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Hypothetical: If Ovechkin reaches 950 or 1000 goals, is he top ten all-time?

Ghost of Murph said:
1st place all-time goals scored
3rd place all-time in hits

Why does he now have to reach some new number in the most important stat category in hockey to be regarded as top ten? Pro tip: Ovi has been top ten for a while now.
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And led his club to a Cup. Top 10 forwards for sure.
 
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EXTRAS said:
I guess it's a longevity thing vs a prime thing. He had a great prime. And it's cool he's padding goals but I don't think anyone has considered him a top player in the league the last 6-7 years. Were his 10 elite years top 10 in the nhl all time? Was he the best goal scorer ever or just the one who played the longest?

For example, A healthy lemieux probably smashes the goal scoring record. Bossy?
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Padding goals lol, he's got the third most goals in the league this year at 39 years old missing 16 games with a broken leg, set the record for most goals by a 39 year old, has scored nearly half his goals after the age of 30, his team is one of the top teams in the league this year, etc. etc.
 
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GlitchMarner said:
1000 goals is probably out of reach, but who knows with this guy? People have been writing him off since 2013 and he's as resilient as they come. Apparently he's announced that next season will be his last in the NHL, but I guess it's possible he'll change his mind and play one or two more.

This season, he's scoring at a 50+ goal clip. He's third in the League in goals playing for one of the best teams in the League. I think this season definitely adds to his career and legacy. Players usually don't add much this late, but I think it's possible (theoretically) for him to add even more.

Let's say he somehow maintains his pace since February or so of 2024 throughout next season, doesn't get hurt and scores over 50 goals and hits 950 career goals (possibly winning the Rocket Richard) and the Capitals are good again (not necessarily as good but one of the better teams in the EC). Would that be enough to solidify him as a top ten player all-time? What if he re-signs with WSH and puts up about 35 goals in 2027 and then hits 1000 goals the following season?

I know some already consider him a top ten player all-time and others will never put him ahead of guys like Crosby, Jagr, Bourque, Beliveau, Hull etc (even if he scored 1200 goals). But for those who see him in the range of players with an argument for top ten all-time, would hitting 950 or 1000 goals while remaining a top goal scorer in the League solidify him as a top ten player in NHL (or hockey) history?

I think a second Cup (with a solid to good playoff run) would really boost his legacy in some people's eyes. It could happen.
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its a distinction without a difference at this point.
 
Massively overrated.

Top 10?

At stats?

Sure.

At winning?

I can think of 25 players that would better help you win a must win game 7.

He’s no more a top 10 guy than Brett Hull was.

Fun to watch. Greatest scorer.

But what actually matters is not pure stats, but a player’s net effect on the ice.

And there is this whole other part of the game called defense where he’s arguably the worst floater of the modern era.

Hockey isn’t just stats.
 
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ijuka said:
I thought he already was top 10?

Truth is, though him breaking Gretzky's record is an interesting novelty, whatever he does at the age of 40 does little to change his status one way or another. He's already defined his career.

Unless, of course, he wins a cup this season, for example.
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He is, this is just psy-ops to make you think otherwise.

OP is sus, as the 2022 youth would say.
 
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pi314 said:
Massively overrated.

Top 10?

At stats?

Sure.

At winning?

I can think of 25 players that would better help you win a must win game 7.
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When Ovechkin came to the Capitals it was a lottery team.

They have the second most points in the NHL over the past 20 years and there are probably zero other hall of famers.
 
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pi314 said:
And there is this whole other part of the game called defense where he’s arguably the worst floater of the modern era.
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Sidney Crosby is the worst floater of the modern era - which is why he will almost certainly end this season with more ES goals against than any other forward over the past 15 seasons:

www.nhl.com

NHL Stats

The official source for NHL Stats including skaters, goalies, teams stats and more.
www.nhl.com www.nhl.com

And for those of you who prefer 5v5 over ES, Sidney Crosby is the absolutely worst forward in the NHL at that too:

Player Season Totals - Natural Stat Trick

This idea that Sidney Crosby is great at defense, or good at defense, or even average defensively has always been a farce. The stats do not back it up. At all. Nor have the ever aside from a few small samples (which can be shown for Ovie as well).

We can do the eye test too if you like - it won't go well for you.
 
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Midnight Judges said:
When Ovechkin came to the Capitals it was a lottery team.

They have the second most wins in the NHL over the past 20 years and there are probably zero other hall of famers.
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Was about to post this, three Presidents trophies and working on fourth.

1743871553887.png


PS
Too bad they did not have Maxime Talbot and Phil Kessel when they needed them in p-offs :sarcasm:
 
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pi314 said:
Massively overrated.

Top 10?

At stats?

Sure.

At winning?

I can think of 25 players that would better help you win a must win game 7.

