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Movies: Horror Movie Discussion

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If you liked the Ash vs Evil Dead series then you should check out the Stan Against Evil series. It's available right now ( all 3 seasons - 24 episodes ) in Canada on SHUDDER.
I'm currently watching Widow's Bay on Apple TV and it's reminding me a little of Stan Against Evil. They're both funny and quirky, a little dark and about leaders of New England towns dealing with 300-year-old curses. You might care to check it out.
 
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Dawn of the Dead (1978) - 10/10

Two TV Station employees and two SWAT Team members take refuge in a shopping mall during the early stages of a zombie apocalypse.

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The Living Dead Weekend 2026:

This past weekend, Monroeville Mall held a 3-Day horror convention (June 12-14) with the stars of Dawn of the Dead. The event has been held annually since 2018, but this was to be the last. The Mall is tentatively set to be torn down in April 2027, and though there are rumors of a potential Living Dead Weekend in October, the word on the street is that it may be a Re-Animator (1985) reunion and not held at Monroeville Mall. This event was the Big Kahuna.

I had a Saturday pass and drove down from Michigan early Saturday morning, getting there at noon. I entered through the entrance prominently featured in the film (pictured above), which is located near Macy's. The Mall is different from what I envisioned. It's significantly longer than I thought, being a solid 10-minute walk to get from Macy's to JCPenney's at the other end, the general area where the event was being held. On the flip side, it's smaller in terms of scale; the second level isn't as toweringly high as it would appear in the film.

As you can imagine, things have changed a lot in the past 48 years. The fountains are gone, the Pennies/JCPenney has moved (the location in the film is now a Cinemark), there have been paint jobs, and so on. I kept trying to find the hallway that the characters spend so much time running back and forth through during the movie...only to realize I'd already been in it. I had to use the can after my 4+ hour drive, and the bathrooms were down that hall. Small confusions aside, you can still tell it's the same mall. The large marble pillars and a lot of the light fixtures are still there.

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Even though tickets were purchased back in April, many of the coolest events - the Tours of the Mall, the Cinemark movie screening with the cast, the VIP mixer with the cast - had long sold out. That left me with access to the panels, Halls A-B-C, and The Living Dead Museum (an extra $10). The panels were held on the mall floor, where the fountain would've been back in the day. Though I was always passing by them, I didn't sit through a full panel, so I don't have much to report there.

The Halls were your standard Comicon fare, with celebrities and vendors alike stationed behind picnic tables. Hall B, set up inside a closed Party City, featured the Big 3 - Ken Foree, Scott Reiniger, and Gaylen Ross. As you would imagine, the lines to see them were always huge, often flowing into each other and even blocking the entrance of Hall B at times. In Hall A, the big name was Tom Savini. In Hall C (which was tiny), the draw was Land of the Dead's (2005) Eugene Clark. I didn't see any Day of the Dead (1985) alumni, outside of people who also worked on Dawn (i.e., Savini, Taso Stavrakis), but I could have missed them.

I had Tom Savini sign my cherished Dawn of the Dead (Director's Cut) VHS that I bought from K-Mart in the late 90s or early 00s. He's always been my favorite personality from the Dead franchise. A big part of that is that he was still in the zeitgeist when I was growing up, acting in movies like From Dusk till Dawn (1996), Planet Terror (2007), and Machete Kills (2013). I've met him twice before, but the most recent time was in 2009. Savini has...a reputation. He's not the celebrity to go see if you're expecting a once-in-a-lifetime interaction full of anecdotes and banter. That may upset fans anxious to meet their hero, but for me, it just adds to the bizarre mystique that is Tom Savini. Tom and I exchanged Hello's and Thank You's, and I'm happy my most cherished VHS tape has now been immortalized.

