How aggressive should the Leafs be at the deadline? Whimper or All In?

[Racer88]

My sister had a 5 litre Gremlin and she would regularly make guys eat her fumes at lights.

Suck a quirky car (the gremlin) but way cool. When I was in High School one of the guys had a V8 “Gremlin X “

 

[Nineteen67]

With cap moving up we should be making some moves to free up cap space to have a better team the next few years. I been thinking that going all in should be the play this year but adding someone like Schenn or whoever still doesn’t get us to win. Maybe the play should be preparing to retool the team with significant adds via free agency.

I’d look at letting Marner sign elsewhere. And look at signing JT, Possibly looking at Ehlers, Nelson, Boeser, Chychrun.

If they’re not at least competitive in the 2nd round, and the core gets pushed out again, then you get rid of at least two of the three and start over and build a proper roster.

 

[Suntouchable13]

With cap moving up we should be making some moves to free up cap space to have a better team the next few years. I been thinking that going all in should be the play this year but adding someone like Schenn or whoever still doesn’t get us to win. Maybe the play should be preparing to retool the team with significant adds via free agency.

I’d look at letting Marner sign elsewhere. And look at signing JT, Possibly looking at Ehlers, Nelson, Boeser, Chychrun.

I think the window is the next couple of years. For example, Toews and Kane didn't win anything after about age 28. How old are our guys? Exactly. You're not winning anything with huge contracts to aging players.

 

[Evilhomer]

I think the window is the next couple of years. For example, Toews and Kane didn't win anything after about age 28. How old are our guys? Exactly. You're not winning anything with huge contracts to aging players.

I think it's probably maximum a three year window, because at that point almost the entire defense will need to be overhauled.

 

[darrylsittler27]

As I see it they have to go for it. All our players are now post prime and if they lose first round everyone is fired.

 

[NVious]

I think the window is the next couple of years. For example, Toews and Kane didn't win anything after about age 28. How old are our guys? Exactly. You're not winning anything with huge contracts to aging players.

Pretty much, even looking at 4NT, we have 3 legit 1st line guys on 3 top teams in the world (Russia obviously would be in the mix, but point still stands). If Knies reaches even Nylander tier at his best, that would be amazing (forget Matthews/Marner), never mind our other prospects who's chances are way lower of even sniffing those players.

For better or for worse this is the core and the time is now.

 

[TMLBlueandWhite]

If they don't go all in Shanahan and Treliving should be fired the minute trade deadline passes.

We've been told for years that this team was a contender. That they're doing everything they can to win the cup. That they're going to get this done.

Not going all in would confirm what fans have been saying for years.

That winning the cup isn't their goal at all. That just making the playoffs is. That good enough is good enough for the greatest fan base in the world.

Their incompetence has given me more entertainment over the years than if they had won it all.

Pretty much everything they've done since drafting Nylander, Marner, and Matthews has been dumb. They simply don't know how to build a winning hockey team. Not going all in on a year with one of their best chances to win it all would just be another example of their incompetence.

Go big or go home.

 

[NMacrules]

There is a rumour floating around (got it in the news segment of my phone) and Scot Laughton will be coming to the leafs for Fraser Minten and a 1st round pick next year. If that happens I will not watch the Leafs again and will stick to Colorado. We already have players the same as Laughton who has abysmal numbers this year.

I want Risto, or Rantenen, Brock Nelson, back up the money truck and throw it at Ehlers. If we get 2 of those 4 I will be very happy. Tre has to decide if he wants to win this year or not. Tre has never won anything as a GM and one could argue he set the Flames back 4 years.

He can't have the mindset that "maybe next year". Our core are in their prime and last chance for Marner as he might walk. And I wouldn't blame him if he did. Fans treated him like crap for the entire summer calling for his head. But those fans should shut their pie hole because Marner is our playoff leader in points.

I'm 61 and I don't have many more years to get excited about a cup. And my allegiance is split between Colorado and the Leafs though I tend to post more on the Leafs board.

