Confirmed with Link: Hawks get pick #s 18 & 50 from NYI for pick #s 20, 54, & 61 (all in 2024)

[crazyhawk]

I genuinely have no idea what you're trying to say at this point.

It would appear to me that initially DHF was pointing out the ambiguity in that you are a Big Strome fan and were also a big touter of Crystal in his draft year and currently you are not a fan of Catton in this years draft nor did you shout from the rooftops about Tij earlier on. Thus pointing out the ambiguity. Catton and Tij being similar players ( at least in considering their stature along with talent ) to Crystal ... Strome though soft and slow is a big guy so I'm not sure about his inclusion with these other 3.

 

[Kevin Musto]

It would appear to me that initially DHF was pointing out the ambiguity in that you are a Big Strome fan and were also a big touter of Crystal in his draft year and currently you are not a fan of Catton in this years draft nor did you shout from the rooftops about Tij earlier on. Thus pointing out the ambiguity. Catton and Tij being similar players ( at least in considering their stature along with talent ) to Crystal ... Strome though soft and slow is a big guy so I'm not sure about his inclusion with these other 3.

I don't care what players are similar or not.

It's about talent.

Cristall and Iginla are more talented players than Catton.

Catton is Tyler Johnson. That's a good player. It's not a great one.

Cristall has ppg upside. Iginla should be a consistent 30+ goal scorer.

Catton isn't either of those things.

 

[Taze em]

Are we all pretending our defense doesn’t exist where the minimum height is like 6’4? Our future D Corp is like the most exclusive roller coaster ride on the planet. “Must be 6’4 to ride”.

We will play a heavy enough game. Just swarms of speedy two way Smurf’s with sequoias in the back. Love it.

 

[Kevin Musto]

Are we all pretending our defense doesn’t exist where the minimum height is like 6’4? Our future D Corp is like the most exclusive roller coaster ride on the planet. “Must be 6’4 to ride”.

We will play a heavy enough game. Just swarms of speedy two way Smurf’s with sequoias in the back. Love it.

The smurfs still need to score.

A top 6 of exclusively sub 6ft forwards is only producing in the regular season.

In the playoffs, they're getting completely neutralized.

 

[BobbyJet]

It would appear to me that initially DHF was pointing out the ambiguity in that you are a Big Strome fan and were also a big touter of Crystal in his draft year and currently you are not a fan of Catton in this years draft nor did you shout from the rooftops about Tij earlier on. Thus pointing out the ambiguity. Catton and Tij being similar players ( at least in considering their stature along with talent ) to Crystal ... Strome though soft and slow is a big guy so I'm not sure about his inclusion with these other 3.

Why is that some people insist on mixing in past thoughts into a current conversation? It's irrelevant other than to personalize - Strome and Mitchell are ancient history; let it go.

 

[Taze em]

The smurfs still need to score.

A top 6 of exclusively sub 6ft forwards is only producing in the regular season.

In the playoffs, they're getting completely neutralized.

Nobody is neutralizing prime Bedard. Or prime Demidov. You can trade skill for size later if it’s really a problem. The size we might need will be forecheck and net front size. Not skilled size. You can find those guys In FA and trades.

Chandler Stephenson and Jake Debrusk if you wanna solve it this offseason. Easy peasy.

 

[Hattrick Kane]

This is ridiculous. Being big doesn’t mean you’re going to be a good playoff performer. Strome is 6’3 and is soft as shit. He’ll never win anything.

And then you have the Tampa Bay Lightning. They didn’t win shit because they employed a bunch of Smurfs. Except wait, they won back to back cups and almost won a third. And they had one forward that played full time in the playoffs above 6’1, which was fourth liner Maroon lol.

Being pushed around in the playoffs isn’t a size thing, it’s a mentality thing. Otherwise guys like Kane, Crosby, Mackinnon, Makar would never succeed.

 

[Kevin Musto]

Nobody is neutralizing prime Bedard. Or prime Demidov. You can trade skill for size later if it’s really a problem. The size we might need will be forecheck and net front size. Not skilled size. You can find those guys In FA and trades.

I'm not talking about Bedard lol.