I didn't meet the Big 3 or any of the zombies. There was discussion about joining the Big 3's line to get their autographs, but the group concluded it wasn't worth the time or money investment. As you'd guess, prices were steep at this event. Savini was $50 per item, with no "buy one, get one" discounts. Even many of the zombies were charging $40 per signature. But if you're an autograph collector, this was the event to be at. Everyone who was still alive was at this event; from name actors to blink-and-you'll-miss-them zombies. There were some cast members who had never done a convention, like Jim Baffico (who played racist SWAT member Wooley) and wife Joey Baffico (who played a prominent zombie). It's my understanding that it was also a rare appearance by Richard France, who played the eye-patched Dr. Millard Raush.

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After wearing out the Halls, the next stop was the Living Dead Museum. Unlike the rest of Living Dead Weekend, this museum and gift shop is a permanent fixture at Monroeville Mall. Personally, it was the highlight of the trip. This museum features screen-used props and fixtures from Dawn of the Dead, including the original Pennies elevator.

The collection isn't limited to Dawn of the Dead, though. Props from some of the other Dead films (Night, Day, Land) are in the museum, along with other Romero films (The Crazies, Creepshow, Knightriders). Though the museum slants heavily towards George Romero films, sections of it were dedicated to non-Romero works, such as My Bloody Valentine (1981), Resident Evil: Afterlife (2010), and The Walking Dead (2010-2022). Most significant was the Evil Dead II (1987) room, which had the screen used workshed and cabin shutters.

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After The Living Dead Museum, that was pretty much all she wrote on the event. I'm not a huge autograph collector or photo op guy, and we'd already made the rounds checking out the vendors in Halls A-B-C at least three times each by that point. We even stopped in other mall stores, including Barnes & Noble for a coffee break, but staying any longer felt like it would've been redundant. At roughly 3 hours, our Living Dead Weekend came to an end.

To be honest, I feel like I left something on the table. I think the event would've been so much more enjoyable if we'd have been able to sign up for one of the 3-hour mall tours, but I had to make peace with that not happening months ago (or at least, I thought I did). The event itself was a little strange because the mall was still open to the general public, so there was an unusual mix of zombies and regular mall shoppers. It actually took us a few minutes to figure out where the event was, and we had to ask for directions. Adding to my mixed feelings, I bumped into a pair of YouTubers that I've been watching for nearly 20 years. Instead of saying a quick hello and thank you...I got cold feet, y'all.

Because the event was over so quickly, I considered driving back to Michigan and eating the cost of the hotel. I couldn't justify it though, and instead explored nearby Lawrenceville and later Pittsburgh (where the hotel was). Pittsburgh is a quiet and clean city, and we had dinner at a nice little strip called The Terminal, a stretch of 25-or-so shops and restaurants that was a 20-minute walk from the hotel. The cuisine of choice: Shake Shack. The night was concluded by drinking at the hotel bar.

I'm an idiot, though. It failed to occur to me that the extra time on our hands could have been used to check out the Evans City Cemetery, the site where the famous opening scene of Night of the Living Dead (1968) was filmed. The thought never even crossed my mind, as I was in full "Dawn" mode. Furthermore, the Creepshow (1982) house is in Monroeville, and the homeowners are totally into it, leaving a copy of the Creepshow comic in a trash can in front of their house for fans to do photo ops with.

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Recommendation and Conclusion:

Despite a few missteps on my end, it was a memorable weekend. This was the event to go to if you're a fan of Dawn of the Dead. The film is nearly 50 years old, so it's mindblowing that it can attract this level of attention all these years later. Though the Mall is in excellent shape structurally, time hasn't been kind to it. I'd estimate 2/5's of its stores are permanently closed, so it's easy to see why its days are numbered. Most of the film's stars are getting up there in age, and some aren't in great health. I was surprised to learn Tom Savini will turn 80 this year! This event was a great final way to say goodbye to the mall while most of the Dawn alumni are still with us. RIP David Emge and George Romero. (Also RIP to Tommy Lafitte, who plays Miguel the zombie early in the film - it's my understanding he was scheduled to appear, but passed away early last week).

