Player Discussion: HC Rick Bowness

[JacketFanInFL]

While I agree with him being allowed to reshuffle the bench, we need new voices. But I don't agree about Boll being behind a bench unless you have specific reasons why he shouldn't be there outside of "well he was a fighter so what does he know about hockey"

I can say with 100% confidence that zero other teams would hire Jared Boll as an assistant coach if they had an opening.

 

[NotWendell]

The only way to further "properly deal" with that is Time Heals All Wounds. It's never going to just go away.

Personnel-wise, Elvis seems to be trying to be the backup in Kivi's place. But Johnny will never be replaced; he was literally the first and to date only major free agency guy that actively chose Columbus in his prime while being courted by most of the league. Nobody else with that level of talent at that age is even ending up on the market, let alone coming here.

.... until we become a place where players can have a chance to win the Stanley Cup.

 

[Viqsi]

.... until we become a place where players can have a chance to win the Stanley Cup.

I doubt it'll happen even then.

 

[majormajor]

Coyle spoke glowingly about Bones and said if we kept him he'd be more comfortable staying

I'm guessing the fact that Bowness walked back his comments - he made it clear it wasn't about the whole team (or even most guys?) - helped preserve the strong relationship between Coyle and Bowness.

I also do wonder, even with Bowness walking it back - if it is a more damaging thing for Werenski and Jenner. They've been here forever and Bowness threw the team under the bus in a way that really undermines the long term leaders of the team more than it undermines new guys like Coyle. I would describe Werenski's comments as diplomatic.

 

[Cheddarcheese]

Eric kind of covered the argument I am making back on this PDOcast episode.

Bowness had a hot couple weeks against low talent teams and then when push came to shove had one of the biggest collapses in franchise history.

I just don’t get rewarding that especially because it’s not like any of the young players on Columbus particularly leveled up under Bones.

the host thinks Ottawa, Pittsburgh and Philly are bottom feeders?
hes calling them weak teams?

 

[Jovavic]

the host thinks Ottawa, Pittsburgh and Philly are bottom feeders?
hes calling them weak teams?

Episode is from before the Olympics when only Pittsburgh were in playoff position

 

[CBJWerenski8]

I'm guessing the fact that Bowness walked back his comments - he made it clear it wasn't about the whole team (or even most guys?) - helped preserve the strong relationship between Coyle and Bowness.

I also do wonder, even with Bowness walking it back - if it is a more damaging thing for Werenski and Jenner. They've been here forever and Bowness threw the team under the bus in a way that really undermines the long term leaders of the team more than it undermines new guys like Coyle. I would describe Werenski's comments as diplomatic.

He didn’t walk it back, at least publicly, and said he told the team almost the same thing in the room before he told the media. Said he pushed the bar a bit, but that’s him.

But yeah. Z seemed a bit annoyed by it. Provorov seemed a bit annoyed by it. And Jenner was the same old Jenner in the media.

 

[KJ Dangler]

He didn’t walk it back, at least publicly, and said he told the team almost the same thing in the room before he told the media. Said he pushed the bar a bit, but that’s him.

But yeah. Z seemed a bit annoyed by it. Provorov seemed a bit annoyed by it. And Jenner was the same old Jenner in the media.

Yep, they asked him if he wanted to walk back his comments, he said he stood by what he said, it had been said in the room many times prior . Honestly , I could care less if he offended anyone . That last game , they didn’t play LDBB, or call up a Richard, because he wanted to understand the baseline here .. and as he said 2 hits , 23 giveaways .. Krill had 5 of them . What’s the standard here?

From the comments in the past , and Coyle speaking in the media prior to end of season .. Bones coming back here would have a big factor whether he came back .. it was said yesterday they spoke with Coyle for extended time as well yesterday in locker room. I think it’s fair to say Coyle had taken all this in as well, glad it was adressed , and will be a key figure leading change here .

What I hope hasn’t happened , is losing has been ingrained in Zach … Always lots of media expected answers with Zach.. Does he hate to lose more than anything ?

 

[SC Cannon]

What I hope hasn’t happened , is losing has been ingrained in Zach … Always lots of media expected answers with Zach.. Does he hate to lose more than anything ?

