Speculation: How was Luce never fired?

[Android 16]

I know he's not 100% to blame, but just curious to hear what you guys think about Scott Luce. How has Mr. Luce managed to not get canned after years and years of miserable drafting? Blackmail perhaps?

Just take a look at our draft history since he was hired in 2002.

What do you guys think?

Click to read more...

 

[c10ne]

Agreed x10

 

[Gentle Man]

That 2010 draft probably saved him lol

 

[Erased]

Wow, 5 of 7 players drafted in 09 made it to the NHL in some capacity. That's pretty good.

 

[Brokin]

When you work for a group of owners that nickel and dimed this organization for so many years, you really think he had a first class scouting network to get results? Heck, even when Tallon arrived they were probably still operating on a shoestring budget.

That still doesn't excuse him from not picking up some talent along the way. Just throwing darts at a board, a chimp could have probably done just as good beyond the second round.

This is the make it or break it year for team Tallon/Luce. If we don't make the playoffs, then it's on to the next GM and director of scouting. These guys will be under a microsope the next few years as their drafted players will either help or hurt their effort to bring a winner to South Florida.

 

[iam76]

Since tallon came on board we have drafted well IMO. Tallon greatest skill is as a talent evaluator. So I agree I don't love Luce.. I do like tallon as our gm.

 

[PanthersHockey1]

When you look at lists like this it is amazing to see how few of the guys drafted actually make it to the big leagues and have an impact.

 

[oOwlCat]

Wow..... I don't know.

 

[Dread Clawz]

Because he's good. Look at all our late round promising picks. Everyone loves Brown, Rau, Racine etc. Who scouted them.

 

[Android 16]

I'm not even going to comment on 2002-2009. I'll just say that run was a massive failure with zero direction resulting in one complete disaster after another. Everything changed once Dale got here and I'm happy with his results thus far. However, we've only seen one hit after the first round. Trocheck is the only gem discovered after round one. When I say gem I mean at least he's an NHL player. He put up 30 points in 70 games and that could be considered a solid rookie year in the NHL. So, maybe there's more to Vinny Trocheck and he could become a legit top-six player someday. Other than that pick, we've seen zero NHL players so far. I really hope that changes soon. Maybe Matheson will make a big impact next year, who knows. I really hope so because that 2012 draft is looking like utter crap. Anyway, I'm just dumbfounded as to how Luce survived job evaluations, etc after what he did between 2002-2009. It worries me a bit that he's still on board.

This is the NHL talent he amassed in that seven years. These are the players currently under NHL contracts in 2015.

TOTAL = 64 draft picks (1st = 9, 2nd = 10, 3rd = 6, 4th = 10, 5th = 8, 6th = 8, 7th = 7, 8th = 2, 9th = 4)

NHL players currently under contract:
• Jay Bouwmeester
• Nathan Horton
• Dmitry Kulikov
• Tanner Glass

2015 unrestricted free agents under NHL contracts last season:
• Michael Frolik
• David Booth
• Gregory Campbell

 

[RainingRats]

No idea. His horrible picks for so many years crippled this franchise. His scouting also plays a part in signings like Bolland and trades like Pirri and Hayes so it's not just drafts he should be evaluated on.

On a side note, no idea how we spend money on Bolland instead of Stralman. If we gave Stralman, Bolland's money our D would be really really good.

 

[Android 16]

They had open try-outs for a 3rd string goalie. How about open try-outs to be a reserve scout! They can't do any worse than what we've seen in the past! Bouw, Kulikov, Glass and Horton! And Horton doesn't even count really because he's dealing with a debilitating injury.

 

[CanadianPantherFan]

I'd be a good scout. Natural eye for it. So how much HF boys scrapping together for me for my first contract ???

 

[RCGP]

We don't know what goes on behind the scenes. Maybe those bad picks were a result of organizational philosophies instead of just drafting who Luce thought was the best player.

For example you know Keenan preferred a certain kind of player so he could have taken the board the scouts compiled and targeted guys with certain skill sets. Horton and Stewart are examples of this.

The Flames are another team like this. Todd Button has been their scouting director forever yet they drafted poorly under Sutter but well ever since Sutter was fired.

 

[Beezeral]

It sticks out how badly this team has done after the 1st round. Very few have made it to the NHL. completely unacceptable.

 

[I am not exposed]

It sticks out how badly this team has done after the 1st round. Very few have made it to the NHL. completely unacceptable.

It sticks out badly how we've done in the 1st round as well!

The last 5 years do look a lot better.

 

[Thewselius]

Good to see most of 2010 still occupies our depth. I was really hoping either John Hecimovic or Anthony Stewart would work out. It seems physical ability alone wasn't enough, especially if you skate like molasses. Always liked Horton, it's a shame he had so many injuries.

 

[Panteras]

Some of these picks are just so utterly bad, specially early round picks that it's disgusting specially considering players drafter later or those horrific trade downs we did sigh

 

[catsfan67]

I'm not even going to comment on 2002-2009. I'll just say that run was a massive failure with zero direction resulting in one complete disaster after another. Everything changed once Dale got here and I'm happy with his results thus far. However, we've only seen one hit after the first round. Trocheck is the only gem discovered after round one. When I say gem I mean at least he's an NHL player. He put up 30 points in 70 games and that could be considered a solid rookie year in the NHL. So, maybe there's more to Vinny Trocheck and he could become a legit top-six player someday. Other than that pick, we've seen zero NHL players so far. I really hope that changes soon. Maybe Matheson will make a big impact next year, who knows. I really hope so because that 2012 draft is looking like utter crap. Anyway, I'm just dumbfounded as to how Luce survived job evaluations, etc after what he did between 2002-2009. It worries me a bit that he's still on board.