Now that this event has ended, do I recommend going to the mall - on a normal day - before its destruction? Believe it or not, that was the original plan. Having some perspective now that I've been there: it's a tough sell, but not out of the question. You could check out the mall - most notably, The Living Dead museum (~30 minutes) - for an hour or so. You could milk the time further by eating lunch there. From there, venture out and explore the other landmarks, like the aforementioned Evans Cemetery and Creepshow house. There's also a mural of Tom Savini somewhere in the surrounding area, and my understanding is that the airfield featured in Dawn is very close to the mall. Close out the trip by visiting the Vinegar Syndrome store in Pittsburgh (they had a booth at this weekend's event), especially if you're into physical media. Between the Museum Gift Shop and the Vinegar Syndrome store, a very healthy chunk of the goodies available this weekend could still be purchased as souvenirs. As a 4-hour day trip, I think there's enough there if you put in the effort.

If you read all of that, thank you, and I hope you were at least multitasking by sitting on your porcelain throne. Stay scared!

I actually didn’t see Dawn of the Dead for decades despite being a horror fanatic. I was always afraid to watch it because it has such a strong reputation as a great movie that I didn’t want to be let down. Then I finally watched it a couple years ago and…yeah it was just a 10/10 masterpiece and I was being really dumb for about thirty years.
 
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Night of the Living Dead (1968) - 10/10

A group of strangers holds up in an abandoned farmhouse after the dead return to life and start attacking the living.

Judith O'Dea stars as Barbra, who's on a road trip with her brother Johnny (Russ Streiner) to visit their father's grave. At the cemetery, they're attacked by a ghoul, and Barbra flees to a nearby farmhouse. Shaken, she meets Ben (Duane Jones), who pulled into the property looking to gas up his truck. Ben boards up the doors and windows, and the two discover a group of survivors hiding in the cellar, including Harry Cooper (Karl Hardman) and Tom (Keith Wayne). As the living dead increase in numbers outside of the house, the group can't agree on the best course of action to survive the night...

Night of the Living Dead was directed by George A. Romero and written by John A. Russo and Romero. The independent film was Romero's feature directorial debut, having previously worked on commercials and industrial films. Due to an oversight during a last-second name change, the film entered the public domain upon release. How does Night of the Living Dead fare?

It's Night of the Living Dead. Not only has literally everyone seen this movie, but the chances are extremely high that you've watched a movie where the characters in that film are watching Night of the Living Dead (according to IMDB, there are hundreds of instances of this - my favorite being 1981's Halloween II). Forgetting to add the copyright logo to the title card cost Romero millions, but it also made this film possibly the most viewed of all time. The most ridiculous anecdote I can think of is that in the early 2000s, during a promotional period, DVDs of Night of the Living Dead were included with Tide laundry detergent.

That's not to say its obnoxious availability should overshadow how good a film it is. Night of the Living Dead singlehandedly created possibly the most dominant subgenre of horror: zombies (the flesh eating kind, not the voodoo type). Even to this day, aside from films where they run, the undead haven't changed much from their 1968 debut. The gore in the film was shocking at the time, but it's tame by modern standards.

Night of the Living Dead's main conflict is a microcosm of the world. There's a big problem, the characters all have different ideas about how to solve it, and they spend too much time arguing with each other to get anything done. Even the biggest asshole in the film, Harry, has good ideas, and there's irony both in which idea works out, and the film's ultimate ending. Night of the Living Dead had groundbreaking progressiveness, not only casting an African American lead during the tail end of the Civil Rights Movement, but also having that character ordering around (and even slapping around) the white characters. Ben wasn't written to be black - Duane Jones was just the best actor amongst Romero's friends.

It's not a perfect film. The cast was a mixture of commercial and stage actors, so performances are all over the place. Some of the action is weak; when Ben dispatches his first few zombies, it looks like he's hardly using any force. One possible continuity error is that the TV keeps showing footage of scientists and police being interviewed, but the segments are filmed in broad daylight. I think the idea is that the outbreak started way before Barbra and Johnny got to the cemetery - they got there at 8 pm, and it was a 3-hour trip - and that they're prerecorded segments. But I've always felt these scenes come across as live reports, even though our characters are battling the dead as late as 3 am (the time is mentioned at one point during the climax).

