Proposal: Horvat for Newhook

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

Bo Horvat is from London Ontario, Canada, Just my gut feeling that he goes to either Detroit or Toronto.

 

[IWantSakicAsMyGM]

Bo Horvat is from London Ontario, Canada, Just my gut feeling that he goes to either Detroit or Toronto.

Toronto would need to get extremely creative to make enough cap space for that to work.

But, Detroit in UFA makes a lot of sense. So does Boston.

 

[FOurteenS inCisOr]

I feel like this is a very shortsighted way to approach a return for Horvat. I see this like you are making a top 10 pick at the draft. You have to go best player available and in my opinion Newhook likely is that. Just because you have a middling small guy on your roster now doesn't mean you shouldn't add a potential star just because they're small. You can find size other ways.

If you look at their career totals, Hoglander and Newhook are very similar—to call one “mediocre” and one “a future star” is pretty ridiculous.

 

[John Mandalorian]

I could see the teams getting creative here and trying to have players within their window.

Horvat 50% retained
2024 1st (top 10 protected)
Schenn

Byram
Newhook
EJ (cap purposes)

That would allow the Avalanche to add to Bo for a Cup run this year and the Avs to resign Toews as one of him or Byram will price themselves out anyways. The first would resort to a 2025 1st top 5 protection and if that happens a 2026 no protection. The Avs can use the pick or dangle it for a 2C if they can’t afford Horvat, similar to the trade that brought Byram there in the first place.

The Canucks add to the desired core age stated by management while furthering along development time as the owner does not want a full rebuild. Newhook takes Horvat spot on the roster and Byram is a local young Dman who they have sought after in the right age range. They retain 50% and try to flip EJ right after for a pick or prospect, or he just plays out the season.

FAIL

 

[Raistlin]

I could see the teams getting creative here and trying to have players within their window.

Horvat 50% retained
2024 1st (top 10 protected)
Schenn

Byram
Newhook
EJ (cap purposes)

That would allow the Avalanche to add to Bo for a Cup run this year and the Avs to resign Toews as one of him or Byram will price themselves out anyways. The first would resort to a 2025 1st top 5 protection and if that happens a 2026 no protection. The Avs can use the pick or dangle it for a 2C if they can’t afford Horvat, similar to the trade that brought Byram there in the first place.

The Canucks add to the desired core age stated by management while furthering along development time as the owner does not want a full rebuild. Newhook takes Horvat spot on the roster and Byram is a local young Dman who they have sought after in the right age range. They retain 50% and try to flip EJ right after for a pick or prospect, or he just plays out the season.

No thanks.

If Byram wasn't one concussion away from being Ferland, this will be excellent for Vancouver. As it stands, the return for Byram would never get in the vicinity of a lottery pick until he can string together a full season of health. Extremely foolish to take on this risk.

 

[John Mandalorian]

No thanks.

If Byram wasn't one concussion away from being Ferland, this will be excellent for Vancouver. As it stands, the return for Byram would never get in the vicinity of a lottery pick until he can string together a full season of health. Extremely foolish to take on this risk.

There's a conversation taking place over at the big kids table. Tampa and Colorado fans are sitting there discussing Byram. Trust me, everyone agrees Byram has huge value.

But you were probably playing Fortnite last June.

 

[innitfam]

No thanks.

If Byram wasn't one concussion away from being Ferland, this will be excellent for Vancouver. As it stands, the return for Byram would never get in the vicinity of a lottery pick until he can string together a full season of health. Extremely foolish to take on this risk.

Every player is one concussion away from being in Ferland's situation. Would you declined trading for Crosby in 2012?

Byram is an absolute stud with elite potential, if he's available via trade you roll the dice.

 

[FOurteenS inCisOr]

There's a conversation taking place over at the big kids table. Tampa and Colorado fans are sitting there discussing Byram. Trust me, everyone agrees Byram has huge value.

When you can post without including a needless personal insult, you can sit at the adults’ table.

 

[John Mandalorian]

"Personal"? Yeah ok. Good try.

When you can post without including a needless personal insult, you can sit at the adults’ table.

It's not personal. He might have a nice singing voice.

 

[Raistlin]

Every player is one concussion away from being in Ferland's situation. Would you declined trading for Crosby in 2012?

Byram is an absolute stud with elite potential, if he's available via trade you roll the dice.

Personal insults aside, when the kid checks himself out and tells his family he's worried about his own concussion issues, you better take his words seriously, as do GMs. I bet you not all the GMs in the league value Byram as high as Avs fans does. You could roll the die if he's available, a lottery pick is much too high a price to pay for a kid with serious concussion issues.

 

[AslanRH]

Personal insults aside, when the kid checks himself out and tells his family he's worried about his own concussion issues, you better take his words seriously, as do GMs. I bet you not all the GMs in the league value Byram as high as Avs fans does. You could roll the die if he's available, a lottery pick is much too high a price to pay for a kid with serious concussion issues.

Avs fans made the same argument during the ROR (and even a bit the Duchene) trade dramas about Josi so I won't dismiss your concerns.

 

[John Mandalorian]

Personal insults aside, when the kid checks himself out and tells his family he's worried about his own concussion issues, you better take his words seriously, as do GMs. I bet you not all the GMs in the league value Byram as high as Avs fans does. You could roll the die if he's available, a lottery pick is much too high a price to pay for a kid with serious concussion issues.

There's no guarantee a lottery pick can/will play in the NHL at an elite level in big games. With Byram, you don't have to wonder because he's done it.

 

[IWantSakicAsMyGM]

Personal insults aside, when the kid checks himself out and tells his family he's worried about his own concussion issues, you better take his words seriously, as do GMs. I bet you not all the GMs in the league value Byram as high as Avs fans does. You could roll the die if he's available, a lottery pick is much too high a price to pay for a kid with serious concussion issues.

