Has there ever been a team that has sucked so bad yet had so much talent?

[Sol]

Just think, the Kings can still add Kovy, Vilardi, and Scherbak to the line up.

The Kings suck, but mismanagement is what is killing them right now. And if the Kings tried a bit harder I'm sure they could have landed Sprong for Pearson.


Would have been a nice line up.




... But defense would still suck because f*** you Forbort.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

But they were really good 5 years ago!

The point is all the players listed were really good and more not even ONE year ago.

The sudden and precipitous dropoff is insane. Everyone knows 5 years is an eternity in hockey and father time comes for everyone, but no one could have said with a straight face the grim reaper was going to show up for 95% of the roster this summer.

 

[GoldenBearHockey]

The 'talent' of most of the core is eroding...Carter and Toffoli's play have dropped considerably....Kopitar's play is not even 60% of what he was last year.
Muzzin, Martinez, Brown, are about 80% of what they were last Cup in 2014. It's just passage of time and maybe some injuries play into it.
Kopitar has no excuse, of that bunch. He is playing without any heart, urgency, or determination. I just don't see the effort. He rarely goes to the
net....that one game he had a goal and an assist, maybe 10 days ago - he was going to the net and both his pts were right in front of the net.
He chooses to play the perimeter and he's not going to be successful there.

I miss good hockey, so every night, I watch center ice and flip between games...so you watch other games? What you wil lfind is the
talent level and execution is so far beyond what you see with the Kings....for whatever reasons, the Kings look like an AHL
team after you watch other games. Seriously.

Iafallo is not a #1 LW. He's a decent player, but needs to move down a line or 2. He will perform just as well and maybe help a lower line get going somewhat.
Carter and Toffoli are no longer top 6 players and they cannot play bottom 6. Phaneuf is terrible.

The best thing that can happen, is Drew ask for a trade and get 3 top assets back for him and begin the rebuild. The best thing that was supposed
to happen, was for the team to turn it around...but it cannot and will not happen. 1/3 the season is over. #31. #31 offense. #31 PP #28 PK.
Worst 2nd line in NHL. Worst defenseman in NHL DF. Horrible coach. Team has no heart, drive, determination and yes, LACK OF TALENT.

No words to respond because it's ludicrous for anyone to think that the drop off last year to this year would be THAT dramatic...

You miss good hockey, so you watch other games ok...umm..good for you? Not sure what your version of good hockey is, but ok.

Fans are such fickle creatures, it's insane......

 

[KINGS17]

The point is all the players listed were really good and more not even ONE year ago.

The sudden and precipitous dropoff is insane. Everyone knows 5 years is an eternity in hockey and father time comes for everyone, but no one could have said with a straight face the grim reaper was going to show up for 95% of the roster this summer.

Yeah, but this really isn't the point. The Kings still had some really good players and a team which wasn't a contender and wouldn't be until the shelf life of these players expired. What's a GM to do in this situation?

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

Yeah, but this really isn't the point. The Kings still had some really good players and a team which wasn't a contender and wouldn't be until the shelf life of these players expired. What's a GM to do in this situation?

That IS the point, though. If you have a 1C, 1D, 1G arguably in their prime (less so for Quick but splitting hairs), and a 100 point team, you might not be a Cup favorite, but you're sure a contender, and you're sure going to have a hard time selling to any ownership that you need to start tearing it apart right now 'just in case', especially given the Washington Capitals just won with an older team.

I think various people will--fairly--point to various key moments over the last couple of years as 'the time' to start rebuilding, or at the very least, moving auxiliary parts, but no amount of foresight would have predicted the 1st PK and GA team in the league--adding a PP weapon to boost scoring--would turn into this pretty literally overnight, a team with no heart that can neither score (nothing real new) nor defend (the real shock) nor possess the puck. To circle it back to the OP, this has to be one of the most disappointing teams of all time, and as someone else pointed out Chicago is roughly in the same boat, though at least you could probably draw a neat line through their decline instead of a volatile peak and valley like the Kings...though I guess that's the story of the last 8 or so years anyway eh? 1 part burning out due to success, 1 part father time, who knows whatever else.

 

[Bandit]

Dan Beckerman, April '17:
"I absolutely would not characterize it as a rebuild. We have so many of the core pieces in place to be successful ... We have the expectation we're going to be back competing for championships immediately."

Okay, so that was a huge swing and a miss, but I would really like to know - and this I am asking to the Kings faithful here - is what is their public position today (if any)?

Do the bosses still delude themselves into thinking this team is a tweak away from contending or have they changed their mission statement? If the
Pearson/Hagelin trade is the start of a series of roster moves, that tells us what regarding their assessment?

Bent over.

 

[kingsholygrail]

Didn't the Habs miss the playoffs after 93? I'm there are other examples. Lightning with St Louis, Richards, Lecavelier after they won didn't seem to go anywhere.

All those years the Thrashers seemed to have a stacked team on paper.