The film's flaws hardly distract from the overall product, though. The premise is so good and is executed well. There are a lot of little moments I like, such as when Barbra opens the creepy cigarette music box. One of the best directed moments, in my opinion, is when Barbra is listening to the radio and its announced the ghouls are eating the flesh of their victims. I generally think Barbra's breakdown is over the top, but she also cracks me up at times. She keeps repeating over and over (to no one) "Johnny has the keys", and when the other characters finally pay attention and ask her if she has a car, she says "You won't be able to start it."

Overall, Night of the Living Dead is... Night of the Living Dead. Though far from objectively perfect, not many films can say they created a genre. I used to have it at a "9", but I'm officially giving it the shadow1 seal of approval. Due to its public domain status, it's unclear how much Night of the Living Dead earned against its meager $114K budget, but some sources estimate as much as $30M. Night of the Living Dead spawned several remakes and five sequels, with a sixth (Twilight of the Dead, starring Kate Beckinsale) announced.
 
chances are extremely high that you've watched a movie where the characters in that film are watching Night of the Living Dead (according to IMDB, there are hundreds of instances of this - my favorite being 1981's Halloween II).
An example I've used a lot in the past - and one of my favorites too - as it's a quote within the film, but that also has the properties of an allusion, bringing up the question of Michael potentially being a living-dead, after being shot in the original film.
 
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I actually didn’t see Dawn of the Dead for decades despite being a horror fanatic. I was always afraid to watch it because it has such a strong reputation as a great movie that I didn’t want to be let down. Then I finally watched it a couple years ago and…yeah it was just a 10/10 masterpiece and I was being really dumb for about thirty years.
Which versions did you two watch? I think the vibes with soundtrack differences and the different cuts are all pretty fun to compare and contrast.
 
Which versions did you two watch? I think the vibes with soundtrack differences and the different cuts are all pretty fun to compare and contrast.

That's a great point.

Personally, I can only watch the Director's Cut (aka Cannes Cut). That's the one I bought on VHS as a youth, the hardcover "pride" version to be exact, and I can't watch the Theatrical Cut without being bothered by all the changes:
  • The Joe Pilato dock scene is removed.
  • The emotional scene where Peter and Roger shoot the zombies in the project house is removed.
  • One of my favorite scenes is when Peter and Roger first get into the mall and run down that long brown hallway to scope things out and decide to double back and turn the mall fixtures on...removed.
  • There's less gore (theatrical removes Roger shooting the Pennies zombie in the head, the scene with the zombie children is shorter, etc.).
  • The music is different in several spots, like the scene at the airfield, when the chopper first pulls up to the mall, when Peter and Stephen close the shutters before the climax (I realize some of the music in the Director's Cut is public domain, but it simply works better in my opinion)
These are all things I can think of off the top of my head, I'm sure there's more. As far as I'm concerned, the Director's Cut is the definitive viewing experience.

I don't like the Argento Cut at all; there's way too much fat cut, and the movie feels like a sprint, rather than the slow burn it's supposed to be. There are also rampant music changes, which I don't feel work.

I've watched most of the (unofficial) 4-Hour Extended Mall Hours Cut too. No good. I think it features literally every piece of non-outtake footage available, and you can see why some things were left on the cutting room floor (like the extended emotional exchange between Peter and Roger in the Truck cab - it's way too much, the shorter version is significantly more effective).

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Which versions did you two watch? I think the vibes with soundtrack differences and the different cuts are all pretty fun to compare and contrast.

I don't like the Argento Cut at all; there's way too much fat cut, and the movie feels like a sprint, rather than the slow burn it's supposed to be. There are also rampant music changes, which I don't feel work.

I grew up with the Argento cut, that was the only cut available in video stores around here, for some reasons. I loved the movie, it was my "favorite zombie film" by a mile as a young teen. Only later did I discover the director's cut, and realized that this was not just a great zombie flick, but one of the best horror films ever made. Adult me still likes it even better than NOTLD.
 
