs regular season debate.

Basically from 06-14, his stats and regular season trophies made him the best, from 2015-17, regular season trophies and points suddenly don’t matter and it’s all about Smythes and cups

So basically, no. Crosby was not the undisputed “best player” for that 10 years span. Out of those 10 years, you can safely say he was THE best for 4 of them.
 
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bambamcam4ever

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In those seasons Ovechkin finished ahead of Crosby 6 times in Hart voting. Crosby was ahead 4 times. And once neither got votes. Why pray tell does that stretch go to Crosby?
Because he was the better player. And the the 2013 Hart was unjustifiable so there goes that argumentm
 

MacMacandBarbie

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Dec 9, 2019
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That says it all, doesn’t it? You’re being emotional about this.
It was a chat GPT copy/paste. Either way, what a weird direction to go down with a reply.
Public opinion didn’t think he could possibly score 100 points in 2020-2021 or ever touch 150. I did, so I’ll stick with my own opinions on McDavid and what he can or can’t do.
Actually when scoring went through the roof a lot of people predicted he would hit 150. I remember 100 being split for people, as there were tons of believers since he was feasting on crappy canadian teams for 56 games.
 
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GreatGonzo

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X to Doubt. Crosby missed a quarter of the season.
That and Ovechkins resurgence the last half of the season. The team was 10-13-1 going into game 25. Ovechkin was 20-9-11-20. The next 24 games? Ovechkin had 23 goals and 13 assists, 36 points. The team finished 17-5-2 and secured a playoff spot. During that time frame(last half of the season) Ovechkin ranked 1st in points and goals.
 

MacMacandBarbie

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I, along with everyone in this thread have seen that type of play plenty of times. There was nothing special about it. You posted it for God knows what reason.
I literally told you I posted it to show Crosby's versatility in scoring, since a lot of people clearly didn't see much of him in his prime. Why are you so confused all the time yet continuing to post? Please, get an AI assistant to help explain things to you on the page. Like any page reader.
I think it’s cute when you try to talk down to me, given your history of sounding completely foolish.
What a weird thing to say to another grown adult.

So we went from “winning and “leading”, to “if you want it done, you pick Crosby.”

you can’t count Art Rosses, they aren’t “major awards” according to @MacMacandBarbie.
You are absolutely unhinged my man. Genuine question, is it against site rules to blatantly misquote somebody? This guy has done it multiple times now, effectively flaming me.
 

GreatGonzo

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:laugh:It was a chat GPT copy/paste. Either way, what a weird direction to go down with a reply.

Actually when scoring went through the roof a lot of people predicted he would hit 150. I remember 100 being split for people, as there were tons of believers since he was feasting on crappy canadian teams for 56 games.
and yet, through an 82 game season…he was able to maintain the same pace….playing ALL the teams…
 

GreatGonzo

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I literally told you I posted it to show Crosby's versatility in scoring, since a lot of people clearly didn't see much of him in his prime. Why are you so confused all the time yet continuing to post? Please, get an AI assistant to help explain things to you on the page. Like any page reader.

What a weird thing to say to another grown adult.


You are absolutely unhinged my man. Genuine question, is it against site rules to blatantly misquote somebody? This guy has done it multiple times now, effectively flaming me.
I didn’t need to see a video to believe he’s a great scorer. It was just weird. A very odd move honestly. And like I said, you then followed it up with…and let me quote you correctly this time….”something you have never seen before.” You tried to make it sound so unique and special. It was honestly adorable.

Truth hurt again? Funny calling me “unhinged” considering your opinions…like about the Art Ross.

This has nothing to do with anything we were talking about.
You just said he played crappy canadien teams for 56 games, that’s why he scored a 100 points and had such a high pace….yet he established himself 2 years later with the same pace and a full schedule…

“That has nothing to do with anything we are talking about.”

:laugh::laugh:
 
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