Tre is an idiot until he proves otherwise.

 

[hullsy47]

Scott Laughton. It appears to be the most logical. Only $3M and has a year left.

He aint worth minten and a number 1

 

[NMacrules]

For me another C is a must and Schenn would be an excellent addition. I’d have Matthews, Nylander and Marner on seperate lines though.

Perhaps a 3rd line LW as well.

Knies Matthews Domi
McMann Tavares Marner/Nylander
New guy Schenn Marner/Nylander

Marner has shown he can play with anyone so Nylander gets whoever suits him best, probably Schenn.

Brock Nelson would be better and cheaper.

If the cost is close I would be looking at Brock Nelson rather than Schenn. He is not as far removed from his productive seasons and Schenn's remaining term isn't a positive if he isn't significantly better than this year. Paying extra to add a player with term vs adding a 33 year with term is inviting two different outcomes.

completely agree. I made a long post about Nelson. He is a better fit and would allow us to bump Tavares to 3rd line center which is where he currently belongs.

 

[TMLBlueandWhite]

There is a rumour floating around (got it in the news segment of my phone) and Scot Laughton will be coming to the leafs for Fraser Minten and a 1st round pick next year. If that happens I will not watch the Leafs again and will stick to Colorado. We already have players the same as Laughton who has abysmal numbers this year.

I want Risto, or Rantenen, Brock Nelson, back up the money truck and throw it at Ehlers. If we get 2 of those 4 I will be very happy. Tre has to decide if he wants to win this year or not. Tre has never won anything as a GM and one could argue he set the Flames back 4 years.

He can't have the mindset that "maybe next year". Our core are in their prime and last chance for Marner as he might walk. And I wouldn't blame him if he did. Fans treated him like crap for the entire summer calling for his head. But those fans should shut their pie hole because Marner is our playoff leader in points.

I'm 61 and I don't have many more years to get excited about a cup. And my allegiance is split between Colorado and the Leafs though I tend to post more on the Leafs board.

Tre is an idiot until he proves otherwise.

Laughton isn't going all in.

That would be wasting assets on depth. Same as Dubas did every year. They need to somehow add a bonafide star, preferably 1RHD, who can be the difference maker none of these players are.

That's not Laughton.

 

[NMacrules]

Laughton isn't going all in.

That would be wasting assets on depth. Same as Dubas did every year. They need to somehow add a bonafide star, preferably 1RHD, who can be the difference maker none of these players are.

That's not Laughton.

Risto, Rantenen, Nelson, Ehlers, Pulock, Parayko, Porovov are players I would target. Any 2 of them move the needle enough. 3 of them makes us a serious contender. And we have the assets and cap to do this.

We can afford Ehlers (not much left on his cap this season), also we can afford Nelson. Nelson gives us the ability to more Tavares to 3rd line center which is where he belongs. They are both UFA's and won't cost much. Parayko will cost us Minten and a 1st rounder. And if we can send Holmberg anywhere would be addition by subtraction. Use Domi to reclaim some picks or use him in a package.

We roll with:

Ehlers-Matthews-Marner
Knies-Nelson-Nylander
Patches-Tavares-McMann
Robertson-Lorentz-Kampf
---Jarnkrok---

Rielly-Parayko
McCabe-Tanev
Oel-Benoit
Myers

Stolarz-Woll

You could swap Patches and Knies. But I prefer Knies on the 2nd.

This is a Stanley Cup roster. We are right there. You could also go after Rantanen instead of Ehlers. Risto instead of Parayko. You could also swap Ehlers for Knies. Ehlers, Nelson and Nylander will give other teams fits. All 3 of those players are very gettable.

Its completely do-able this year. The right players are available.

 

[TMLBlueandWhite]

Risto, Rantenen, Nelson, Ehlers, Pulock, Parayko, Porovov are players I would target. Any 2 of them move the needle enough. 3 of them makes us a serious contender. And we have the assets and cap to do this.