 

[GoldenBearHockey]

Didn't the Habs miss the playoffs after 93?

Carolina after 06 as well, a few teams have done that, not many, but a few.

 

[Axl Rhoadz]

In response to the opening post, your answer can be found in Chicago right now.

But we are worse. ;-)

 

[BallPointHammer]

The two Stanley Cups and a Conference Finals team is dead and buried. But never forgotten. Four plus years later and now the worst team in the league screams "Blow it all up, starting today" and to Beckerman, Robitaille and Blake, use the following word,"REBUILD," in every sentence you speak regarding the Kings. No contender, no playoffs, no but this team has talent, no more patience, no more excuses, no nothing except "REBUILD." It's only a dirty word if you're arrogant enough to put marketing hype, bold face lies and generic entertainment value ($$$$$) ahead of your diehard fans.

 

[Axl Rhoadz]

Didn't the Habs miss the playoffs after 93? I'm there are other examples. Lightning with St Louis, Richards, Lecavelier after they won didn't seem to go anywhere.

All those years the Thrashers seemed to have a stacked team on paper.

I'm not talking about missing the playoffs, I'm talking about being dead f***ING last!

 

[Butch 19]

I'm just boggled how this team can go to being the best defensive team in the league last year to the absolute worst, all within a few months with pretty much the same personnel. The low scoring team? Yeah, you expect that, but not this bad of a defensive team.

Quick is getting tired of this team not being able to score, and it's affecting his game.

He know if he gives up 2+ goals, it's over - no way the team can ever bail him out.

 

[SettlementRichie10]

The point is all the players listed were really good and more not even ONE year ago.

The sudden and precipitous dropoff is insane. Everyone knows 5 years is an eternity in hockey and father time comes for everyone, but no one could have said with a straight face the grim reaper was going to show up for 95% of the roster this summer.

Not so sure.

Kopitar had what amounts to a career year. Reasonable to assume he wouldn’t match that level of play.

Brown sucked for like three years in a row, and suddenly produced again last year. Again, reasonable to assume the production was the anomaly.

Doughty was and still is good. His numbers aren’t awe inspiring because the team around him sucks.

Carter had a major injury and didn’t look great upon returning. Reasonable to assume he would regress. Age is not on his side.

Frankly, I think the team caught lightning in a bottle last year, especially during the first couple months of the season. Kopitar and Doughty has Herculean seasons, and the team was still promptly swept in the playoffs. That’s really not a good indicator of overall team strength. You would expect a divisional title and a long playoff run when your top C and top D are having career years. Instead, it barely got them past the post.

The signs were all there, just subtle. None of our advanced metrics looked great last year. Players were shooting at unsustainable percentages (including Kopitar). All the signs were there.

It’s very reasonable to assume a season like 18/19 was inevitable, and last year was the core gasping for one last breath.

18/19 is not an indictment of the core’s skill. Rather, 17/18 was a testament to that skill. Players like Doughty and Kopitar are so freakin’ good, they could drag an aging has-been lineup to the playoffs. That’s the way I’ve come to see it.

 

[crassbonanza]

Not so sure.

Kopitar had what amounts to a career year. Reasonable to assume he wouldn’t match that level of play.

Brown sucked for like three years in a row, and suddenly produced again last year. Again, reasonable to assume the production was the anomaly.

Doughty was and still is good. His numbers aren’t awe inspiring because the team around him sucks.

Carter had a major injury and didn’t look great upon returning. Reasonable to assume he would regress. Age is not on his side.

Frankly, I think the team caught lightning in a bottle last year, especially during the first couple months of the season. Kopitar and Doughty has Herculean seasons, and the team was still promptly swept in the playoffs. That’s really not a good indicator of overall team strength. You would expect a divisional title and a long playoff run when your top C and top D are having career years. Instead, it barely got them past the post.

The signs were all there, just subtle. None of our advanced metrics looked great last year. Players were shooting at unsustainable percentages (including Kopitar). All the signs were there.

It’s very reasonable to assume a season like 18/19 was inevitable, and last year was the core gasping for one last breath.

18/19 is not an indictment of the core’s skill. Rather, 17/18 was a testament to that skill. Players like Doughty and Kopitar are so freakin’ good, they could drag an aging has-been lineup to the playoffs. That’s the way I’ve come to see it.

You are talking about offensive production, I think when some are talking about talent, they are more focusing on the precipitous drop in defensive play. This team won the Jennings last season and has consistently been top 5 in GA over the whole decade, even when we missed the playoffs. The lowest they have been since Doughty was drafted was his rookie season when they finished 11th in GA. I am not shocked that we can not score, I am shocked that we are being blown out so often. That leads me to believe it is an emotional or tactical issue.

 

[BallPointHammer]

And another thing, when the time comes, this team needs to develop its own identity from scratch. That won't happen with the current roster and coaching staff.

 

[Basilisk]

I wonder what Carolina would give us for Kopitar......