He’s no more a top 10 guy than Brett Hull was.

Fun to watch. Greatest scorer.

But what actually matters is not pure stats, but a player’s net effect on the ice.

And there is this whole other part of the game called defense where he’s arguably the worst floater of the modern era.

Hockey isn’t just stats.
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Team success does not define individual greatness, and that’s a lazy argument to detract from a players standing as an all time great, come on man lol…

Should Ray Bourque not be considered one of the best D ever because he won only 1 cup?

Was Chris Osgood a better player than Dominic Hasek because he won more cups?

Winning cups adds to legacy, and I’d agree with most that not winning does detract from it. But he does have one, and you’re out here making it sound like he’s the reason they don’t have more lol.
 
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Dingo said:
i would have agreed with you until this season.

He just actually put another ELITE goalscoring, and even semi-elite point producing, season at 39. Its bonkers.

If he were to score 40, or break 80pts next year it WOULD add to his legacy, imo.

Now, it wouldnt add to his 'peak' which was really just 2007-2010, but he is anything but a Dave Andreychuk-type accumulator at this point - These are REAL seasons.

Since Matthews joined the league (i believe Ovechkin was already 30) Ovechkin is 3rd in goals.

Like Gretzky post Edmonton, you can remove his BEST years and he STILL has a spot in the HOF. (Gretzky a more rounded offensive player, Art Rosses, etc. dont get me wrong)
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He is 5th in the NHL this season in points/60 in all situations and 5th in points/60 in 5 vs. 5 situations as well.

The four ahead of him in points/60 right now are the four best players in the world in their primes - Kucherov, Draisatl, MacKinnon and McDavid.
 
pi314 said:
Massively overrated.

Top 10?

At stats?

Sure.

At winning?

I can think of 25 players that would better help you win a must win game 7.

He’s no more a top 10 guy than Brett Hull was.

Fun to watch. Greatest scorer.

But what actually matters is not pure stats, but a player’s net effect on the ice.

And there is this whole other part of the game called defense where he’s arguably the worst floater of the modern era.

Hockey isn’t just stats.
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So you're saying he's just like Matthews?
 
Avsfan1921 said:
Team success does not define individual greatness, and that’s a lazy argument to detract from a players standing as an all time great, come on man lol…

Should Ray Bourque not be considered one of the best D ever because he won only 1 cup?

Was Chris Osgood a better player than Dominic Hasek because he won more cups?

Winning cups adds to legacy, and I’d agree with most that not winning does detract from it. But he does have one, and you’re out here making it sound like he’s the reason they don’t have more lol.
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He’s often the reason they lost those games.

Game 7 turning the puck over for 2 goals with lazy defensive effort.

This is the NFL equivalent discussion of Ovechkin.

 
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pi314 said:
Massively overrated.

Top 10?

At stats?

Sure.

At winning?

I can think of 25 players that would better help you win a must win game 7.

He’s no more a top 10 guy than Brett Hull was.

Fun to watch. Greatest scorer.

But what actually matters is not pure stats, but a player’s net effect on the ice.

And there is this whole other part of the game called defense where he’s arguably the worst floater of the modern era.

Hockey isn’t just stats.
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Show us on the doll where mean man Ovechkin hurt you
 
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Randyne said:
Ovechkin makes team better. WSH P% with Ovi .614; w/o Ovi .513
Sid makes team worse. PIT P% with Sid .601; w/o Sid .633
It's a fact.

But media put in your head completely different picture.
Even this season WSH better with Ovechkin, but media said otherwise.
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Sid definitely does not make teams worse. He’s just been more healthy when his team is bad somehow
 
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SkinsFan09 said:
He is 5th in the NHL this season in points/60 in all situations and 5th in points/60 in 5 vs. 5 situations as well.

The four ahead of him in points/60 right now are the four best players in the world in their primes - Kucherov, Draisatl, MacKinnon and McDavid.
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ya. i knew that.

per 60 is a really good stat, and i really love what he has done at 5 on 5.

One thing, though, is that he isnt actually out there a ton of minutes at even strength. I think there is a bit of a trade off in per/60, wherein the players that can handle the workload/not cost you defensively, won't be wuite as high because they are logging a lot of hard ice time.

Ovie is saving his legs for scoring opportunities/powerplays a bit.

Its still fantastic what he is doing, and 13th in straight up points per game is nuts in and of itself.

He is having an alltime old man season, i just think there are quite a few guys ahead of him in terms of 'best forward' right now, if we are talking straight up ability, age ignored.
 
Griff Tannen said:
Sid definitely does not make teams worse. He’s just been more healthy when his team is bad somehow
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He obviously doesn't make his teams worse but it also is evidence of how nice it is to have another all-time center on your roster for your entire career. Almost like that helps with winning.
 
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