How are these pads allowed?

[Stonewall]

The top third of these leg pads are definitely for protection.

 

[biturbo19]

The thigh rises?

Same reason those shoulder pads are allowed, and the "cheater" on the glove, or really even the huge blocking surface of the blocker really. None of that is strictly for "protection", but good luck ever winning over the NHLPA on massively shrinking goaltending equipment.

I mean, it's all "technically" restricted and bound within certain constraints. But they're quite clearly in excess of "purely for protection" ends. They're integral parts of playing the modern butterfly goaltending style.

Hardly a well-kept secret that oversized goaltending equipment is a major culprit in reduced scoring.

 

[Sarcastic]

They fit within NHL regulations.

 

[aufheben]

I'm 90% sure Hank's stats have actually gotten better after recent size reductions, but ok.

The thigh rises?

Same reason those shoulder pads are allowed, and the "cheater" on the glove, or really even the huge blocking surface of the blocker really. None of that is strictly for "protection", but good luck ever winning over the NHLPA on massively shrinking goaltending equipment.

I mean, it's all "technically" restricted and bound within certain constraints. But they're quite clearly in excess of "purely for protection" ends. They're integral parts of playing the modern butterfly goaltending style. Idk, I think goalie equipment is just an easy target for more complex issues with scoring, although I think the league is fine anyway, but...

Hardly a well-kept secret that oversized goaltending equipment is a major culprit in reduced scoring.

This is nothing but my own opinion, but I would not be surprised to see that turn out to be completely untrue.

Penalties and coaching systems would have a much larger impact IMO. I mean, the last time they shortened goalie pads was a couple years ago, no? Scoring has stayed exactly the same.

 

[ForumNamePending]

The goalie lobby certainly is strong.

 

[systemsgo]

Isn't that an old photo?

edit: Or maybe not? I don't pay that much attention.

 

[Stonewall]

Isn't that an old photo?

edit: Or maybe not? I don't pay that much attention.

Image URL

http:// 2.cdn.nhle .com/rangers/images/upload/gallery/2015/01/460997612_slide.jpg

 

[Machinehead]

Equipment gets reduced. Lundqvist's stats get better. K.

 

[Stonewall]

I'm 90% sure Hank's stats have actually gotten better after recent size reductions, but ok.


This is nothing but my own opinion, but I would not be surprised to see that turn out to be completely untrue.

Penalties and coaching systems would have a much larger impact IMO. I mean, the last time they shortened goalie pads was a couple years ago, no? Scoring has stayed exactly the same.

I disagree with you. If every goalie let in just 1 more goal every game, scoring would be back to 80's levels. Even with defensive coaching systems, goalies are still the last - and most important - line of defense.

In any case, oversized padding has made goaltending a lot less exciting, since it makes butterfly the only style worth using.

 

[Machinehead]

This is an MLL goalie

This is an NLL goalie

The nets, believe it or not, are the same size.

The difference in scoring between the two leagues is about 3 goals per game which in lacrosse is bumble**** nothing.

 

[aufheben]

The game is completely different. 1985 was 30 years ago. Did they even have curved stick blades in 1955?

I can totally picture HF in the 80's: "What can the NHL do to tone down the scoring?"; "These goalies today can't stop anything!".

If reducing equipment will increase scoring, why hasn't that happened? They've been doing it, and absolutely nothing has changed, nor does it need to, IMO.

 

[Stonewall]

This is an MLL goalie

This is an NLL goalie

The nets, believe it or not, are the same size.

The difference in scoring between the two leagues is about 3 goals per game which in lacrosse is bumble**** nothing.

The field sizes are vastly different in these two leagues.

 

[aufheben]

Goals per game and Powerplay opportunities...

 

[BondraTime]

This is an MLL goalie

This is an NLL goalie

The nets, believe it or not, are the same size.

The difference in scoring between the two leagues is about 3 goals per game which in lacrosse is bumble**** nothing.

Those nets are not the same size unless the guy on top is 5'2

 

[Frank Garrett]

Are there any regulations on custom skates? Someone needs to design a custom goalie skate that has multiple blades and or a ****load of ankle support and slap a sumo wrestler in net. Good luck scoring on that ****.

 

[Crede777]

It's not like Lundqvist is the only goalie with access to pads like that.

 

[BondraTime]

Are there any regulations on custom skates? Someone needs to design a custom goalie skate that has multiple blades and or a ****load of ankle support and slap a sumo wrestler in net. Good luck scoring on that ****.

So you've finally been outed, Mr. Wang

 

[biturbo19]

Are there any regulations on custom skates? Someone needs to design a custom goalie skate that has multiple blades and or a ****load of ankle support and slap a sumo wrestler in net. Good luck scoring on that ****.

