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How was Torts Analytically in Philly?

LaffyTaffy13

LaffyTaffy13

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May 10, 2022
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Not asking how much he used analytics but rather how the team grades out under his coaching vs the new guy
 
Torts had the team near the top of the league in xGF%.

We don't know how they'll grade out with the new guy until the new guy has been there awhile. At least a full season, probably more.

Torts did in Philly what he pretty much always does. He sets a good standard and gets pretty much everyone to meet it, but he holds back talent. He's not the coach you win with, but he's the coach before the coach.

I don't know if they'll have the roster to execute it, but the best window is after Torts leaves and the new guy is still new. Straight ahead hockey but with a little bit more freedom.
 
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Bad.

Tortorella has one precisely ONE playoff series win since 2012-13 season. They had one Cinderella season where they swept a strong Tampa team in the 1st round and then immediately got bounced in the 2nd round.

Can we please stop acting like this guy is some legendarily successful coach?
 
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Machinehead said:
He's not the coach you win with, but he's the coach before the coach.
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But what has any coach after him accomplished with any of the teams that he coached?

Correct me if I'm wrong, but your point was that he's a 'stepping stone' coach in that he sets up the team for the next coach to have success after he's gone.
 
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Rodgerwilco said:
But what has any coach after him accomplished with any of the teams that he coached?

Correct me if I'm wrong, but your point was that he's a 'stepping stone' coach in that he sets up the team for the next coach to have success after he's gone.
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The Rangers went to the Finals after he left and then won the President's Trophy. Look at the roster. It's the last time the team had decent underlying numbers.

Once AV sank his teeth in, they went straight down and haven't been a good team at even strength since.

Torts has found work since then. AV, who actually coached the team when they were winning, hasn't.

If you're defining "success" solely as winning the Stanley Cup, he hasn't been on any of those teams since 2004, but he's responsible for the only decent run of Rangers hockey in the last 30 years.
 
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Machinehead said:
The Rangers went to the Finals after he left and then won the President's Trophy. Look at the roster. It's the last time the team had decent underlying numbers.

Once AV sank his teeth in, they went straight down and haven't been a good team at even strength since.

Torts has found work since then. AV, who actually coached the team when they were winning, hasn't.

If you're defining "success" solely as winning the Stanley Cup, he hasn't been on any of those teams since 2004, but he's responsible for the only decent run of Rangers hockey in the last 30 years.
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That was a decade and a half ago that he coached a team that immediately had better success after he left.

Torts found work on floundering teams that were desperate enough to hire him. He never had any objective measure of success after getting to the semi-finals a dozen years ago.

What do you mean "AV hasnt found work since then"? He was coaching up until 2022 season before he was replaced... By Torts...... AV had literally the same amount of success since leaving NYR as Torts has had... One singular playoff series win.
 
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The only metric I know off the top of my head is Ersson has the worst GSAA in the league. Not really Torts' fault as goalie coaching is separate but still mildly interesting enough for me to remember it.
 
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Rodgerwilco said:
That was a decade and a half ago that he coached a team that immediately had better success after he left.

Torts found work on floundering teams that were desperate enough to hire him. He never had any objective measure of success after getting to the semi-finals a dozen years ago.

What do you mean "AV hasnt found work since then"? He was coaching up until 2022 season before he was replaced... By Torts...... AV had literally the same amount of success since leaving NYR as Torts has had... One singular playoff series win.
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You know, I forgot AV coached Philly. No wonder they were such a shithole when Torts got there.

You can't necessarily measure success by wins and losses. Torts did what he was hired to do. That Flyers team is great at forechecking and there's buy-in. There's a foundation that's going to last as long as those players last.

I'd much rather be them now going forward than the Rangers who won 55 games last year with a babysitter behind the bench.
 
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Machinehead said:
Torts had the team near the top of the league in xGF%.

We don't know how they'll grade out with the new guy until the new guy has been there awhile. At least a full season, probably more.

Torts did in Philly what he pretty much always does. He sets a good standard and gets pretty much everyone to meet it, but he holds back talent. He's not the coach you win with, but he's the coach before the coach.

I don't know if they'll have the roster to execute it, but the best window is after Torts leaves and the new guy is still new. Straight ahead hockey but with a little bit more freedom.
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Well said. He is the coach that instills discipline and culture basics for a rebuilding roster to help the team prepare for contention. He has his place. It does appear he no longer wishes for this role and wants a contending role but his style is not for such a roster.
 