I want to preface this by saying Zach Werenski is an elite player and one of the top 3ish players to ever wear the jersey (high bar I know).

If you feel there's a country club atmosphere to me you look to the longest tenured guys. Which would be Z and Boone. Both great soldiers don't get me wrong, but both very soft spoken. Little to no fire. Compete level is there but can't seem to get that extra gear when it matters.

Then you look at those exit interviews. My god did his sound bad. When you listened to Fantilli, Sillinger, Coyle, Olivier, you could feel the passion and the anger. You could tell they were all in. Z man, I dunno. So aloof. I know that's just in his nature, but it was really off-putting to me.

Then you look at his career. Obviously he's put up great numbers, but what has he won as our #1 defenseman? Literally nothing. Not even a round? Jones left in 2021 and Z became THE guy. Haven't made the playoffs since. Those were some bad teams and that isn't his fault.

But if you ask me who doesn't seem to hate losing enough it might be him.

What did he do in those last 3 weeks? Just mumble to the media under his breath.

I'm not advocating for dumping him or anything, but I don't understand how he gets the pass from so many people. I also think it's bonkers that people can listen to him and say he should be out next captain.

 

[Banana duck]

I want to preface this by saying Zach Werenski is an elite player and one of the top 3ish players to ever wear the jersey (high bar I know).

If you feel there's a country club atmosphere to me you look to the longest tenured guys. Which would be Z and Boone. Both great soldiers don't get me wrong, but both very soft spoken. Little to no fire. Compete level is there but can't seem to get that extra gear when it matters.

Then you look at those exit interviews. My god did his sound bad. When you listened to Fantilli, Sillinger, Coyle, Olivier, you could feel the passion and the anger. You could tell they were all in. Z man, I dunno. So aloof. I know that's just in his nature, but it was really off-putting to me.

Then you look at his career. Obviously he's put up great numbers, but what has he won as our #1 defenseman? Literally nothing. Not even a round? Jones left in 2021 and Z became THE guy. Haven't made the playoffs since. Those were some bad teams and that isn't his fault.

But if you ask me who doesn't seem to hate losing enough it might be him.

What did he do in those last 3 weeks? Just mumble to the media under his breath.

I'm not advocating for dumping him or anything, but I don't understand how he gets the pass from so many people. I also think it's bonkers that people can listen to him and say he should be out next captain.

I thought Zach looked like he was about to fall asleep standing up. Between 4 Nations, Worlds, the Olympics, pushing for playoffs, 30+ minutes a night, whatever illness he had - his body - even in elite athlete shape has got to be saying “please don’t decide to go go Worlds this year too”

 

[TimBielik]

I wrote something about this for Cleveland.com today if you want to find it. But the point I made is although Bowness did tone down what he said to a point, the crux of what he said is spot on. When 2 different coaches are on the bench for late-season collapses, that points to a player problem.

To expand those thoughts here further from what I wrote, while the talent on the team has to improve this summer, so does their response to adversity. It needs to be the idea of “pressure is a privilege.” They’ve earned the right to play in high-stakes games the last 2 seasons, but far more often than not, they’ve failed to respond to the pressure. That has to change on top of a few other things.

Maybe it’s too early to call this the most important offseason in franchise history. But like I said before, the franchise cannot be passive. The front office has to make some big moves, including whatever they reasonably can to get a star forward into the team, and the players need big summers. Bowness threw down the gauntlet. This summer will be about who rises to that challenge.

 

[Double-Shift Lasse]

I want to preface this by saying Zach Werenski is an elite player and one of the top 3ish players to ever wear the jersey (high bar I know).

If you feel there's a country club atmosphere to me you look to the longest tenured guys. Which would be Z and Boone. Both great soldiers don't get me wrong, but both very soft spoken. Little to no fire. Compete level is there but can't seem to get that extra gear when it matters.

Then you look at those exit interviews. My god did his sound bad. When you listened to Fantilli, Sillinger, Coyle, Olivier, you could feel the passion and the anger. You could tell they were all in. Z man, I dunno. So aloof. I know that's just in his nature, but it was really off-putting to me.

Then you look at his career. Obviously he's put up great numbers, but what has he won as our #1 defenseman? Literally nothing. Not even a round? Jones left in 2021 and Z became THE guy. Haven't made the playoffs since. Those were some bad teams and that isn't his fault.

