I don't think Mike Grier is going to have a job next year.
- Thread starter gary559
- Start date
I think the Ducks would have been more appropriate than the Hawks
TruePowerSlave
Registered User
- Jun 27, 2015
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What's this all about?
Think he has done really well so far. The Sharks should suck at this point.
Think he has done really well so far. The Sharks should suck at this point.
and trading a starting goaltender, who went on to win a cup, while receiving a 4th rounder (Adin Hill).
and trading a 50 point forward with good analytics (Zetterlund) for a terrible 4th liner and a late 2nd
and trading a top 4 defenseman (Emberson) for a worse Defenseman and a late 3rd
and trading another starting goaltender for a 2nd, which was fine at the time, and a middle six headcase (Kovalenko) and one of the worst players in NHL history (Georgiev)
and trading a useful former 1st round prospect (Wiesblatt) for someone who will never play in the NHL
and trading down from 11 and passing on future stars like Lekkerimaki for two longshot prospects (Bystedt, and Lund) and a bust (Havelid)
and trading another top 4 RHD (Middleton) for a trash goaltender and a 5th round pick
and getting terrible value for a 100 point Norris winning Defenseman.
Your post makes 0 sense. CHI is effectively a year ahead of SJS in their respective rebuilds, so to suggest CHI is one more year off suggests Grier has either done an outstanding job to accelerate the SJS rebuild or that he should have 2 more years before facing any real scrutiny.
robertmac43
Forever 43!
- Mar 31, 2015
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I'd be surprised to see him fired next year if they continue their trajectory. He has handled the start of the rebuild well and this team should progress next year.
If they don't and end up taking a step backwards, then yeah, I could see him fired. The next phase of the build is the toughest test, can he continue to add the right pieces to this team and continue to bring them out from the bottom?
If they don't and end up taking a step backwards, then yeah, I could see him fired. The next phase of the build is the toughest test, can he continue to add the right pieces to this team and continue to bring them out from the bottom?
leafsfan5
Registered User
- Jun 14, 2014
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Hasn't he been doing an incredible job? They have some amazing pieces and while sucking the vibes on the team are high (something that's hard to do as you can see with Chicago or Buffalo)
Keeping a good culture while struggling is the biggest sign of a good program, SJ has that
Keeping a good culture while struggling is the biggest sign of a good program, SJ has that
People say this but it isn’t true for the Sharks.
We missed out on a 3rd overall pick in 2020 because of not tanking and trying to extend a competitive window with Karlsson. We then got the 7th overall pick the next season and still had bloated contracts and aging players. Before Grier was hired we were all the way up to 11th worst and stuck in no man’s land with Karlsson, Burns, Hertl, Couture, Vlasic tied to almost half the cap hit.
Grier trades Burns, ups Karlsson’s value and instead of trying to spin shit into gold and try to “retool” around Karlsson like the prior GM absolutely would have done, he makes arguably the trade of the year and gets the equivalent of two first round picks (one of them Sam Dickinson) for him with minimal retention. That only happens because Burns gets traded and he convinces a desperate GM that Karlsson can still be a franchise player.
Hertl trade turned into Askarov, hopefully that works out but was a clear need in the pipeline. Couture and Vlasic are/will be riding into the sunset soon.
So while it seems easy to tank there were legit questions of just exactly how a team like San Jose was going to tank because of the massive contracts and flat cap. Grier navigated that plus nailed the picks and got lucky along the way. It’s not as easy as it looks in 3 seasons to do what he has done. Sharks have excellent draft capital, one of the most valuable pieces in the NHL in Celebrini and a clean cap sheet.
That Hertl trade is why the Sharks have Askarov as a starter of the future starting next season. If they're right about Askarov, that 1.3 mil in dead money is worth it.
Calling Hill a starter at that point is overly generous. He had a career high of 25 games played that season with the Sharks and I would put any negativity anyone would have on that trade toward Joe Will for trading for Kahkonen and putting the team in a position where they have three NHL goalies under contract for the next season. It was highly unlikely that any of the three in the 2022 offseason were going to have much trade value. And who knows if the draft pick, Christian Kirsch, will be anything but he's only turning 19 in June.
I don't have an issue at this point with criticizing the Zetterlund trade but he was expendable and not a real difference maker for a rebuild.
Emberson is not a top four defenseman. He is and has been consistently on Edmonton's 3rd pair. A solid player for sure but getting a 3rd for him as a waiver pickup and the subsequent 3rd or 4th round pick for Ceci being rented to Dallas isn't a bad move.
I don't understand why anyone criticizes the Blackwood trade. He was a rental the moment we traded for Askarov and we got a good return for the rebuild. Yeah, Kovalenko may not work out here but he'll probably be part of another trade that will help the team. Worrying about taking Georgiev back when we were obviously going to be sellers going into the season, much less after losing the first nine games of the season, is whining for the sake of whining.
Calling Wiesblatt a useful former 1st round prospect when he managed a whole 5 NHL games with the Preds this season is looking for reasons to complain. That was a nothing-for-nothing trade.
The trade down at the '22 draft is good value for what you're moving. I'm not willing to put whatever failures come out of the 2022 draft on Grier when he was on the job for three days by then. A lot of evaluations of prospects were done by what was still there at that time from the previous management.