 

[KingPuckChoo]

2018/19 Los Angeles Kings:
talent:
kopitar
kovalchuk
doughty
quick
carter

/ end of talent

2005/06 Atlanta Thrashers:
talent:
hossa
bondra
kovalchuk
v. kozlov
savard

/ end of talent

Answer: Yes, yes there has...

 

[KingPuckChoo]

2018/19 Los Angeles Kings:
talent:
kopitar
kovalchuk
doughty
quick
carter

/ end of talent

2005/06 Atlanta Thrashers:
talent:
hossa
bondra
kovalchuk
v. kozlov
savard

/ end of talent

Answer: Yes, yes there has...

Ahhh nevermind, you guys are going to point out the win loss ratio and be a pain rather than understanding the essence of my post

so i change my answer to no... no never, LA's the only case

 

[Scottkmlps]

2018/19 Los Angeles Kings:
talent:
kopitar
kovalchuk
doughty
quick
carter

/ end of talent

2005/06 Atlanta Thrashers:
talent:
hossa
bondra
kovalchuk
v. kozlov
savard

/ end of talent

Answer: Yes, yes there has...

I see what you did there.

 

[KingsFan7824]

I wonder what Carolina would give us for Kopitar......

More likely than not less than you think.

Edit: more likely nothing.

 

[BigKing]

If you read Rosen's work today, you think the answer would have to be yes.

Never read anything on LAKI so brutal in regards to the team.

He's right, however. Nice to see it coming from someone actually paid by the organization.

 

[Axl Rhoadz]

2018/19 Los Angeles Kings:
talent:
kopitar
kovalchuk
doughty
quick
carter

/ end of talent

2005/06 Atlanta Thrashers:
talent:
hossa
bondra
kovalchuk
v. kozlov
savard

/ end of talent

Answer: Yes, yes there has...

I don’t see any goaltending or Norris caliber dmen on that ATL list.

 

[SettlementRichie10]

You are talking about offensive production, I think when some are talking about talent, they are more focusing on the precipitous drop in defensive play. This team won the Jennings last season and has consistently been top 5 in GA over the whole decade, even when we missed the playoffs. The lowest they have been since Doughty was drafted was his rookie season when they finished 11th in GA. I am not shocked that we can not score, I am shocked that we are being blown out so often. That leads me to believe it is an emotional or tactical issue.

I attribute that more to coaching and an egregious lack of identity.

 

[KingsFan7824]

Frankly, I think the team caught lightning in a bottle last year, especially during the first couple months of the season. Kopitar and Doughty has Herculean seasons, and the team was still promptly swept in the playoffs. That’s really not a good indicator of overall team strength. You would expect a divisional title and a long playoff run when your top C and top D are having career years. Instead, it barely got them past the post.

The signs were all there, just subtle. None of our advanced metrics looked great last year. Players were shooting at unsustainable percentages (including Kopitar). All the signs were there.

The signs were there in 2014. The first two no-shows against SJ. Then a loss at home. Then you lose the first two games at home against the Ducks. Then you get vastly outplayed in Game 1 against Chicago. Then they're down 0-2 in the 1st period in Game 7. Then they're down 0-2 in the 1st period in Game 1 and 2 against the Rangers. All 3 home games against the Rangers go to OT. A Ranger team everyone said they were so much better than. They managed to beat the Ducks with Jeff Schultz in there. That's lightning in a bottle. It took a career playoff performance from Gaborik, one of the highest goal totals in the playoffs ever, to get through the playoffs. Kopitar stopped scoring goals after Game 7 against Anaheim. A big goose egg for 12 consecutive playoff games in the goal column.

The signs were there for what we would see for the next 4.5 years, it was just subtle. They were on the razor's edge basically that entire run, and could've lost any one of those series. They almost even choked away a 3-1 lead against the Hawks with Game 6 at home. The run was great, but the last 4.5 years were all in there. To count on a 32 year old winger, who had 23 goals in his last 88 games before the 2014 playoffs, that's throwing something against the wall to see if it sticks. And then Lombardi re-signed him.

 

[Axl Rhoadz]

The signs were there in 2014. The first two no-shows against SJ. Then a loss at home. Then you lose the first two games at home against the Ducks. Then you get vastly outplayed in Game 1 against Chicago. Then they're down 0-2 in the 1st period in Game 7. Then they're down 0-2 in the 1st period in Game 1 and 2 against the Rangers. All 3 home games against the Rangers go to OT. A Ranger team everyone said they were so much better than. They managed to beat the Ducks with Jeff Schultz in there. That's lightning in a bottle. It took a career playoff performance from Gaborik, one of the highest goal totals in the playoffs ever, to get through the playoffs. Kopitar stopped scoring goals after Game 7 against Anaheim. A big goose egg for 12 consecutive playoff games in the goal column.

LOL, WOW, you are really reaching there, bud. The only games you could consider the Kings as a 'no-show' in the 2014 playoffs were the first two games of the SJ series.