In light of the Larkin trade request, how would you rework the roster? A discourse on “blowing it up?”

[saska sault]

Getting rid of Simon would be a huge mistake unless there is some team out there willing to part with a 23 and under top line center. That is about the only way you move him. Getting rid of Larkin and trading others is more than enough to tank if the want to. Simply trade any vets you can, toss all the kids into the line up and sink or swim with them. Not the path I hope they take but it is possible with keeping Ray, Mo and Simon.

My hope is they can get someone ready to play now and contribute and they try to get impactful players via trade and maybe, finally a really good signing in free agency although that is tricky this year. Kids could take a step and some break out and make it exciting. I really don't know what path gets chosen but I want to see meaningful hockey sooner than later.. not sure that route is possible if you get a kid like Desnoyers from Utah instead of a package with immediate help. At the same time if Larkin can get you a recent top 5-10 draft pick, that isn't a bad thing.

 

[Steve Yzerlland]

I want a blockbuster type of deal like Larkin Cat and Cossa for Iginla, Dey-however-you-spell it, Cooley or Keller and a first. Type of packages. Not all of them like a package like this. Willing to add more willing to subtract but the core should be a direction setting earthquake. "We need better players"

 

[lilidk]

Yes but ownership still wants to see progress. Yzerman can take some time to figure this out, but his time as GM is coming to an end if he doesn't get this team to the next level. Yzerman has played a big role getting to the point of Larkin wanting out. This doesn't wipe Yzerman's slate clean.

It's not like ownership is going to say, oh well, Steve gets another decade because Larkin pulled the plug.

We don't know what they think, they could also think that we don't have good players and we need total rebuild.

 

[Heaton]

We don't know what they think, they could also think that we don't have good players and we need total rebuild.

No owner wants to go 10+ years without the playoffs. That's a ton of revenue missed. There's always a breaking point and I would be absolutely shocked if ownership is fully onboard going 10, 15, 20 years without the playoffs. It would be unheard of.

Rebuilds are only supported if you can see the progress and light at the end of the tunnel. Right now it's pitch black.

 

[lilidk]

No owner wants to go 10+ years without the playoffs. That's a ton of revenue missed. There's always a breaking point and I would be absolutely shocked if ownership is fully onboard going 10, 15, 20 years without the playoffs. It would be unheard of.

Rebuilds are only supported if you can see the progress and light at the end of the tunnel. Right now it's pitch black.

Then they should trade Cossa for Darnell Nurse, that way we might have NHL best defense. We could afford his pay, team will be bigger and more physical

 

[saska sault]

I want a blockbuster type of deal like Larkin Cat and Cossa for Iginla, Dey-however-you-spell it, Cooley or Keller and a first. Type of packages. Not all of them like a package like this. Willing to add more willing to subtract but the core should be a direction setting earthquake. "We need better players"

If there was a trade like that to be made I would be all for that. I think Mo, Ray and Simon should be your untouchables. I cant imagine Utah trading Cooley or Keller in any situation though without some of those 3 Wings being included. I think even getting a Iginla or Desnoyer may be difficult. Guess that depends how much of a bidding war there really is. Maybe I am also preparing for the possibility the Wings get an underwhelming return and being happy if I am wrong.

 

[The Zermanator]

No owner wants to go 10+ years without the playoffs. That's a ton of revenue missed. There's always a breaking point and I would be absolutely shocked if ownership is fully onboard going 10, 15, 20 years without the playoffs. It would be unheard of.

Rebuilds are only supported if you can see the progress and light at the end of the tunnel. Right now it's pitch black.

Perhaps ownership hasn't forgotten that their patriarch forced previous management to conduct business in a way that mortgaged the future, and as a result the new build started from a deficit, rather than zero.

And it's not pitch black at all, there's just more pessimism around here than on a chain gang.

 

[AlwaysSunnyInDetroit]

Then they should trade Cossa for Darnell Nurse, that way we might have NHL best defense. We could afford his pay, team will be bigger and more physical

i wouldn't take nurse for future considerations unless he had a 1st attached

 

[FMichael]

No owner wants to go 10+ years without the playoffs. That's a ton of revenue missed. There's always a breaking point and I would be absolutely shocked if ownership is fully onboard going 10, 15, 20 years without the playoffs. It would be unheard of.

Rebuilds are only supported if you can see the progress and light at the end of the tunnel. Right now it's pitch black.

At our current pace - if Yzerman tears it all down and engages in another rebuild - with our lottery luck - etc - we're likely gonna surpass Buffalo with the number of seasons missing the playoffs.