But if you ask me who doesn't seem to hate losing enough it might be him.

What did he do in those last 3 weeks? Just mumble to the media under his breath.

I'm not advocating for dumping him or anything, but I don't understand how he gets the pass from so many people. I also think it's bonkers that people can listen to him and say he should be out next captain.

Have you ben to a game in Nationwide? Have you seen the Jet' Pizza promotion? The one where Zach is on camera asking if the Fifth Line knows what time it is?

A great orator he is not. Which is not to say being a great orator is bad. Nor to say that this team doesn't need someone with that skill.

 

[SC Cannon]

Have you ben to a game in Nationwide? Have you seen the Jet' Pizza promotion? The one where Zach is on camera asking if the Fifth Line knows what time it is?

A great orator he is not. Which is not to say being a great orator is bad. Nor to say that this team doesn't need someone with that skill.

I'm going to likely date myself here, but he's the hockey player equivalent of Daria.

 

[ColumbusTrill]

Eric kind of covered the argument I am making back on this PDOcast episode.

Bowness had a hot couple weeks against low talent teams and then when push came to shove had one of the biggest collapses in franchise history.

I just don’t get rewarding that especially because it’s not like any of the young players on Columbus particularly leveled up under Bones.

the host thinks Ottawa, Pittsburgh and Philly are bottom feeders?
hes calling them weak teams?

Yeah it feels disingenuous that he is using that episode to prove a point when it’s from Feb 10 and we played another month of dominating hockey after it was recorded

 

[Double-Shift Lasse]

I'm going to likely date myself here, but he's the hockey player equivalent of Daria.

Haha I may date myself when I say I have no idea who that is.

 

[BigBoss614]

Maybe it’s too early to call this the most important offseason in franchise history. But like I said before, the franchise cannot be passive. The front office has to make some big moves, including whatever they reasonably can to get a star forward into the team, and the players need big summers. Bowness threw down the gauntlet. This summer will be about who rises to that challenge.

I've been thinking this as well, really the next two off-seasons will be huge for this Org as well as the future of DW as GM, he has some massive roster decisions over the next two years. He has to make decisions on 2/3 of the entire active NHL roster.

 

[CBJWerenski8]

 

[SC Cannon]

I've been thinking this as well, really the next two off-seasons will be huge for this Org as well as the future of DW as GM, he has some massive roster decisions over the next two years. He has to make decisions on 2/3 of the entire active NHL roster.View attachment 1221084

That doesn't feel THAT crazy to me, but I could be under thinking it. I would imagine a great bulk of the league isn't signed through 2029. Someone else can do the math on that.

Haha I may date myself when I say I have no idea who that is.

She was in Beavis and Butthead and got her own spin off later.

To be fair, it was a obscure reference anyways lol.

 

[Double-Shift Lasse]

That doesn't feel THAT crazy to me, but I could be under thinking it. I would imagine a great bulk of the league isn't signed through 2029. Someone else can do the math on that.


She was in Beavis and Butthead and got her own spin off later.

To be fair, it was a obscure reference anyways lol.

Ah yeah. I do get it and you're absolutely right.

 

[BigBoss614]

That doesn't feel THAT crazy to me, but I could be under thinking it. I would imagine a great bulk of the league isn't signed through 2029. Someone else can do the math on that.

Yeah I didn't think it was super crazy, but the next two years specifically he's going to be putting his mark on the team between negotiating with RFAs and deciding who to keep and let walk this year and next season.

 

[majormajor]

I want to preface this by saying Zach Werenski is an elite player and one of the top 3ish players to ever wear the jersey (high bar I know).

If you feel there's a country club atmosphere to me you look to the longest tenured guys. Which would be Z and Boone. Both great soldiers don't get me wrong, but both very soft spoken. Little to no fire. Compete level is there but can't seem to get that extra gear when it matters.

Then you look at those exit interviews. My god did his sound bad. When you listened to Fantilli, Sillinger, Coyle, Olivier, you could feel the passion and the anger. You could tell they were all in. Z man, I dunno. So aloof. I know that's just in his nature, but it was really off-putting to me.

