How do you improve the Wings?

[OgeeOgelthorpe]

We've had a few days to soak in missing the playoffs, and reflect. We threw around blame, picked the spacegoats, and now it's time to move on.

What would YOU do to fix this roster and get it into the postseason next year? What are reasonable changes you make?

Click to read more...

 

[Michael Brand Eggs]

I don't really feel like next year is the year. This year gave them more cap space to play with, so they were able to get more depth. But with those Seider and Raymond contracts kicking in, they'll be much more limited in the roster they can ice.

The year after, that's what I'm looking at. You'll have Kasper, Danielson, Cossa, any number of prospect defensemen, etc. All those ELCs hopefully playing meaningful roles will create a bit of cap space to add some depth.

 

[norrisnick]

Step before 1 - Ray and Mo 8yrs x Whatever plus the 'A'

Step 1 is landing a RD of sufficient quality to stabilize our top 4. Pesce, Matt Roy. Someone like that. Below Roy and it's not worth the effort as those guys are just different flavors of what we have.

Step 2 is let Cossa be our 3G. Roll with Husso/Lyon and if one gets injured, call up the kid. Serves double duty of giving him experience. If he runs with it, he runs with it, great. If he plays 10 games, great. If he plays 20 games, great. If he steals the job and becomes the Wings' starter, great.

Step 3 is stop being terrified of kids. If Perron absolutely needs to be back, 1-2yrs super cheap in the bottom 6. Under no circumstances is he to play in the top 6, barring an injury replacement (in game only). If there is a need for a top 6 forward before a game, call up a kid. MF can't skate, so don't f*** with it anymore. Burgers and AlJo will be in the NHL next season. May as well let it be our team. See what Burgers can do in Kane's spot. They have the exact same deficiencies. Give AlJo Maatta's spot.

Step 4 is to find buyers for Maatta shouldn't be that hard. Holl, gonna be tricky so package a pick.

Veleno 1-2yrs cheap
Fisch 1-2yrs cheap
Burgers 2yrs cheap

Ghost, Kane, Sprong, Reimer, GTFO

DBC - Larks - Ray
XXXX - JT - Burgers
Ras - Copp - Fisch/Kasper
Perron - Joey V - Kasper/Fisch
Fabs

Walman - Mo
Ed - XXXX
Chiarot - AlJo
Petry

Husso/Lyon

There is roughly $10M to split between the two XXXX players. Unless we retain or buyout, which should be avoided at all costs.

 

[OgeeOgelthorpe]

I don't really feel like next year is the year. This year gave them more cap space to play with, so they were able to get more depth. But with those Seider and Raymond contracts kicking in, they'll be much more limited in the roster they can ice.

The year after, that's what I'm looking at. You'll have Kasper, Danielson, Cossa, any number of prospect defensemen, etc. All those ELCs hopefully playing meaningful roles will create a bit of cap space to add some depth.

We didn't think this year was the year, until we finished February in a wildcard position.

I think this team can compete for a playoff spot next season. Probably in the wildcard again, but that's better than being on the outside looking in like this year.

Also, you don't just turn it on and off. "nah, I don't think we can make the playoffs next year. But the year after that? We're a lock!" You have to build towards it every year. And every year since Yzerman arrived Detroit has incrementally improved.

So how do you continue on that path? How do you go from a 91 point team to a 99 point team?

 

[minimal]

An honest to god 2C, a proper 1A goalie, and a solid partner for Ed.

 

[DoMakc]

Step before 1 - Ray and Mo 8yrs x Whatever plus the 'A'

Step 1 is landing a RD of sufficient quality to stabilize our top 4. Pesce, Matt Roy. Someone like that. Below Roy and it's not worth the effort as those guys are just different flavors of what we have.

Step 2 is let Cossa be our 3G. Roll with Husso/Lyon and if one gets injured, call up the kid. Serves double duty of giving him experience. If he runs with it, he runs with it, great. If he plays 10 games, great. If he plays 20 games, great. If he steals the job and becomes the Wings' starter, great.

Step 3 is stop being terrified of kids. If Perron absolutely needs to be back, 1-2yrs super cheap in the bottom 6. Under no circumstances is he to play in the top 6, barring an injury replacement (in game only). If there is a need for a top 6 forward before a game, call up a kid. MF can't skate, so don't f*** with it anymore. Burgers and AlJo will be in the NHL next season. May as well let it be our team. See what Burgers can do in Kane's spot. They have the exact same deficiencies. Give AlJo Maatta's spot.

Step 4 is to find buyers for Maatta shouldn't be that hard. Holl, gonna be tricky so package a pick.