This is the NHL talent he amassed in that seven years. These are the players currently under NHL contracts in 2015.

TOTAL = 64 draft picks (1st = 9, 2nd = 10, 3rd = 6, 4th = 10, 5th = 8, 6th = 8, 7th = 7, 8th = 2, 9th = 4)

NHL players currently under contract:
• Jay Bouwmeester
• Nathan Horton
• Dmitry Kulikov
• Tanner Glass

2015 unrestricted free agents under NHL contracts last season:
• Michael Frolik
• David Booth
• Gregory Campbell

Perhaps you are forgetting the 2 out of 3 Calder trophies in the past 3 years. (See your username for example). Also I would assume the re-hiring and promotion was most likely warranted by a "what have you done for me lately basis." The scouting staff as a unit tries to pick the best player available, it is no fault of their own whether or not the NHL team has a unit that can support the young talent or not. As to your one hit after the first round comment, we will see if you hold the same stance after Rocco starts seeing a regular NHL shift. Not to mention Jakob Markstrom who will be an NHL goalie next year. McCoshen will be an NHLer, Petrovic made the jump this year and Zach Hyman will get a crack at the Leafs lineup next year. While I realize two of the above mentioned are no longer Panthers, they negate your point of "only gem after round one" if you're defining gem as an NHLer. 2012 draft there were 5 picks so evidently yes there is not much room for error. Matheson will be an NHLer, Hodges is in the system, Delnov is Russian factor, and Beauvillier will get a chance to be a pro next year, Nielsen (the 7th rounder mind you) is in fact no where to be seen. On the topic of 7th rounders I would like to draw to your attention Matt Bartkowski a regular impact NHler who we picked in 2008. Sure it is easy to point out some of the not so wise picks, but you can't sweep the positive evidence under the rug. Luce has done a fine job the past couple years, and it is my belief he warranted 'not getting fired."

 

[adam graves]

Perhaps you are forgetting the 2 out of 3 Calder trophies in the past 3 years. (See your username for example). Also I would assume the re-hiring and promotion was most likely warranted by a "what have you done for me lately basis." The scouting staff as a unit tries to pick the best player available, it is no fault of their own whether or not the NHL team has a unit that can support the young talent or not. As to your one hit after the first round comment, we will see if you hold the same stance after Rocco starts seeing a regular NHL shift. Not to mention Jakob Markstrom who will be an NHL goalie next year. McCoshen will be an NHLer, Petrovic made the jump this year and Zach Hyman will get a crack at the Leafs lineup next year. While I realize two of the above mentioned are no longer Panthers, they negate your point of "only gem after round one" if you're defining gem as an NHLer. 2012 draft there were 5 picks so evidently yes there is not much room for error. Matheson will be an NHLer, Hodges is in the system, Delnov is Russian factor, and Beauvillier will get a chance to be a pro next year, Nielsen (the 7th rounder mind you) is in fact no where to be seen. On the topic of 7th rounders I would like to draw to your attention Matt Bartkowski a regular impact NHler who we picked in 2008. Sure it is easy to point out some of the not so wise picks, but you can't sweep the positive evidence under the rug. Luce has done a fine job the past couple years, and it is my belief he warranted 'not getting fired."

Perhaps you should give credit to Dale tallon for the picks as well these last three years.

Logic would dictate since DT picked so very well in Chicago, and now here, he is the constant. Meanwhile Luce has been nothing less than an unmitigating disaster prior to Tallons arrival.

So yes the question is a fair one how he has survived 13 years and what his body of work has warranted a promotion.

 

[luby3131]

Perhaps you should give credit to Dale tallon for the picks as well these last three years.

Logic would dictate since DT picked so very well in Chicago, and now here, he is the constant. Meanwhile Luce has been nothing less than an unmitigating disaster prior to Tallons arrival.

So yes the question is a fair one how he has survived 13 years and what his body of work has warranted a promotion.

I believe this is a misconception. Look at the Tallon drafts in Chicago, outside of the obvious Toews and Kane picks, he had his fair share of blunders (Jack Skille and Kyle Beach say hello). To be fair though, the later round picks aren't coming from the GM, they come from the head of amateur scouting and the area scouts.

 

[JP Mick]

Anyone in any field can become more skilled at their profession providing they have the ability to learn, adapt and put in the effort. Luce may have got off to a slow start but he seems to have been doing a solid job lately.

 

[Dread Clawz]

I believe this is a misconception. Look at the Tallon drafts in Chicago, outside of the obvious Toews and Kane picks, he had his fair share of blunders (Jack Skille and Kyle Beach say hello). To be fair though, the later round picks aren't coming from the GM, they come from the head of amateur scouting and the area scouts.

Yeah, Tallon self-admittedly is oblivious outside the top 30 or so prospects.

 

[catsfan67]

Perhaps you should give credit to Dale tallon for the picks as well these last three years.

Logic would dictate since DT picked so very well in Chicago, and now here, he is the constant. Meanwhile Luce has been nothing less than an unmitigating disaster prior to Tallons arrival.

So yes the question is a fair one how he has survived 13 years and what his body of work has warranted a promotion.

The debate over how much scouting DT does is deserving of a whole new thread haha. But to your point of unmitigating disaster, how come before Tallon the responsibility fell solely on the Director of Scouting and none of the prior GMs yet as soon as Tallon arrived the GM is the one to take the credit. No question Tallon has done a lot for the organization, it is just unfair to give him all the credit for all the new, trash Luce for the old and not include Luce in any of the new progress being made.

 

[gudzilla]

how much does luce actually scout?

how good are our local scouts? player development? pro scouts? etc

most of the times, the bosses aren't the best and most knowledgeable people, but they know how to deal with people, and maybe luce is good at dealing with people. we don't have a superstar scout in håkan andersson etc