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I grew up with the Argento cut, that was the only cut available in video stores around here, for some reasons. I loved the movie, it was my "favorite zombie film" by a mile as a young teen. Only later did I discover the director's cut, and realized that this was not just a great zombie flick, but one of the best horror films ever made.

That's very interesting. I know Dawn has had the weirdest distribution thanks to Richard P. Rubinstein's bizarre caretaking. The movie was completely out of print for several years in the 2010s, and you still can't buy Dawn of the Dead digitally. Of course, the damn thing has been uploaded to YouTube dozens of times, proving how futile Rubinstein's efforts are.

But I can only imagine the shenanigans he was pulling back in the day if this is what he's doing all these years later.

Adult me still likes it even better than NOTLD.

Ditto, hands down for me.
 
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Night of the Living Dead (1990) - 7/10

A group of strangers holds up in an abandoned farmhouse after the dead return to life and start attacking the living.

Patricia Tallman stars as Barbara, who's on a road trip with her brother Johnny (Bill Moseley) to visit their father's grave. At the cemetery, they're attacked by a ghoul, and Barbara flees to a nearby farmhouse. Shaken, she meets Ben (Tony Todd), who pulled into the property looking to gas up his truck. The two discover a group of survivors hiding in the cellar, including Harry Cooper (Tom Towles) and Tom (William Butler), and the group works to board up the doors and windows. As the living dead increase in numbers outside of the house, the group can't agree on the best course of action to survive the night...

Night of the Living Dead was directed by Tom Savini and written by George A. Romero and John A. Russo (earlier screenplay). Worried that another company may make an unauthorized remake, Romero wrote a new screenplay and enlisted effects wizard Savini to direct, hoping to finally make money off the Night of the Living Dead name after the infamous rights issues of the original. How does Night of the Living Dead 1990 fare?

Got ya! You thought I was going to review the Romero Dead series, didn't you? Well, I've got something much more painful up my sleeve. Night of the Living Dead '90 is a remake in every sense of the word. Aside from modernized dialogue and a modernized setting, the 90% of the film's events are the same. Through that lens, it would be fair to give this movie a low score; we've seen all of this before, and the first time around, zombie flesh eaters were a fresh concept.

But I like this movie. My score actually went up a star after this latest rewatch. Having watched both it and the original in rapid succession, the big difference between the two films, personally, is this: '90 is at its best before the people come up from the cellar; '68 gets better when the people come up from the cellar. (Also, '90 has way better action).

There are a few reasons for the first point, and the biggest is Tony Todd. His acting in this film is something else. I believe every word that comes out of his mouth, and his extended monologue about the war zone he escaped in Evans City is the highlight of the film. In terms of characters, even though Ben is the most similar to his character in the original film and therefore should be the least interesting, Todd brings something special to the role.

There are subtle changes to Judy Rose (more panicky) and Helen (more assertive). Tom is pretty much the same as the original movie, but I like the backstory of him having ties to the farmhouse (unlike the original film, where every single character randomly stumbled upon it). Harry's changes are less subtle. In the original film, though he is an asshole who does bad things, he comes off more like a slimy coward who legitimately is worried about his family. In NOTLD '90, Harry feels more cartoonishly evil. His words and actions are more antagonistic, which includes slapping around Helen. The writing feels similar to some of the soldiers in Day of the Day (1985), which isn't a compliment. I always forget Harry's actor is Tom Towels, due to the hair on his head and lack of hair on his face.

That brings us to Barbara (Barbra in the original). Unlike the first film, where she's practically in a vegetative trance, Savini asked Romero to write her like an Ellen Ripley (Aliens was only four years old at this point), and that's pretty much what she is in this film. I think it works in this film's favor, because it changes things up enough that the movie isn't a complete carbon copy. There are other subtle changes I like. I already mentioned Tom's character having a connection to the farmhouse. Another big one is that Ben boarding up the house is a relatively breezy event in '68. In '90, the characters spend most of the movie boarding the house up, and it's ironically all the noise they're making that keeps drawing the zombies to them.