Veleno 1-2yrs cheap
Fisch 1-2yrs cheap
Burgers 2yrs cheap

Ghost, Kane, Sprong, Reimer, GTFO

DBC - Larks - Ray
XXXX - JT - Burgers
Ras - Copp - Fisch/Kasper
Perron - Joey V - Kasper/Fisch
Fabs

Walman - Mo
Ed - XXXX
Chiarot - AlJo
Petry

Husso/Lyon

There is roughly $10M to split between the two XXXX players. Unless we retain or buyout, which should be avoided at all costs.

I think Fabbri needs to go, he's bad defensively, he is not great at 5-on-5 offense, he is not good enough to play on the top lines. There is no reason to pay him 4 mil to play on 4th line

 

[norrisnick]

I think Fabbri needs to go, he's bad defensively, he is not great at 5-on-5 offense, he is not good enough to play on the top lines. There is no reason to pay him 4 mil to play on 4th line

That works too, tbh.

 

[DamonDRW]

1. Pray for Cossa or Augustine to become truly no. 1;
2. Pray for SteveY to fool one of the GMs trading us a 1st line center;
3. Wait till D is fully developed.

We are 2-3 years away from making the playoffs if we'll ever be there with this roster.

 

[PelagicJoe]

Part of fixing the Wings, long term anyway, means getting better scouts. No, I don't know who we would recruit.

As far as the team goes, the defense sucks as usual. We need a RD that doesn't suck. Pesce comes to mind.
We could use another top 6 winger. I'd be cool with Stevie throwing the bank vault at Sam Rinehart. Pipe dream, I know, but we need a player who can rack up points.

 

[ricky0034]

I get why people want Ghost gone and he certainly has his flaws but if the Wings just replace him with a defensive guy like a lot of people seem to want the Wings will have one of the worst offensive bluelines in the league

i'm not sure what the answer is necessarily, i'm not sure if there even is a particularly good one on the free agent market, maybe Montour

but if Ghost is gone and they do replace him with someone with no offense, Kane is gone, plus general shooting percentage regression? I think this team is bottom 10 in the league in goals next year

fortunately Yzerman does seem to understand this, there's a reason he brought in Ghost after the Wings traded Hronek and also drafted ASP with the pick from the Hronek trade

 

[OgeeOgelthorpe]

Next year I'd personally like to see some big changes to the lower pair D, depth forwards and possibly even a big change in the top 6.

Gone from the roster:
Fabbri - traded
Petry - LTIRetire (PLEASE make this happen)
Holl - traded
Maatta - traded
Copp - traded
Veleno - traded (depending on how Kasper looks in the postseason in Grand Rapids)
Kane - let him walk.
Sprong - let him walk unless we miss out on Guentzel

Free Agents
Go after Guentzel hard. He's worth it. If the Wings can't get him, then keep Sprong.
Bring back Perron at a discount. He isn't as good as Kane but he was more clutch.
Pursue Anthony Stolarz for backup G. Run Husso, Lyon, Stolarz

If you only get 1 of the free agents...
Copp + 15th overall pick to St. Louis for Rob Thomas (If St. Louis decides to go full rebuild)
Or pair Copp + the 15th overall in a trade for a premier RD if the Wings can't get Pesce or Montour as a free agent. Calgary looks like a good trade partner this offseason.

Fabbri and Maatta won't get much back in trades but they have some value as depth to teams that are lacking in those areas. Holl can be given away for a bag of pucks.

Screw bridge contracts. Re-sign Mo and Ray for 8 years each. Lock them in and make them part of the team's core moving forward.

(Just using Rasmus Andersson as a placeholder on 2nd pair RD, but would love to get him from Calgary.)

 

[DanielMarois]

The main issue with the team is that the timeline is off, you have a #1 C in his prime but you're also rebuilding at the same time and also acquiring a lot of vets. And the free agent signings mostly sucking isn't helping. So you are not accumulating top level prospects and also not being that good. What I personally would have done is trade Larkin for a big haul 1-2 years ago (and have the additional effect of the team being worse and having better picks) and done a more true rebuild . Now, you just have to hope that the prospects can make an impact as quickly as possible since Larkin is edging towards 30.

 

[OgeeOgelthorpe]

The main issue with the team is that the timeline is off, you have a #1 C in his prime but you're also rebuilding at the same time and also acquiring a lot of vets. And the free agent signings mostly sucking isn't helping. So you are not accumulating top level prospects and also not being that good. What I personally would have done is trade Larkin for a big haul 1-2 years ago (and have the additional effect of the team being worse and having better picks) and done a more true rebuild . Now, you just have to hope that the prospects can make an impact as quickly as possible since Larkin is edging towards 30.