We can afford Ehlers (not much left on his cap this season), also we can afford Nelson. Nelson gives us the ability to more Tavares to 3rd line center which is where he belongs. They are both UFA's and won't cost much. Parayko will cost us Minten and a 1st rounder. And if we can send Holmberg anywhere would be addition by subtraction. Use Domi to reclaim some picks or use him in a package.

We roll with:

Ehlers-Matthews-Marner
Knies-Nelson-Nylander
Patches-Tavares-McMann
Robertson-Lorentz-Kampf
---Jarnkrok---

Rielly-Parayko
McCabe-Tanev
Oel-Benoit
Myers

Stolarz-Woll

You could swap Patches and Knies. But I prefer Knies on the 2nd.

This is a Stanley Cup roster. We are right there. You could also go after Rantanen instead of Ehlers. Risto instead of Parayko. You could also swap Ehlers for Knies. Ehlers, Nelson and Nylander will give other teams fits. All 3 of those players are very gettable.

Its completely do-able this year. The right players are available.

Ehlers isn't going anywhere this year so long as Winnipeg remains a top contender.

They'll use him as an own rental for a cup chase. Maybe in the offseason he could be a good target to replace Marner. I like Ehlers too and he'll come in around the same as, or less than, Nylander.

That makes him an adequate replacement and the cap space saved from moving off Marner can be used to reinforce other areas of the roster

 

[thusk]

Not sure if Nelson would be cheaper in term of asset...He would cost at least a 1st and a prospect for a rental and honestly not sure if hes really that much better 52 pts pace this season vs 47 for Schenn...

Tre have to watch every option he have and that's what he's doing.
Le5's see what's happening

 

[Sypher04]

Brock Nelson would be better and cheaper.


completely agree. I made a long post about Nelson. He is a better fit and would allow us to bump Tavares to 3rd line center which is where he currently belongs.

Tavares is a better player than Brock Nelson.

Paying a 2C asking price for a forward that doesn’t improve our existing 2C or make us younger at the position doesn’t really make a lot of sense.

In fact, Nelson, as a rental, is almost completely uninteresting to me.

If we’re going to move significant assets, I want term, or a pending RFA at least. If we aren’t clearly upgrading the 2C role, we’re better off focusing on a high end 3, or at least someone with a great contract.

Just my opinion

 

[ToneDog]

Not sure if Nelson would be cheaper in term of asset...He would cost at least a 1st and a prospect for a rental and honestly not sure if hes really that much better 52 pts pace this season vs 47 for Schenn...

Tre have to watch every option he have and that's what he's doing.
Le5's see what's happening

Schenn > Nelson and can handle Bennett.

 

[ULF_55]

Tavares is a better player than Brock Nelson.

Paying a 2C asking price for a forward that doesn’t improve our existing 2C or make us younger at the position doesn’t really make a lot of sense.

In fact, Nelson, as a rental, is almost completely uninteresting to me.

If we’re going to move significant assets, I want term, or a pending RFA at least. If we aren’t clearly upgrading the 2C role, we’re better off focusing on a high end 3, or at least someone with a great contract.

Just my opinion

I'd pay more for a player who has accomplished less, but has yet to hit his ceiling.

Really, hope they don't chase short term, declining players, but rather look longer term now players with untapped upside.

Wonder if there are some young players who've been on pathetic teams who just need a glimmer of hope to elevate and achieve their ceiling.

 

[nuck]

I'd pay more for a player who has accomplished less, but has yet to hit his ceiling.

Really, hope they don't chase short term, declining players, but rather look longer term now players with untapped upside.

Wonder if there are some young players who've been on pathetic teams who just need a glimmer of hope to elevate and achieve their ceiling.

That gets to players like Hayton, McTavish, and maybe Wright? They have to be cheaper than Cozens but still not cheap. And Fogelhunds favorite Krebs who I think was drafted too high and then done a disservice by putting him in the NHL at least a year too early.

 

[namttebih]

He aint worth minten and a number 1

Absolutely not. I was thinking OR.