The Middleton for Kahkonen trade was Joe Will.
The Karlsson trade is largely how we ended up with Sam Dickinson and the Dallas 1st round pick. For a player with a full NMC making 11.5 million, getting two 1st round picks out of him is exceptional value for someone we would've had to pay to get rid of when Grier was initially hired.
That is a seriously inaccurate/one-sided/revisionist post. Hill had a hard time staying healthy with SJS and only won a cup because Brossoit got injured. He was only playing because Thompson got injured, so Hill was effectively #3 on VGK’s depth chart.
Emberson wasn’t even a top 4 D on a terrible Sharks team. If you are going to look at the Ceci trade, you should also include the 1st round pick the Sharks got from DAL when Granlund and he went over because having TDL trade capital was very obviously part of Grier’s strategy in getting him from EDM - not to mention getting value for Granlund who was a cap dump in the EK65 trade.
Weisblatt was useful? He has played all of 5 NHL games and couldn’t stick on a terrible NSH team.
Grier dumping EK65 was a huge win. Some thought he was untradeable due to his cap hit and NMC clause. Criticizing that trade because of value totally misses the point. Need to also include the assets SJS has as a result (facilitated the Dickinson draft pick).
I didn’t like the Zetterlund trade either, but that was for a player the org projects as a shut-down 3C (not a 4th liner as you characterized).
The Middleton trade was meh and should have been for more like a 3rd than a 5th - not worth complaining about IMO. What you are conveniently overlooking is he was a career journeyman and didn’t become an NHL regular until the season he was traded (14 career NHL games in the 3 preceding seasons). Definitely a late bloomer.
As an outsider and a fan of a different team, I feel like Grier has done a pretty good job actually. There is a lot to like about the Sharks future. So, respectfully, you are quite wrong OP.
Shark Finn
∀dministrator
After what DW did in his final years, I have absolutely no complaints so far. Him getting rid of Karlsson and Hertl alone was genius, not to mention what they're were traded for.
Mr Fahrenheit
Valar Morghulis
- Oct 9, 2009
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You are suggesting that unloading long, albatross contracts and building the best prospect pool in the league in 2 years is something any GM can do at any time?
I think people often forget that continued employment is based off of vibes, which are often but not exclusively driven by results. The vibes in San Jose continue to be good. They could easily turn bad next year just like they did this past year in Chicago. It won't be until they actually turn though that Grier starts feeling pressure.
BertCorbeau
F*ck cancer - RIP Fugu and Buffaloed
In a full scorched earth a couple of seasons as they have had are somewhat expected. And they’ve done well I. Getting some young foundational pieces in play but going into next season I think you need to start expecting more competition than just languishing at the bottom.
Some growth in the youth needs to happen but now they need to start making more moves help support their young core.
Some growth in the youth needs to happen but now they need to start making more moves help support their young core.
Machinehead
Bring Back Olli
I don't know, I kinda think they have some good pieces. When you get as old as they did, and tear it down to the extent they had to, it's gonna take some time.
Many of the 2020 class are going to require waivers next year. We'll see if Wiesblatt earns an NHL spot next year but he doesn't seem like somebody I'd be too angry about at this point. At a certain point 'former first rounder' is better described as a failed to launch prospect.
Analytics tends to value trading down. I usually prefer to be the team trading up. But in the Sharks case, I could understand Grier wanted to restock the cupboard in a world where they don't have Smith and Celebrini yet.
We'll see if Lekkerimaki is really a "future star." It's a limited sample size but I thought Bystedt and Lund were doing alright.
There were limited suitors who could fit Karlsson especially in a flat cap environment. I could understand being upset if Pittsburgh had been able to flip Karlsson for some fantastic package at this deadline but they seemingly have run into the same problem as San Jose.
ITM
As Long As It Takes
- Jan 26, 2012
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Not getting the thrust of the thread in the least.
With the last deal - as a function of having acquired Askarov I'm thinking? - Grier acquired another 2nd plus on-ice assets.
His draft of Celebrini, then Sam Dickinson (and potentially Chernysov) is going to look like the Canadiens recent Slaf-Beck-Hutson draw. <chef's kiss>.
He seems to be doing precisely what a club in full rebuild should be doing.
Attention spans in the 2020s are obviously rotting.
With the last deal - as a function of having acquired Askarov I'm thinking? - Grier acquired another 2nd plus on-ice assets.
His draft of Celebrini, then Sam Dickinson (and potentially Chernysov) is going to look like the Canadiens recent Slaf-Beck-Hutson draw. <chef's kiss>.
He seems to be doing precisely what a club in full rebuild should be doing.
Attention spans in the 2020s are obviously rotting.
I wouldn't say everything Grier has done has been perfect, but he did a very good job of selling off the Sharks' players who had value and getting value back. I think Sharks fans should be pleased with what he's done so far.
You need veterans (but more importantly, the right veterans) to show the younglings how to take the next step to doing what it takes to win. I would agree that this is mostly what he should be doing in 2026-27, though. The Sharks really only need just 1 or 2 veterans for this upcoming season.
Thank you for that post. All I'm just saying they are primed more than any other rebuild team to do something next year and it's going to be a defining moment if they do or don't. I think the Hawks are up next year. Sorry to the ducks, I think it's a broken half rebuild like Carolina in 2010's.
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