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PatriceBergeronFan said:
Well said. He is the coach that instills discipline and culture basics for a rebuilding roster to help the team prepare for contention. He has his place. It does appear he no longer wishes for this role and wants a contending role but his style is not for such a roster.
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I agree.

He might want that, and I get why he does, but he'd go to a team that has their shit together and start screaming at their stars who already earned their keep. It wouldn't be a fit.

This is what he specializes in and when the Flyers get good, the next guy will get the credit.

You know who isn't that far from winning games and ostensibly could be a contender, but also absolutely does not have their shit together? The Rangers.

I would love to have Torts back. I want him to scream at Lafreniere until he dies and comes back to life as an NHL player.
 
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PatriceBergeronFan said:
Well said. He is the coach that instills discipline and culture basics for a rebuilding roster to help the team prepare for contention. He has his place. It does appear he no longer wishes for this role and wants a contending role but his style is not for such a roster.
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This feels like such a fabricated talking point regarding Torts.... Aside from the Rangers team 12 years ago which got to the finals after he left, what teams have actually contended since he left? Which teams did he ever set up for success, who actually had success, after he was fired?
 
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Machinehead said:
You know, I forgot AV coached Philly. No wonder they were such a shithole when Torts got there.

You can't necessarily measure success by wins and losses. Torts did what he was hired to do. That Flyers team is great at forechecking and there's buy-in. There's a foundation that's going to last as long as those players last.

I'd much rather be them now going forward than the Rangers who won 55 games last year with a babysitter behind the bench.
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Don't you actually look up and confirm what you're saying before just spouting it out? It's hard to put much weight into a statement like "no wonder they were such a shithole" when you literally didn't even know that AV even coached there until I told you that he did....

They were a "shithole" when Torts got there, and they're still a shithole when he left.... AV gets criticized by you for making the team a "shithole" (when you didn't even know he coached there), but Torts gets a pass for the team still being a shithole after he was there for 2.5 seasons?

You're creating some random undeserved narrative that Torts has created some legendary 'foundation that will last' with a bottom feeding team that doesn't look in any way "inspired" by his presence there.


...You'd rather be the last place team in the East this year (and a team that's floundered under Torts' entire tenure), than a team that has actually had a measure of success recently? Where is the logic in this asinine assertion?
 
Lazlo Hollyfeld said:
I’m starting to wonder if people who believe Torts is still a good coach have some issues with their fathers that they need to work out.
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It's hard for me to actually believe that anyone truly thinks Torts is a good coach.... He's won 1 playoff series in the last 12 years.... He goes to bottom feeding teams, sometimes makes them marginally better for a short stretch of time, and then gets the boot.

He's been coasting off of a Stanley Cup win 2 decades ago because "wow look at him he's so feisty, he yells at players and throws tantrums in media scrums".
 
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Rodgerwilco said:
Don't you actually look up and confirm what you're saying before just spouting it out? It's hard to put much weight into a statement like "no wonder they were such a shithole" when you literally didn't even know that AV even coached there until I told you that he did....

They were a "shithole" when Torts got there, and they're still a shithole when he left.... AV gets criticized by you for making the team a "shithole" (when you didn't even know he coached there), but Torts gets a pass for the team still being a shithole after he was there for 2.5 seasons?

You're creating some random undeserved narrative that Torts has created some legendary 'foundation that will last' with a bottom feeding team that doesn't look in any way "inspired" by his presence there.


...You'd rather be the last place team in the East this year (and a team that's floundered under Torts' entire tenure), than a team that has actually had a measure of success recently? Where is the logic in this asinine assertion?
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The Flyers just played the Rangers and it was clear which team had more structure and had actual standards to adhere to.

The Flyers are bad because of the roster and primarily goaltending. That's not the coach's job.
 
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Machinehead said:
The Flyers just played the Rangers and it was clear which team had more structure and had actual standards to adhere to.

The Flyers are bad because of the roster and primarily goaltending. That's not the coach's job.
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That's your entire response to my whole comment..............?
 
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Machinehead said:
The Rangers went to the Finals after he left and then won the President's Trophy. Look at the roster. It's the last time the team had decent underlying numbers.

Once AV sank his teeth in, they went straight down and haven't been a good team at even strength since.

Torts has found work since then. AV, who actually coached the team when they were winning, hasn't.

If you're defining "success" solely as winning the Stanley Cup, he hasn't been on any of those teams since 2004, but he's responsible for the only decent run of Rangers hockey in the last 30 years.
Click to expand...
He made Girardi a competent player and I know how much you hate him haha.
 
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