 

[nuck]

Schenn > Nelson and can handle Bennett.

Thats hard to say. Nelson is coming off 37, 36, and 34g seasons and Schenn has never hit 30. The big difference is the contract years where, all things being close to equal Schenn could be a boat anchor on a club that already overpays its current forward group. A 45pt Schenn is not a $6M player. and there is a risk thats what he is now.

 

[hullsy47]

Thats hard to say. Nelson is coming off 37, 36, and 34g seasons and Schenn has never hit 30. The big difference is the contract years where, all things being close to equal Schenn could be a boat anchor on a club that already overpays its current forward group. A 45pt Schenn is not a $6M player. and there is a risk thats what he is now.

I ll give u an AMEN

 

[hullsy47]

The deadline is 2 months away and at the time that I write this the team is tied for top spot in the east, they are a point or 2 out of 1st in the NHL and sitting 6 points ahead of 2nd place in the Atlantic.

and they have done a lot of it without Auston Matthews, and now he's back and he's got 7 points in 3 games.

So it has me asking how aggressive should this team be?

I know there will be will be some that say they shouldn't be aggressive because this team has proven it can't get over the hump.

And while those people are entitled to that opinion those people are wrong.

This team has never had a defense this good.

This team has never had goaltending this consistent and I'm not just talking about Woll and Stolarz I'm also talking about Hildeby, his numbers aren't great but he is 3-1 and he was fantastic against Philadelphia.

Now they have an actual coach.

And now they sit tied for top spot in the east.

I think they should be willing to go all in. and not the type of all in they went in 2023 because they didn't go all in in 2023 not really.

Sure they traded their 1st round picks in 2023 and 2025 but they also acquired a 1st round pick in 2023 so to me that's not all in.

When I say all in, I mean ALL IN

I'm talking about the Lakers when they got Anthony Davis and won a title,yes they suck now but they won a title.

I'm talking about the Raptors in Raptors 2019 when they went all in getting Kahwi, Green Ibaka and Gasol.

I'm talking about the 2008 Celtics getting Garnett and Allen.

The 2020 Rams bringing in Stafford.

The 1994 Rangers

the 2002 Red Wings with Hasek, Hull and Robitale.

I'm talking about ALL IN, TRULY ALL IN.

I think you need to have this years 2nd and 3rd available.

You need to have the 2026 1st available, you need to have all your 2027 and 2028 picks available.

Cowan, Minten Danford and Hildeby need to be available.

You need to be willing to go ALL IN.

Now I'm not suggesting trading guys like Cowan, Minten and Danford for rentals if those guys are traded they need to be traded for players with Term, at least Cowan and Minten do, Danford I'm not as high on.

I think this team needs to get aggressive because I think with some additions they can win.

I say stand pat .wait till ted rogrers takes over and 20 millon at mcdavid
Instead of waiting for this core to win
Get the best guy out there and make the beer taste better on sat night

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

I say stand pat .wait till ted rogrers takes over and 20 millon at mcdavid
Instead of waiting for this core to win
Get the best guy out there and make the beer taste better on sat night

Can't afford to stand Pat with Matthews in his prime.

Plus the east is weak this year.

 

[Stephen]

Kinda wish the group think would move off Scott Laughton. I’d say the Leafs addiction to these versatile, toolsy players is kind of a problem resulting in the blandest possible bottom six possible. If you leave Minten alone he’ll probably turn into a Scott Laughton. And Laughton doesn’t push you over the edge on any category.

 

[Stephen]

Can't afford to stand Pat with Matthews in his prime.

Plus the east is weak this year.

Matthews isn’t in his “prime” this season. By that I don’t mean he’s in permanent decline, but he’s not at 100%, he’s not giving you top 15-20 player quality, the production isn’t reliable, and the question of health keeps popping up. So if you added a Brock Nelson to a fully functional Matthews and you’re a cup contender, what happens when you have 75% Matthews and you over spend to support? You’re still short 25% on Matthews.