Then you look at his career. Obviously he's put up great numbers, but what has he won as our #1 defenseman? Literally nothing. Not even a round? Jones left in 2021 and Z became THE guy. Haven't made the playoffs since. Those were some bad teams and that isn't his fault.

But if you ask me who doesn't seem to hate losing enough it might be him.

What did he do in those last 3 weeks? Just mumble to the media under his breath.

I'm not advocating for dumping him or anything, but I don't understand how he gets the pass from so many people. I also think it's bonkers that people can listen to him and say he should be out next captain.

You see, he has the letter A on his jersey and not a C. Therefore, when you give him a C he won't have his game fall off a cliff late in the year and he will lead the team to glory.

The team leadership is the team leadership regardless of whether they have a letter or which letter it is. But there is a lot more media attention and focus from the fans (often negative focus) if you have the C. So which player would do well with that attention and focus?

Definitely not Zach Werenski. We've already got him playing half the night trying to do everything for this team. He has to have some low effort shifts given his role. And it's not his personality.

I think Mathieu Olivier is the guy.

 

[KJ Dangler]

You see, he has the letter A on his jersey and not a C. Therefore, when you give him a C he won't have his game fall off a cliff late in the year and he will lead the team to glory.

The team leadership is the team leadership regardless of whether they have a letter or which letter it is. But there is a lot more media attention and focus from the fans (often negative focus) if you have the C. So which player would do well with that attention and focus?

Definitely not Zach Werenski. We've already got him playing half the night trying to do everything for this team. He has to have some low effort shifts given his role. And it's not his personality.

I think Mathieu Olivier is the guy.

I don’t think they have a captain next year , unless it was dangled to Coyle in their locker room discussion that was referenced . I could see them doing what Bones did in the Peg .. especially making the statement a leader doesn’t have to have a letter .. and hoping Fantilli is ready after next season

 

[NotWendell]

I'm guessing the fact that Bowness walked back his comments - he made it clear it wasn't about the whole team (or even most guys?) - helped preserve the strong relationship between Coyle and Bowness.

I also do wonder, even with Bowness walking it back - if it is a more damaging thing for Werenski and Jenner. They've been here forever and Bowness threw the team under the bus in a way that really undermines the long term leaders of the team more than it undermines new guys like Coyle. I would describe Werenski's comments as diplomatic.

They get to look at themselves in the mirror and ask themselves if Bones was talking about them. Zach will know it wasn't him but hopefully wonder if wearing the A means he should others more accountable. Boone will know he's aging, often plays injured and is not the player he once was, but he cares and hustles.

 

[koteka]

Hopefully he is allowed to reshuffle the assistants. Jared Boll has no business behind an NHL bench. Not sold on Ford or Haviland, either.

Yes

I think he should have an opportunity to clean house and get his guys in here now.

As a manager, I firmly believe people in leadership need to build their own teams and bring in people they trust and respect. They shouldn’t be forced to keep the guys the old guard hired.

While I agree with him being allowed to reshuffle the bench, we need new voices. But I don't agree about Boll being behind a bench unless you have specific reasons why he shouldn't be there outside of "well he was a fighter so what does he know about hockey"

I look at a guy like KJ. I don’t think Boll is the kind of guy who could teach him how to use his talent, but Boll is the kind of guy that could work with him on body position, contact, battling for pucks, etc. Which is all the stuff KJ needs to improve. So I give the team an F in developing KJ, and I am going to assign some blame to Boll. I could go on, but that is the most obvious answer.

I cannot believe nobody asked Bones/Waddell about the assistant coaches. Unless they were asked and it wasn't posted? Or are they all just coming back?

This is why our media sucks. I do have high hopes for Tim, though.

It was asked, but was noncommittal
Said he learned about the team bc of the assistant coaches but now he can form his own judgement after seeing them play

I can say with 100% confidence that zero other teams would hire Jared Boll as an assistant coach if they had an opening.

The question that should be asked by the media is “This team has never done anything, yet it has a history of hiring its former players. What’s up with that?”

 

[Indy18]

I'm going to likely date myself here, but he's the hockey player equivalent of Daria.

Daria isn’t that old

*remembers I was referred to as Daria in high school and that was 20 years ago*

Yeah you might be right…