Then Detroit should have done that in 2022. Doing so now when the 2024 draft sucks, and the 2025 draft not looking like anything spectacular would put us in the exact situation we're in now a few years from now.

The core now is good enough to build a solid, all-around contender from with a bit of luck.

 

[saska sault]

Going with the unpopular answer... time. Yzerman mentioned Berg and Johansson have no waiver options left so that's 2 youthful cheap guys coming up. There will be a few moves with the UFAs.. expect 1 or 2 back and the rest moved on from. A few free agent signings and see what happens.

I do agree with others in the sense we may be in a similar spot next year but I do think this year was a very hard, but needed lesson. The magic recipe isn't drafting and handing over the keys and hoping things work out. I would have alot more confidence next year they will be more prepared to not allow a lead in the standings like that slip.

Who knows who has a good and a bad summer, Raymond set himself up to really progress in the off season.. who else has that mentality and who slacks and rests?

Also... Yzerman could be feeding us BS and makes a big move. Really a guessing game but I do think he makes another Debrincat type move.. maybe a smaller addition , maybe a bigger one.

 

[DanielMarois]

Then Detroit should have done that in 2022. Doing so now when the 2024 draft sucks, and the 2025 draft not looking like anything spectacular would put us in the exact situation we're in now a few years from now.

The core now is good enough to build a solid, all-around contender from with a bit of luck.

For sure, that's why I said 1-2 years ago, now you have to go with what you have and add to it and hope you get some goaltending from somewhere.

 

[minimal]

What I personally would have done is trade Larkin for a big haul 1-2 years ago (and have the additional effect of the team being worse and having better picks) and done a more true rebuild .

I think you seriously underestimate how bad that would have been for the org and the players like Seider and Raymond. And what the hell do you mean by "a more true rebuild"? Be a bottom five team until you win the lottery? Really think about the repercussions here.

 

[jkutswings]

Use every option available.

Let Reimer, Ghost, and Sprong walk. Buyout Holl. Kane, Fischer, and Perron depend on the price. LTIR Husso if you can.

I don't see Reinhart even hitting the market, so the only guys in free agency that I think Detroit might both be interested in and have a shot at (other than if they wanna keep Kane) are Montour and Pesce. I'd pursue both.

I'd be very aggressive in the trade market, starting with St Louis and Calgary. I'd be willing to pay almost anything to pry Robert Thomas from the Blues, but I'd start with 2 firsts+Berggren+Wallinder and see where it goes from there. I'd also present a trade for Rasmussen Anderson, but I don't know his value enough to suggest a starting point here.

I'd also scour the league to see what goaltending might be available via trade, whether somebody could be pried from Boston or somebody like a Varlamov in New York. Lyon could still be a backup or even a 1B, but they need a good veteran to give Cossa at least one more year in Grand Rapids.

Assuming that Kasper and Mazur were not both required in the above trade proposals, I'd want to get whomever was most ready at least some NHL games this year. The added grit is a needed element. I'd also want to get Johansson at least a cup of coffee.

I'd also fire Lalonde, but I'm not holding my breath on that one. With even basic use of timeouts and other in-game adjustments, this past season would have ended with another few points, putting them in the playoffs.

That's a start. Ultimately I think they need to start to exit the "hoard picks" phase and start to be willing to deal assets for the specific holes they still have, especially any players with enough talent to moonlight on the top forward line or defensive pairing, because their draft stock going forward won't likely yield that level of guys.

 

[OgeeOgelthorpe]

For sure, that's why I said 1-2 years ago, now you have to go with what you have and add to it and hope you get some goaltending from somewhere.

This could be a playoff team next year. But in 3-5 years this is a team that could become like the 2000s Devils, 2010s Boston Bruins or St. Louis Blues. Lots of depth and offense by committee but not many bigtime gamebreakers on offense. I'm OK with that if it's built sustainably. The team needs to get much, much better defensively though. Goaltending was one of the major problems but the team defense didn't do them any favors. A full season of Ed, and getting faster overall will help this team on defense and in transition.

 

[DanielMarois]

I think you seriously underestimate how bad that would have been for the org and the players like Seider and Raymond. And what the hell do you mean by "a more true rebuild"? Be a bottom five team until you win the lottery? Really think about the repercussions here.

What I meant is if there was an opportunity to get young high-level prospects for Larkin , that's what I would have done, not just hope to win the lottery.Then you can have a more aligned timeline rather than having a #1 C in his prime and rebuilding concurrently.

