HLM25 is out!
- Thread starter Ajex12x
- Start date
It’s great. I’ve fully converted from EHM. I’ve been working on from scratch-rosters with some special Easter eggs (let’s call them HLMX when I release them) ever since 2024 came out but I had to spend the better part of the year breaking down the mechanics and understanding the file structure and building everything. Not quite there…but soon.
abo9
Registered User
- Jun 25, 2017
- 9,145
- 7,262
I enjoy both. Desktop I tend to give myself a challenge with hard settings, mobile I cheese it hard and force trades to make my dream team
I started a test game with the default rosters last night (no changes other than unfaking all the names). I agree that there are some very smart/fun systems in the game. If the AI is actually able to manage the cap and construct plausible rosters then it's close to surpassing EHM and FHM in terms of what I'm looking for in a hockey management sim.
My biggest pet peeve initially is the lack of nuance in the rating system. In the default DB, the best forwards are also the best defensive forwards. Connor McDavid, Leon Draisaitl, Nikita Kucherov and Artemi Panarin are all going to be perennial Selke contenders. Maybe BK's DB will be better in this respect, but with only 9 attributes, it may be a necessary evil to get players like McDavid to 98 or 99 overall.
Re: scoring, here's some very quick and dirty analysis from my sim:
Goals Leaders
56, 53, 45, 45, 43, 43, 43, 42, 42, 42, 42, 41, 41, 41, 40, 39, 39, 38, 38, 37
vs in the real NHL
69, 57, 54, 51, 49, 48, 47, 46, 46, 44, 42, 42, 42, 41, 40, 40, 40, 39, 37, 37
Assists Leaders
90, 72, 66, 66, 66, 65, 62, 62, 62, 62, 61, 61, 61, 60, 60, 59, 59, 59, 57, 57
vs in the real NHL
100, 100, 89, 75, 71, 69, 66, 65, 64, 63, 62, 62, 62, 60, 60, 59, 59 58, 57, 57
Points Leaders
131, 120, 114, 110, 100, 100, 98, 97, 96, 96, 94, 94, 93, 92, 91, 91, 90, 90, 90, 90
vs in the real NHL
144, 140, 132, 120, 110, 107, 106, 104, 103, 98, 96, 94, 94, 94, 92, 90, 90, 89, 89, 88
We are definitely missing some top end scoring. This may be a ratings problem - I'm not sure if adding more separation between top end players and the rest would solve this.
My biggest pet peeve initially is the lack of nuance in the rating system. In the default DB, the best forwards are also the best defensive forwards. Connor McDavid, Leon Draisaitl, Nikita Kucherov and Artemi Panarin are all going to be perennial Selke contenders. Maybe BK's DB will be better in this respect, but with only 9 attributes, it may be a necessary evil to get players like McDavid to 98 or 99 overall.
Re: scoring, here's some very quick and dirty analysis from my sim:
Goals Leaders
56, 53, 45, 45, 43, 43, 43, 42, 42, 42, 42, 41, 41, 41, 40, 39, 39, 38, 38, 37
vs in the real NHL
69, 57, 54, 51, 49, 48, 47, 46, 46, 44, 42, 42, 42, 41, 40, 40, 40, 39, 37, 37
Assists Leaders
90, 72, 66, 66, 66, 65, 62, 62, 62, 62, 61, 61, 61, 60, 60, 59, 59, 59, 57, 57
vs in the real NHL
100, 100, 89, 75, 71, 69, 66, 65, 64, 63, 62, 62, 62, 60, 60, 59, 59 58, 57, 57
Points Leaders
131, 120, 114, 110, 100, 100, 98, 97, 96, 96, 94, 94, 93, 92, 91, 91, 90, 90, 90, 90
vs in the real NHL
144, 140, 132, 120, 110, 107, 106, 104, 103, 98, 96, 94, 94, 94, 92, 90, 90, 89, 89, 88
We are definitely missing some top end scoring. This may be a ratings problem - I'm not sure if adding more separation between top end players and the rest would solve this.
Scoring is not really a ratings issue, it's a scoring slider issue. The slider makes a BIG difference but it does tend to move all scoring, not spread scoring leaders out more.
In HLM24 testing, if the scoring slider was set at exactly middle, I calculated annual average goals per game for the league and it came out less than the current NHL (past 3-4 years). But if I slid it one up from the middle, it ballooned the scoring too much, well past current NHL averages for team goals-per-game.
I haven't run the same multi-year testing in HLM25 yet. My hope is that the slider settings can be adjusted to approximate the current NHL environment goals-per-game - but I doubt you'll ever get the "bell curve" of top scorers to feel exactly the same as real life.