Not that it matters, because he's not even remotely available, but the kid hadn't fully recovered from his concussion yet, and took more time to get healthy, like he's supposed to. When he had recovered, he rejoined his team for the last part of the season and the playoffs, and showed the world why he was the first D drafted in 2019. If it wasn't an issue in the Cup finals, doesn't that put most of those concerns to rest?

Maybe it makes more sense for a rebuilding team to hope they win the lottery and get an even better player with 3 ELC years left, but there would still be a ton of interest if he were ever available, and the asking price would be appropriately very high.

 

[iFan]

Bo Horvat is from London Ontario, Canada, Just my gut feeling that he goes to either Detroit or Toronto.

I don’t think so… I think he wants a cup and to compete for one.

 

[Raistlin]

Not that it matters, because he's not even remotely available, but the kid hadn't fully recovered from his concussion yet, and took more time to get healthy, like he's supposed to. When he had recovered, he rejoined his team for the last part of the season and the playoffs, and showed the world why he was the first D drafted in 2019. If it wasn't an issue in the Cup finals, doesn't that put most of those concerns to rest?

Maybe it makes more sense for a rebuilding team to hope they win the lottery and get an even better player with 3 ELC years left, but there would still be a ton of interest if he were ever available, and the asking price would be appropriately very high.

kid had at least 3 concussions since his debut in 2021, the last one, from Horvat's elbow, took 3+ months to come back from. Dizzy, lost his vision for a bit, lethargy, things didnt get better until psychiatric help. When someone had multiple concussions in succession, it becomes a lingering issue, it will never fully go away. He is a great player, but whoever trades for him has to shoulder that risk of one errant elbow. Hence as much as Canucks want a BC boy on their roster, I caution to stay away, this team has no luck with cases like these.

 

[DrDangles]

Bo Horvat is from London Ontario, Canada, Just my gut feeling that he goes to either Detroit or Toronto.

Detroit hadn't crossed my mind, but that makes a lot of sense even outside of location.

 

[GirardSpinorama]

If you look at their career totals, Hoglander and Newhook are very similar—to call one “mediocre” and one “a future star” is pretty ridiculous.

Actually hoglander is more similar or superior to podkolzin than newhook if you look at their career totals.

 

[FOurteenS inCisOr]

Actually hoglander is more similar or superior to podkolzin than newhook if you look at their career totals.

Never said anything about Podkolzin.

Was commenting on the .056 points/game that separates “mediocre” from “future star.”

 

[Ncit3]

No thanks.

If Byram wasn't one concussion away from being Ferland, this will be excellent for Vancouver. As it stands, the return for Byram would never get in the vicinity of a lottery pick until he can string together a full season of health. Extremely foolish to take on this risk.

If you could get that return for Bo Horvat you should take it and run away laughing. There is a strong chance I wouldn't trade Byram for EP. He was arguably the best defender not named Cale Makar in the entirety of the NHL playoffs last year.

 

[GirardSpinorama]

Never said anything about Podkolzin.

Was commenting on the .056 points/game that separates “mediocre” from “future star.”

It's about talent that separates mediocre prospect/young player and future top six star.

 

[AhosDatsyukian]

Carolina might not need a long term center (necas, Drury, aho, KK). They would need a future RD to eventually replace burns. But otherwise, I think morrow and a 1st is fair for Horvat in a vacuum.

yeah it's not bad value for the Canes but just doesn't make sense in the context of how the team is constructed. Morrow is a phenomenal RHD prospect and we're going to have a need there. Really just can't give him up in any trade realistically in my opinion. The value would have to be too good to pass up and that rarely happens.

 

[Ita]

The deal in the previous thread that seemed to be agreed by both sides, if done by Christmas and potentially some salary retained in case numbers didn't line up was:

To VAN:
Alex Newhook
2023 1st
2024 4th/2025 3rd

To COL:
Bo Horvat ( __% retained)

This is much more fair for both sides. The OP's proposal is absurd. Like, Canucks has to give up Horvat, a second and take on a cap dumb to get Newhook? Wth was that?

 

[IWantSakicAsMyGM]

kid had at least 3 concussions since his debut in 2021, the last one, from Horvat's elbow, took 3+ months to come back from. Dizzy, lost his vision for a bit, lethargy, things didnt get better until psychiatric help. When someone had multiple concussions in succession, it becomes a lingering issue, it will never fully go away. He is a great player, but whoever trades for him has to shoulder that risk of one errant elbow. Hence as much as Canucks want a BC boy on their roster, I caution to stay away, this team has no luck with cases like these.

I'm not going to try to talk you into wanting Byram, since he's not remotely available, but is there a single player in the league that isn't one bad play away from being out for the year? Or immune from potentially having a career altering injury?

For that matter, what other injuries do you think make a guy not worth acquiring at all, even after they return and have no ill effects for 6+ months. Does a shoulder injury make the cut? Or a knee injury?

 

[GirardSpinorama]

If you could get that return for Bo Horvat you should take it and run away laughing. There is a strong chance I wouldn't trade Byram for EP. He was arguably the best defender not named Cale Makar in the entirety of the NHL playoffs last year.

Petterson isn't even that good since he's insulated by the great Horvat.

/S.

 

[waitin425]

Bo Horvat is from London Ontario, Canada, Just my gut feeling that he goes to either Detroit or Toronto.

Born in London....but "from" Rodney where he grew up. Currently lives in London in the offseason though. Huge London contingent in the NHL. Would love it if Nick convinced him to take his talents to MOntreal.