Again - I'm tired of this and with no guarantees of future success I'd just assume to a legit 'hockey trade' to get the best current roster player/s for Larkin and Cossa and go from there.

 

[FMichael]

Then they should trade Cossa for Darnell Nurse, that way we might have NHL best defense. We could afford his pay, team will be bigger and more physical

Most will rip apart Nurse for any number of reasons and regardless of his pay he's still likely a 2nd pairing Dman on many teams including Detroit...I know many would be upset, but if we get him for Cossa straight up I for one wouldn't complain.

 

[FMichael]

Perhaps ownership hasn't forgotten that their patriarch forced previous management to conduct business in a way that mortgaged the future, and as a result the new build started from a deficit, rather than zero.

And it's not pitch black at all, there's just more pessimism around here than on a chain gang.

While true, but Holland's drafting was subpar.

 

[Oddbob]

All drafts look good when they are 1 year out. Half these kids listed as centers in their -1 season will play wing next year, or people will doubt their ability to be a center at the next level by the time the draft comes.

This is what happens literally every year, as someone who follows the draft extremely closely.

And I know 1 other thing - I sure as shit don’t want the guys who drafted Kasper and Danielson to be tasked with finding this trajectory changing player for us.

The 2027 doesn't have a hyped up main name yet, which tells me it isn't expected to be a major player right off the hop. We knew about most of the recent drafts years ahead who the projected #1 or 2 are, and so far that hasn't happened. Just from looking at stats, Landon Dupont is the only name that has outstanding stats in his 16 and 17 year old seasons. There are 2-3 centers that have good stats, but not outrageously good stats.

 

[Oddbob]

Why is there talk of trading Edvinsson in several posts in this thread?

Some people have a false idea that both SJ is trading Misa and that Ed could be part of said package to get him. Both are wrong.

 

[Oddbob]

Then they should trade Cossa for Darnell Nurse, that way we might have NHL best defense. We could afford his pay, team will be bigger and more physical

I couldn't hate this more. Nurse is a CAP DUMP! Now we are trading a prospect for a CAP DUMP??? The only way I trade for Nurse is with a 1st attached and they take back Chiarot. Nothing good from our side going to Edmonton.

 

[Pavels Dog]

You don't need top-3 and you don't need a McDavid or Celebrini. There are plenty of you who know upcoming drafts better than me, but from what I've read there are a lot of excellent center prospects ranked near the top of the 2027 draft. We should absolutely be planning to get one of those. It would be negligent not to at this point. Sell older, win-now players for futures, start more kids, and tank a season.

I would personally just rather target a young developing center to get a head start on the process if we're not going to draft a top 3 true high end center prospect anyway.

And no, the cap floor is not a concern, there are easy solutions for that. There's always a plethora of mediocre free agents trying to get paid.

Yes.. we can do the Copp/Compher/Chiarot/Perron/Määttä type signings again.. did that result in top 3-5 picks?

Sure, but I think this is a false argument. Personally, I think we can get a top-6 center outside the top 3 picks (if I'm understanding the 2027 draft correctly, being deep with quality centers in the 1st round).

I don't see how burning the team to the ground (again) only to draft 8th and get another guy in the Kasper/Danielson tier would be anything less than an unmitigated disaster.

 

[Henkka]

I would personally just rather target a young developing center to get a head start on the process if we're not going to draft a top 3 true high end center prospect anyway.

Yeah, that's the way to go. We add a center fitting on the Raymond-Seider core. Kind of a no-brainer move to add on the age core, and not build again a gap between the age-core. Like there was with Larkin.

I don't see how burning the team to the ground (again) only to draft 8th and get another guy in the Kasper/Danielson tier would be anything less than an unmitigated disaster.

That's definitely not the way to go.

 

[RRhoads]

I don't get why anyone would want to trade Dcat or Gibson. One is probably the most loyal and hardest working forward we have, and the other is or number 1 goalie. We have no one to replace either.

 

[datsyukfan]

I don't get why anyone would want to trade Dcat or Gibson. One is probably the most loyal and hardest working forward we have, and the other is or number 1 goalie. We have no one to replace either.

Probably so we can bottom out

 

[Oddbob]

I don't get why anyone would want to trade Dcat or Gibson. One is probably the most loyal and hardest working forward we have, and the other is or number 1 goalie. We have no one to replace either.

I think it is more, if we can't find anyone close to replace Larkin, this team needs to retool and Cat in particular would help us retool. Cat may want out now with the Larkin news, we don't know. He has 1 more year left and we are losing a very important member of the team, for likely much less.