As far as ratings go - yes, one of the fundamental issues with HLM has been how ratings are essentially equally rated between offense and defense no matter what the position or role is. In order for the top superstars to get "high ratings" - it is by necessity that they have high defensive ratings. It's definitely a flaw in the game. Whether my database, the default database or anybody's database. Of course, with guys less highly rated you can start to "shape" the weight of their offensive/defensive split a bit better. But you are correct in your assumpetion about superstar-level players.
If you are curious, overall rating is the average of:
Shooting *1 + Passing*1 + Off Awareness*1.5 + Shot Blkg*1 + Hitting*1 + Def Awareness*1.5
In other words, the two "Awareness" categories count extra. Face-offs, Discipline and Injury Proneness do not calculate into overall rating.
If you change McDavid to a defensive defenseman, he will still have the exact same rating as he does as a playmaking center, if the attributes are all the same.
Aside from producing annoying Selke Trophy results, I can tend to ignore this flaw for the sake of having a game which simply plays and edits "faster" than a more detailed sim like EHM. That's why even in its newly upgraded 25 form, HLM is definitely not a direct "replacement" for EHM or FHM if you are looking to micro-rate 25 attribute categories for 10,000 players each.
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The Crypto Guy
Registered User
- Jun 26, 2017
- 27,829
- 35,991
You can follow my HLMX thread here…besides a testing ground for my rosters I’m using it is kind of a real-time “walk-through” of HLM…what it does good, what is fun about it and the weird things or things I want to improve. I’m posting tons of in-game screencaps of the game and its features.
HLMX - An HLM25 Database & Story
Feel free to ask specifics there or in this thread.
Asking if it is “better” than EHM or FHM is a tough question. It is fundamentally a different pace of game.
- Much simpler rating system…which has its pros and cons. Easier to edit, easier to structure league ratings, team depth charts, prospects , etc. Bad as it relates to the conversation I am discussing several posts above in regards to it causing issues with superstars being monsters defensively too and not really having any relationship to role. This is probably the biggest “flaw” of the game. As a person who likes to edit, it was difficult to accept at first. But once you kind of get past this…there’s a lot to love.
- Much less detailed editing of structures and rules and the game was designed to be pretty much NHL-centric in terms of managing…although what you can edit is awesome and I’m taking my roster set well beyond the stock-based rosters. This is the other major hurdle - if your love of EHM or FHM is creating a real life 48 team Swedish fourth tier with accurate roster rules that you can manage a team in, this is most certainly NOT the game for you lol. Although you can add as many custom leagues and teams as you want, any crazy idea is possible in HLM, there’s just limits on how customized you can get with rule sets and structures, etc. And you can choose to “replace” the NHL as the “main” sim league but I really haven’t tested to see if that’s any fun.
- Much “quicker” gaming experience. Fast simming, great for getting through long careers
- A ton of really fun ways the user experience is enhanced. NHL awards show, NHL draft lottery is an event, the trade deadline and first day of free agency are “events”
- Built in expansion with expansion drafts…almost endless ways to evolve NHL league structure both at start-up or during a career
- Copious stats including advanced stats like puck possession metrics…
- Great historical tracking of data and awards and history and milestones and drafts
- Less emphasis on international play and tournament editing - though there are two divisions each at the World Cup and WJC
- Fantastically modern GUI for mobile especially (although not bad on Steam either) - once you get used to where to find stuff
- Historical play like FHM (though not with my rosters lol)
- I find statistical results and trades to be more real than either EHM or FHM - plus you can manipulate scoring and other developmental items with a ton of sliders
- Trading is awesome. Player contracts can have NMC, NTC and Modified NTC so they can decline trades. Big and bad contracts create very negative value players, even ones who have good solid ratings (Darnell Nurse, I’m looking at you). You can retain salary in deals. You can do three-way trades. Sometimes the CPU GMs will even involve a third team just to retain salary.
- Really cool coaching and training system that impacts your players development at all levels. Coaches and scouts can level up and develop special skills. The net aggregate of your coaches attributes and skills at each level (NHL/AHL/ECHL) have an effect on how your team develops and plays that you can actually feel (and see in your staff screen).
It’s both a quicker and less detailed and yet more immersive experience than more traditional sims like EHM and FHM. The he developer has been adding tons of features with every new release.
It hits a sweet spot for me. I can play on the go on my phone. I can edit like I did with EHM. But it’s just less of a time commitment to both play and edit. And…trust me as an EHM fan for over 15 years….i find it is simply more fun!
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I've played this for several years; the only major issue I've had was to carry-over the "scouting projections" onto the active player card. I know it's not meant to be "perfect" but I'd like to see some quantifiable connection to player development so I can invest the staff money as needed.
I can do it off-line but it gets labor intensive.
Indrid Cold
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- Oct 24, 2022
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