Bedard is the only Bedard in our top 6.

Catton-type players aren't remotely on that level.

 

[Larmer83]

Anyone who is watching these playoffs can see once again that big bodies with skill dominate and often compliment a smattering of smurfs quite nicely. It is no fluke that final 4 teams all play a heavy game when it's needed - and a Florida team that plays probably the heaviest game in the NHL has to be the favorite to take the SC.

Since this is a draft thread, I'm guessing your implication is to draft big. In that case, Dallas might be a better example of drafting big with skill.

The drafting big for Florida really only includes 3 home grown talents-

Barkov- 2013 draft
Ekblad- 2014 draft
Lundell- 2020 draft

All other players were acquired via trade or as free agents.

 

[Kevin Musto]

This is ridiculous. Being big doesn’t mean you’re going to be a good playoff performer.

We're obviously talking about players that are big and physical, skilled players, with high compete levels.

Nobody here is saying to draft a team of just Louis Crevier.

Being pushed around in the playoffs isn’t a size thing, it’s a mentality thing. Otherwise guys like Kane, Crosby, Mackinnon, Makar would never succeed.

Those are all generational or near generational players.

You guys keep citing the exceptions lol.

Obviously a team of all Patrick Kanes is going to be nasty. But that's impossible.

You guys want a top 6 of one Patrick Kane, and five Johnny Gaudreaus. That's getting you cooked in the playoffs. End of story.

 

[Taze em]

I'm not talking about Bedard lol.

Bedard is the only Bedard in our top 6.

Catton-type players aren't remotely on that level.

Ok so just using this years FAs we could theoretically have in 3 years:
Nazar bedard bertuzzi
Dach Stephenson demidov
Duclair Moore Kurashev

Korchinski Jones
Vlasic Rinzel
EDM whoever

Size isn’t a problem. It’ll work itself out.

Also if you wanted an effective, big prospect for the beginning of our competing window in 2026 they should have been drafted two years ago. They develop so slowly.

 

[Hattrick Kane]

We're obviously talking about players that are big and physical, skilled players, with high compete levels.

Nobody here is saying to draft a team of just Louis Crevier.

Those are all generational or near generational players.

You guys keep citing the exceptions lol.

Obviously a team of all Patrick Kanes is going to be nasty. But that's impossible.

You guys want a top 6 of one Patrick Kane, and five Johnny Gaudreaus. That's getting you cooked in the playoffs. End of story.

You want me to go through every cup winner and post every forward that was 6’0 or shorter to prove my point?

Tampa Bay: Kucherov, Point, Palat, Tyler Johnson, Coleman, Gourde, Paquette. Just for starters, that’s quite the team if Smurfs that won the cup.

Remember those Smurfs Bolland, Shaw and Kruger? Boy they sure sucked, definitely didn’t contribute to the Hawks winning any cups.

Wait wait wait Pittsburgh is a good one! Crosby, Guenztzel, Sheary, Kessel, Rust, Kunitz, Wilson, Hagelin. All of them Smurfs. One forward above 6’1 who was Malkin.

 

[TLEH]

Catton: plays center as well as PKs. Leads the WHL in SHG. 54+62 in his draft year. (Not even BPA at 10-13)
You complain about Catton's size and compete but then rank Cristall (who is also 5'10) Top 5 in a way better draft. It doesn't add up. It FEELS like throwing shit at the wall.

 

[Kevin Musto]

You want me to go through every cup winner and post every forward that was 6’0 or shorter to prove my point?

Tampa Bay: Kucherov, Point, Palat, Tyler Johnson, Coleman, Gourde, Paquette. Just for starters, that’s quite the team if Smurfs that won the cup.

Remember those Smurfs Bolland, Shaw and Kruger? Boy they sure sucked, definitely didn’t contribute to the Hawks winning any cups.

You can have small players on the roster, but there needs to be a limit. And they certainly can't make up the entirety of your top 6.

Vegas pretty much just had Marchessault when they won.

Look at the remaining teams this year.