Overdrive blades are illegal, so yes...there are strict regulations on "custom skates".


Overdrive blades being, angled blades fixed to the side of goaltender skate housings to provide easier butterfly mobility control via side-mounted blades on the skates.

 

[Siamese Dream]

The top third of these leg pads are definitely for protection.

Yes, they are.

When a goalie is down on his knees, without that top third, the puck would hit them, and it would hurt, a lot.

I love it when people who have never played in goal think they can decide what is and isn't for protection.

 

[Siamese Dream]

the "cheater" on the glove, or really even the huge blocking surface of the blocker really.

You mean the cheater that is now illegal and no longer on modern gloves?

You mean the "huge" blocking surface of the blocker that is the same size as or even smaller than the ones from the 80s?

 

[Siamese Dream]

Oh, and I'll get this one out of the way and save someone the trouble, because it'll inevitably come up and it wouldn't be an anti-goalie equipment thread without it

Illegal chest protector.

 

[biturbo19]

I'm 90% sure Hank's stats have actually gotten better after recent size reductions, but ok.


This is nothing but my own opinion, but I would not be surprised to see that turn out to be completely untrue.

Penalties and coaching systems would have a much larger impact IMO. I mean, the last time they shortened goalie pads was a couple years ago, no? Scoring has stayed exactly the same.

The thing about this, is that even with "reductions", the massive overages of pad sizes are still allowed. Sizing something down from "ridiculously oversized" to "only a little bit oversized" as has been done...really doesn't change things that massively. Some goaltenders were actually permitted larger pads than they were using before in the change of sizing rules.

"Thigh Rise" wasn't a "protection issue" until the modern pro-fly goaltending style became a mainstay of the NHL. Even with the pioneer champion of the modern butterfly style Patrick Roy...the thigh rise was...a reasonable and justifiable amount for "protection" and was functionally very different as to how the pads operated. Something that is ignored in this whole thing a lot, is pad rotation...which has become a major point of technique in the modern era. And further contributed to the idea of basically..."A Wall of Pads" that takes away the entire lower section of the net, 11" high from side to side.




At the end of the day...you've got goaltenders under the rules, with a pair of goal pads that total the entire width of a regulation NHL net @ 6ft, designed to rotate flat on the ice independent of leg rotation, @ 11" of height.

You've got goaltenders who, even if they weren't to play the position at all, and were to just hang out on the goal line stretching their pads from post to post...would essentially take away some ~12% of the entire scoring area of the net...without even having a goaltender attached to those leg pads. And it's not as though the other equipment attached to a goaltender is small, or reasonably sized.

That is absolutely a plague on goal-scoring ability. You start at a basis of 12% of the net gone, the further you telescope that out, the higher the percentage becomes just from those two leg pads alone. Relative to a shooter...there's a point at which just the two leg pads alone constitute a 100% save percentage based on trigonometry and whatnot. And that's a HUGE component in decreased scoring in the NHL...without a shadow of a doubt.

 

[biturbo19]

You mean the cheater that is now illegal and no longer on modern gloves?

You mean the "huge" blocking surface of the blocker that is the same size as or even smaller than the ones from the 80s?

Yeah, modern gloves have no "cheater" at all.


Come on. It was limited to a particular size...not eliminate altogether.

 

[Siamese Dream]

Yeah, modern gloves have no "cheater" at all.


Come on. It was limited to a particular size...not eliminate altogether.

These are no longer on modern goalie gloves. At all. Educate yourself.

 

[biturbo19]

This is THE "Butterfly Goalie" Messiah here. And you cannot even remotely equate those pads to what a guy like Lundqvist wears today. It's just a wildly different style of pads, if not just massively taller.


Current goaltending pads are designed in a completely different fashion than these plenty "protective" units of the past. Those Roy type pads are what i grew up with, and i'm acutely aware of how they differ from "contemporary" pad designs. I'm very acutely aware of where goaltending leg pads for example, diverged from "protective equipment" to "butterfly conducive equipment".


You obviously have to find the right balance...but as it stands now, the balance clearly favours "size" goaltending. Big body goaltenders with bigger pads to block more net area. The bigger the pads, the better. And that to me, is both a plague on the integrity of the goaltending position...and a real tangible contributor to the lowered scoring of the "modern era" of hockey.

You can inflate/deflate scoring all you want with PP opportunities...but ultimately, it's a roundabout way of trying to defeat oversized goaltending equipment by generating East-West Movement and unpredictable tip-ins from that, which can beat the percentages covered at the bottom of the net by the pads alone.