Was there a ground swell of that thought as he entered the league (as in his potential not actually being the greatest) and then after 4 cups it became unanimous or did it take longer?
How Long Did It Take Gretzky to be Regarded as the GOAT?
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Megustaelhockey
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October 15, 1989. When he passed Howe in points.
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No one said GOAT until the late 90s/early 2000s
Fatass
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99 was putting up ridiculous numbers. For hockey pools he was divided into two separate players: one was his goals and the other was his assist. He was the GOAT very quickly.
Video Nasty
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He was the best in history within his first three seasons, considered the greatest by most after winning the Cup in 1984, and got most of the last holdouts on board after winning it again and picking up the Conn Smythe in 1985.
So he was the greatest after just five seasons—six seasons tops.
As @MrLunatik already said, the term GOAT specifically and the tunnel vision it allowed these discussions to devolve into didn’t really begin for all players in all sports until much later.
So he was the greatest after just five seasons—six seasons tops.
As @MrLunatik already said, the term GOAT specifically and the tunnel vision it allowed these discussions to devolve into didn’t really begin for all players in all sports until much later.
jigglysquishy
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There were grumblings in 1981-82, but there was a lot of doubt, especially after the 1983 Cup run where he was pretty ineffective in the finals against the Islanders. He played a non traditional style in an era where coaches and the media wanted everyone to be Potvin or Messier. But his crazy regular season totals got him lots of attention. By 1984 he was put in the conversation.
Even after the first Cup win, where Messier cleanly outplayed him in the finals, there was some doubters. But 1985 solidified it. It was just too much. Year after year of monster point totals, big playoff runs, and Hart Trophies.
Some time in the March 1983 through May 1985 timeline. People forget. But in two years he went from "can't win with him" reputation, to a two time Cup winner and Canada Cup winner.
Even after the first Cup win, where Messier cleanly outplayed him in the finals, there was some doubters. But 1985 solidified it. It was just too much. Year after year of monster point totals, big playoff runs, and Hart Trophies.
Some time in the March 1983 through May 1985 timeline. People forget. But in two years he went from "can't win with him" reputation, to a two time Cup winner and Canada Cup winner.
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CascadiaPuck
Proud Canucks investor.
Duffy13
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This is how I remember it too, by about 85 the only holdouts were hardcore Orr fans, and hardcore Habs fans. But even they came around a year or two later.
John Mandalorian
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Almost immediately. The points he was putting up were astronomical from the jump.
Thanks for the easy question. I’ll take Potent Potables for $200, Alex.
Thanks for the easy question. I’ll take Potent Potables for $200, Alex.
Duffy13
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The weird thing was it didn't even look like he was trying, after the 2nd Cup, he was just playing and having fun racking up points. He was a freak.
Megustaelhockey
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WarriorofTime
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This whole GOAT obsession is really a 90s era birth.
Staniowski
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There were many hockey people who thought he was the best hockey player ever fairly early in his career. Of course it grew larger over his career.
And, on the other end, there are still many who think he's not the greatest ever, most commonly with Lemieux and/or Orr ahead.
And, on the other end, there are still many who think he's not the greatest ever, most commonly with Lemieux and/or Orr ahead.
AlwaysSunnyInTampa
Oh no! We suck again!!
I can't imagine that it took long. He had 92 goals and a 200 point season by his 3rd year and the nickname "The Great One" from the time he was a child. I'm sure the only holdouts left by the end of his 4th year were the "hE HaZnT wUn An CuP!" edgelords who refused to distinguish the fact his team lost to a dynasty.
My man probably wins 7 or 8 titles like a 1960's Celtic if he's not traded to Los Angeles
My man probably wins 7 or 8 titles like a 1960's Celtic if he's not traded to Los Angeles
jigglysquishy
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It wasn't just that they lost. They got swept and it wasn't close.
After being a 200+ point player and demolishing weak teams in the playoffs, Gretzky only had 4 assists and 0 goals in the sweep.
It's also the 1981 Canada Cup. The States held him to 1 assist in the semi final and he was pointless in the finals against the Soviets.
There was definitely a reputation that he couldn't get it done when it mattered. That when games got tight, defense was elite, he disappeared.
Obviously that went away. But after getting swept in 1983 it was a decently popular opinion.
Golden_Jet
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AlwaysSunnyInTampa
Oh no! We suck again!!
I mean I can understand why. But I have to imagine in a world where it took Bobby Orr 4 years to win his first of what should have been 4 to 6 titles (if you ask Phil Esposito that is) most fans would have at conceded to being at the same level and it was just a question of how many titles Wayne would win eventually
The only place I wouldn't expect an ounce of sympathy until Gretzky won multiple titles is maybe Montreal
GeeoffBrown
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I have to imagine putting up a 200 point season had people talking about it LOL
bland
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It was before that, most fans recognized that Howe's statistical achievements were enhanced by the length of his career. Gretzky was talked up as the greatest ever a few years before he broke the record.
Goose
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Fun fact: the term GOAT wasn’t popularized until the 2000 song by LL Cool J.
It was first coined by Ali’s wife who created a company called G.O.A.T. In the early 90s to handle Ali’s IP.
It was first coined by Ali’s wife who created a company called G.O.A.T. In the early 90s to handle Ali’s IP.
Montreal made a trade in 76 for 1980 first round draft pick. 1980 would have been his draft year if rules didn't change in 78. Habs drafted first that year with a pick from the rockies
TheGreenTBer
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I have never identified more strongly with a username as I do with yours