Oilers top 6: no smurfs
Stars top 6: one smurf
Rangers top 6: two smurfs
Panthers top 6: no smurfs

 

[Njfj]

Been playing around with the idea that the trade was made with hopes of moving up even further in the draft. Not a finished product, but I think there is an angle for the Jersey pick.

NJ fans would really like to trade for Ullmark but don't want to give up 10oa
Boston fans would like to get a first + for Ullmark

Enter Kyle Davidson:

Chicago receives 10oa

Boston receives 18oa and 50oa

NJ receives 34oa and Ullmark


Not confident enough to take this to the main board, but I think every team is getting something they want here.

 

[Hattrick Kane]

Catton: plays center as well as PKs. Leads the WHL in SHG. 54+62 in his draft year. (Not even BPA at 10-13)
You complain about Catton's size and compete but then rank Cristall (who is also 5'10) Top 5 in a way better draft. It doesn't add up. It FEELS like throwing shit at the wall.

He’s being contrarian for the sake of it at this point. And Bobby as we know just wants big sweaty men around him all the time. So I don’t know why we bother.

 

[Taze em]

You can have small players on the roster, but there needs to be a limit. And they certainly can't make up the entirety of your top 6.

Vegas pretty much just had Marchessault when they won.

Look at the remaining teams this year.

Oilers top 6: no smurfs
Stars top 6: one smurf
Rangers top 6: two smurfs
Panthers top 6: no smurfs

I’m so uninterested in following the trends set by these one-off contenders. Zig when everyone zags. That’s where market inefficiencies are.

 

[Kevin Musto]

I’m so uninterested in following the trends set by these one-off contenders. Zig when everyone zags. That’s where market inefficiencies are.

It's not a trend lol.

It's simply what works.

Trend chasing is when everyone went small a few years ago. That includes the Blackhawks. Stanley tried it and it failed.

 

[Hawkaholic]

I don't care what players are similar or not.

It's about talent.

Cristall and Iginla are more talented players than Catton.

Catton is Tyler Johnson. That's a good player. It's not a great one.

Cristall has ppg upside. Iginla should be a consistent 30+ goal scorer.

Catton isn't either of those things.

Lol, OK dude. Reality is that you really have no idea what he could become. He's one of only 4 players to score more than 50G and 115pts in the CHL, with Crosby, Bedard, and Patty Kane. Pretty elite company, and the talent is undeniable.

 

[x Tame Impala]

It's not a trend lol.

It's simply what works.

Trend chasing is when everyone went small a few years ago. That includes the Blackhawks. Stanley tried it and it failed.

We don't have enough talent on this team or in the pipeline to skip out on a guy because he's almost 5'11.

Height isn't everything either, a lot of these NHLers I've seen in person are around 6ft but they're not these massive, physically intimidating guys. A 5'10" guy that's high energy and puts on muscle weight would do just fine.

 

[BHawks77]

I genuinely have no idea what you're trying to say at this point.

How can you have scouted Iginla but not seen Cristall play?? They play for the same team!!

 

[BobbyJet]

Since this is a draft thread, I'm guessing your implication is to draft big. In that case, Dallas might be a better example of drafting big with skill.

The drafting big for Florida really only includes 3 home grown talents-

Barkov- 2013 draft
Ekblad- 2014 draft
Lundell- 2020 draft

All other players were acquired via trade or as free agents.

It doesn't matter how Panthers got there, the point is how they play the game. If Hawks are going to rebuild properly it must be with the post season in mind... and not for entertaining hockey in the RS only to fall on our faces when it counts.... a la Leafs.

 

[BobbyJet]

It's not a trend lol.

It's simply what works.

Trend chasing is when everyone went small a few years ago. That includes the Blackhawks. Stanley tried it and it failed.

Montreal was probably the worst when it came to going smurf. It failed miserably and they're still recovering (as are the Hawks).

 

[Kevin Musto]

How can you have scouted Iginla but not seen Cristall play?? They play for the same team!!

I've seen both of them play.

They didn't play on the same team in Cristall's draft year.

I'm not writing scouting reports for Cristall this year because he's already been drafted.

What's so hard to understand?

 

[bwana63]

Demidov and Yakemchuk: grand slam

just to be clear, we're gonna have to move up to snag Yak