The ending is different, too. The original ending is way better, but as a way of changing things up, the new ending works. Unfortunately, this film had a lot of ideas that were blocked. Savini originally wanted the film to start in black-and-white and gradually change to color, which would've been brilliant. I should mention that the gore in this film is extremely tame, surprisingly given this came out only five years after the barf bag fest that was Day of the Dead. There were a few gnarly moments left on the cutting room floor courtesy of the MPAA (most notably a shotgun blast to a zombie's head), but overall, this film might even be slightly less gory than the original. I think that was partially by design; both as a way to respect the '68 classic and make the movie more accessible for financial reasons.

Overall, Night of the Living Dead 1990 is a good remake. Though much of it is the same, there are enough changes to subvert audience expectations, and the film is backed by an incredible performance from Tony Todd. Unfortunately, NOTLD '90 was a commercial flop, earning only $5.8M against its $4.2M budget.
 
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How'd you hurt my mind? You said it's too long, I said don't read it. What do you want me to say?
You think that youre somehow the master of this thread with your clown avatar? I was there before you even knew horror. Youre are just a baby when talking about horror. A little crying baby.

Grow up.

I never ignore ppl here at HF-boards, but you are a disgusting person. Whats wrong with you?
 
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You think that youre somehow the master of this thread with your clown avatar? I was there before you even knew horror. Youre are just a baby when talking about horror. A little crying baby.

Grow up.

I never ignore ppl here at HF-boards, but you are a disgusting person. Whats wrong with you?
What lol. You alright there, fella?
 
You think that youre somehow the master of this thread with your clown avatar? I was there before you even knew horror. Youre are just a baby when talking about horror. A little crying baby.

Grow up.

I never ignore ppl here at HF-boards, but you are a disgusting person. Whats wrong with you?
You're repeatedly insulting him because he wrote a review that was too long for you to read... and he's the one who needs to grow up?
 
You think that youre somehow the master of this thread with your clown avatar? I was there before you even knew horror. Youre are just a baby when talking about horror. A little crying baby.

Grow up.

I never ignore ppl here at HF-boards, but you are a disgusting person. Whats wrong with you?
Sorry dude, go back to your hole. You've proven quite a few times that you are intellectually challenged, that's ok, we deal with it, but you get in shadow's face like that and I will expose you for the ass you are.

Silence.
 
You think that youre somehow the master of this thread with your clown avatar? I was there before you even knew horror. Youre are just a baby when talking about horror. A little crying baby.

Grow up.

I never ignore ppl here at HF-boards, but you are a disgusting person. Whats wrong with you?

My avatar is James Bond (from the movie Octopussy).

I'm not interested in trading insults. You're free to shit all over my horror movie opinions, though.
 
This thread has taken a weird turn since I was last in here :popcorn:

That's very interesting. I know Dawn has had the weirdest distribution thanks to Richard P. Rubinstein's bizarre caretaking. The movie was completely out of print for several years in the 2010s, and you still can't buy Dawn of the Dead digitally. Of course, the damn thing has been uploaded to YouTube dozens of times, proving how futile Rubinstein's efforts are.

But I can only imagine the shenanigans he was pulling back in the day if this is what he's doing all these years later.



Ditto, hands down for me.

Dawn of the Dead (Original) has also never been available as far as I know on any of the streaming services

Which is odd because Day of the Dead is pretty much a regular on almost all of them

I wonder if Dawn of the Dead and Martin (A forgotten Romero classic IMO) have had rights issues beyond Rubinstein because neither has ever been available for streaming

Tales from the Darkside (TV series) another Romero/Rubinstein production collaboration has also never been on streaming nor has from appearances Monsters season 2 and 3 (Season 1 is all that has been available for years on various services)

Wonder if it comes from fallout of Romero/Rubinstein partnership breaking up and then Laurel Entertainment (Company they founded) eventually being bought up in later mergers so some of the assets may be under control of various companies, etc
 

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