 

[norrisnick]

I get why people want Ghost gone and he certainly has his flaws but if the Wings just replace him with a defensive guy like a lot of people seem to want the Wings will have one of the worst offensive bluelines in the league

i'm not sure what the answer is necessarily, i'm not sure if there even is a particularly good one on the free agent market, maybe Montour

but if Ghost is gone and they do replace him with someone with no offense, Kane is gone, plus general shooting percentage regression? I think this team is bottom 10 in the league in goals next year

fortunately Yzerman does seem to understand this, there's a reason he brought in Ghost after the Wings traded Hronek and also drafted ASP with the pick from the Hronek trade

Ed has plenty of offensive ability.

 

[OgeeOgelthorpe]

I get why people want Ghost gone and he certainly has his flaws but if the Wings just replace him with a defensive guy like a lot of people seem to want the Wings will have one of the worst offensive bluelines in the league

i'm not sure what the answer is necessarily, i'm not sure if there even is a particularly good one on the free agent market, maybe Montour

but if Ghost is gone and they do replace him with someone with no offense, Kane is gone, plus general shooting percentage regression? I think this team is bottom 10 in the league in goals next year

fortunately Yzerman does seem to understand this, there's a reason he brought in Ghost after the Wings traded Hronek and also drafted ASP with the pick from the Hronek trade

I'm fine with keeping Ghost but there are other options on the market I prefer on RD. If the Wings can dump Holl, Maatta, Fabbri I'm fine bringing Ghost back as the 3rd pair RD as an offensive specialist and use the money from the cap dumps on Pesce and an upgrade in the top 6. Monahan and Lindholm would be pretty nice additions to this current group. They would be legit 2Cs.

Other options would be working a trade for either Rasmus Andersson or Colton Parayko. Rasmus Andersson would replace Ghost's offense while providing better defense. Parayko would allow Seider to rest up some shifts and be used in mismatches, and probably puts Mo back on PP1.

 

[Gniwder]

Ed has plenty of offensive ability.

Yeah, just have Mo play PP1 and Ed PP2. Ghost is not needed. His defense is cringeworthy.

 

[Barry Amsterdam]

1-play berggren, should be a top 6 guy. Over point per game in the A. gets about .5 ppg 3rd/4th line when up and no pp time. He’s produced every time he’s been up. Wasted asset

2-Too many middling 3rd 4th liners to too high of contracts. Shed some of Fabbri,sprong,copp,Perron

3-Defense needs to get younger, Aljo, Ed, Wallinder would be just as good probably better than mattaa , Petry, and Holl. 3 ELCs vs what about 8-9 mill? saves 7-8m with no downside.

4- Goalie problem. Get rid of Husso. If he’s not going to be better than a replacement goalie. And we have no other option just go Lyon starting with Cossa as the backup. Dump him to philly or something for the capspace.

5-Give kasper and danielson the nod.

1*Kasper-Larkin-Raymond
Berggren Compher *2 X
Rasmussen Danielson Perron
Fischer Copp Veleno

Edvinsson Seider
Walman Pesce
Chiarot Aljo
Wallinder

Lyon
Cossa

1* Kasper hasn’t earned it but sometimes the best scenario is to thrust him into a great opportunity so he can learn from Larkin and Raymond. Similar to Rays first year.

2* Kane or stamkos or some other top 6 winger in FA.

 

[Twinger]

The main issue with the team is that the timeline is off, you have a #1 C in his prime but you're also rebuilding at the same time and also acquiring a lot of vets. And the free agent signings mostly sucking isn't helping. So you are not accumulating top level prospects and also not being that good. What I personally would have done is trade Larkin for a big haul 1-2 years ago (and have the additional effect of the team being worse and having better picks) and done a more true rebuild . Now, you just have to hope that the prospects can make an impact as quickly as possible since Larkin is edging towards 30.

Ya our time line is messed up. The signings we made didn't line up with the team we had.

The core now is good enough to build a solid, all-around contender from with a bit of luck.

Ehhhh I wouldn't say this core is good enough. It has the potential to be but looking at the teams now that are contenders we don't have anything like that. Maybe with a coaching/system change we would look better but defence and overall team defence is going to keep us back

 

[OgeeOgelthorpe]

Ya our time line is messed up. The signings we made didn't line up with the team we had.

Ehhhh I wouldn't say this core is good enough. It has the potential to be but looking at the teams now that are contenders we don't have anything like that. Maybe with a coaching/system change we would look better but defence and overall team defence is going to keep us back

Larkin, Raymond, Seider, Edvinsson. 1C, 1W, 1D and 2D. That's the top of your lineup that you build around. And if Lalonde is smart he won't let DeBrincat leave the bench without Larkin.

Cossa is trending very strongly. Kasper is looking to be at worst a very good 3C. Danielson is looking like he's got 2C or better potential.

The potential of the core is tremendous. And like I said, scoring by committee. With strong depth you're going to win more than you lose. It's the fringes of this lineup and goaltending that need real work.