For the record I want Cat resigned long term, IF we are getting someone in the Hischier or Barzal (seems unlikely) level back,, or we think we can dip down for one season and land a center in the draft. Losing a #1 center when we have no replacement and no #2 center is a big hurdle to overcome as far as the team being attractive to 28+ year old players who want to win.

 

[Henkka]

Think Cat will re-sign because he hasn't experienced all that 10 years of misery, and is smarter guy than Larkin knowing how the good times are ahead.

 

[jaster]

I would personally just rather target a young developing center to get a head start on the process if we're not going to draft a top 3 true high end center prospect anyway.

I've said in a couple other places, if you can get a real Larkin replacement, that's better than a 1-year tank. We agree there. I'm just not super hopeful that's going to happen. And short of that happening, I don't think chugging along with what we have in an attempt to make the playoffs and get better is the correct way to go. Most fans were already critical of the quality of the organization and its trajectory with Larkin. Without him, and without an immediate replacement, this team has no chance of making the playoffs anyway, so tank it and get the highest pick you can. The alternative is winding up in the place that nearly everyone has complained about... missing the playoffs, no high pick, and no real hope for improvement moving forward.

Yes.. we can do the Copp/Compher/Chiarot/Perron/Määttä type signings again.. did that result in top 3-5 picks?

It literally does not matter. You are simply picking the path that gives you the best chance at this point. Every path is fraught with risk. Pointing out the risk with one does not support the idea that another is better.

I don't see how burning the team to the ground (again) only to draft 8th and get another guy in the Kasper/Danielson tier would be anything less than an unmitigated disaster.

Again, that's the risk. If we don't get a Larkin replacement this offseason, do I really need to point out the risk of attempting to win with basically the same roster minus Dylan Larkin? Having no true top-6 centers?

So go out there, Stevie. Go out there and try to get that center replacement this offseason. I truly hope he's able to do it. But if he doesn't, we'll circle back around to this topic, and some of you are going to have to face some hard truths.

The direction this franchise needs to take largely hinges on what the return for Dylan Larkin ends up being.

 

[FMichael]

I don't get why anyone would want to trade Dcat or Gibson. One is probably the most loyal and hardest working forward we have, and the other is or number 1 goalie. We have no one to replace either.

Agreed...I sure as f**k don't wanna have to re-tool/re-build/etc and suck for another 5 plus years with the hope that some day we might be good enough to make the playoffs.

 

[brett89]

ideally improve but the FA market sucks and larkin has us by the balls and not many other assets to trade. yzerman has his work cut out for him

 

[Ed Ned and Leddy]

I would really just love to know what the organization thinks about Elias Pettersson.

To get better next year, it really feels like you'd have to both (1) get a young, NHL center back in the Larkin deal (e.g. Lundell, McTavish), and (2) add another top six center via UFA (not happening) or trade.

To trade for a second top 6 center outside of the Larkin deal, I feel like there are only so many names out there (unless Yzerman throws a real curveball).

There's Barzal, who is a really good player but would cost quite a bit (Danielson/Kasper, '27 1st, another good asset seems like a starting point). Would he agree to come here? There's Trochek, who you could probably swap for a Danielson/Kasper pretty close to one for one. But does something like a Trochek/McTavish one two punch get your blood pumping? I'm not loving that. Thomas by all accounts is off the menu, or at the veryleast prohibitively expensive. Then there's Pettersson, who generally fits the Seider timeline and apparently wouldn't cost an arm and a leg. Do you believe in the player or not is the fundamental question there.

It's tough for me not to land at option #2 here (unless the environment with guys like Seider and Raymond is really rough, in which case you may have to go DEFCON 3, but I don't think that's the case). I think you kind of accept than any Larkin return makes you a worse team in 2026 but hopefully a better team in 2028 or so. And I think you follow-up the Larkin deal with other moves (Faulk, Copp, maybe Gibson and Debrincat if you have to) that contribute to that pattern.

 

[Redwing66]

As per the norm I'm way impressed with the thought and effort some of you put towards making the Red Wings great again. The irony of the situation is Larkin is demanding a trade because Yzerman has no plan, no bold move and is wasting his golden playing years - now with Larkin headed out of town we all wonder like Larkin did what is the plan and what moves will be made....we are now asking the question Larkin did.

I still say the best way to get where we need to be is with a new architect my plan would be simple, start at the top and find someone with at least half the passion as this board that has a true vision and hire him. Until then the song remains the same.