Grub's Canucks & NHL News, Rumours, and & Fantasy GM | Trade Breezes

[Canucker]

The guy hasn’t gotten a real opportunity, he plays like 12 minutes a game, Frank was talking about him this morning on 650, basically said he’s been mismanaged

I agree with this partially...I don't think CBJ is a great place for players to develop, but Jiricek hasn't made it easy on them either...he didn't think he deserved to be in the AHL. but thats really where he needs to be if the Jackets aren't going to give him minutes. But we'll see how he fares, it looks like the Jackets just sent him down.

 

[bossram]

Apparently everything about him is that he’s terrible at moving the puck and he’s good at everything else.

I don’t think that fits whatsoever

That's not really the scouting report I've read on him or from what I've seen. If anything he's got an underrated offensive toolkit and may be overrated defensively.

 

[Mr. Canucklehead]

Apparently everything about him is that he’s terrible at moving the puck and he’s good at everything else.

I don’t think that fits whatsoever

The "good at everything else" piece would still represent a massive upgrade over all our defenders not named Hughes and Hronek. (and on some nights, Brannstrom).

 

[Bojack Horvatman]

Very cool Vector. Now you just need a funky nickname. Quads and abs are taken. Could you be biceps or hamstrings? Calves perhaps? Maybe Vecs pecs?

Vec's Pecs is so stupid and perfect.

I just wanted to point out Vector's Erector Spinae was right there.

 

[Vector]

Here’s an idea, Desharnais and a 2nd for Zadorov

If Boston does decide to rebuild by the deadline, if things continue to crumble

Bring back some of the chemistry, we get him cheaper than what we were going to them for the next couple years, and then the cap is going up.

How would that work cap-wise?

 

[VanillaCoke]

Provorov & Jiricek solves problems now and forward ..

 

[brock hughes007]

How would that work cap-wise?

Send back Debust for Zadorov..that's how that works.

 

[Vector]

1) Marcus Pettersson
2) Yanni Gourde
3) Rasmus Ristolainen
4) Ivan Provorov
5) Frank Vatrano
6) Joel Farabee
7) Brandon Tanev
8) David Jiricek
9) Mike Matheson
10) Trevor Zegras
11) Dan Vladar
12) Cam Fowler
13) Mario Ferraro
14) Alexandre Carrier

 

[Bojack Horvatman]

I said at the start of the season that all of the 'trade every pick and prospect this is our window' guys were missing the point. Our real 'window' starts next year or the year after if/when Willander and Lekkerimaki are ingratiated into the team and as Allvin gets to put more of a stamp onto our team.

I still think we will make the playoffs, but last year a lot went right and it probably increased expectations of the fanbase to an unrealistic level.

Now, with a bunch of adversity, things are tougher. But it will be fascinating to watch how this braintrust and our players find their way through it.

I mean a lot has changed since the offseason when people were saying this and now. Demko injury being worse than thought and chronic, Joshua having testicular cancer and missing the beginning of the season, Miller injury, Boeser head injury, Soucy regression, etc. That’s completely changed the outlook of the season that nobody here could have predicted ahead of time. I don’t think viewing the next 1-3 years as our best window was wrong at the time. Hughes and Demko are still on cheap deals, Miller is still young enough to be a top end C, etc. Yes if Lekkerimaki and Willander are the real deals it can extend our window, but contending windows only last so long. It is tough to continually have a top team in the cap world, so striking whil the iron was hot is not a bad idea. It’s like in 2010 to 2012 we should of been trading more firsts and Schroeder type prospects.

Plus, I dont’t think anybody was saying we should trade all are picks and prospects away for shits and giggles. My view on what assets should be available and for what in the the offseason was this:

-2nd-7th round picks and B prospects: Available

-1st round pick: Preferably for a Hronek type asset. A Coleman like trade would also be acceptable. Preferably not for a rental, but not opposed for the right one.

-Lekkerimaki: Available only for the right trade. Ie a 20-25 #2/3 D or top line winger. Basically untouchable

-Willander: The D I would trade him would very unlikely be available so he is practically untouchable.

 

[VanillaCoke]

Vatrano would also be a massive addition to this top-six.

 

[LemonSauceD]

Vatrano would also be a massive addition to this top-six.

I like Vatrano but no he wouldn’t.

 

[Rowlet]

I'm doubtful Kane comes back this season, the Oilers certainly doesn't seem like they are planning to reactivate him, seeing as they just claimed Kapanen and adding to their roster, instead of pre-emptively making some room.

But I am not familiar with their situation, so maybe I'm wrong. I just think that it is probably a seller's market and it is extremely unlikely that a top 4 D will go for a 3rd only. But even if the Zadorov-like opportunity comes up, with only $1.6m cap space, we won't be the team taking advantage of it anyways.

I highly doubt that they can go that long without Kane. They've scored even less goals than they did last year through 15~ games I think.

There's also the argument that Zadorov isn't a top 4D, in reality he was ideally a #5 with the upside of being huge and weirdly able to score a lot.

 

[MS]

1) Marcus Pettersson
2) Yanni Gourde
3) Rasmus Ristolainen
4) Ivan Provorov
5) Frank Vatrano
6) Joel Farabee
7) Brandon Tanev
8) David Jiricek
9) Mike Matheson
10) Trevor Zegras
11) Dan Vladar
12) Cam Fowler
13) Mario Ferraro
14) Alexandre Carrier

That ranking of Rasmus Ristolainen is comical. Dude has 3 years left on a $5.1 million AAV deal and is a 3rd pairing defender who needs a babysitter. He would almost certainly clear waivers right now.

 

[Bonham]

1) Marcus Pettersson
2) Yanni Gourde
3) Rasmus Ristolainen
4) Ivan Provorov
5) Frank Vatrano
6) Joel Farabee
7) Brandon Tanev
8) David Jiricek
9) Mike Matheson
10) Trevor Zegras
11) Dan Vladar
12) Cam Fowler
13) Mario Ferraro
14) Alexandre Carrier

That's a very underwhelming list.

 

[arttk]

That ranking of Rasmus Ristolainen is comical. Dude has 3 years left on a $5.1 million AAV deal and is a 3rd pairing defender who needs a babysitter. He would almost certainly clear waivers right now.

I don't know, the talent pool in the league is really thin. With the cap increase, cap is not going to be THAT much of an issue and I would see teams biting. If you look at the UFA pool, there is like nothing.

 

[MS]

I don't know, the talent pool in the league is really thin. With the cap increase, cap is not going to be THAT much of an issue and I would see teams biting. If you look at the UFA pool, there is like nothing.

It doesn't really matter what the cap is - I doubt teams are paying anything for a $1.5 million 3rd pairing D getting paid $5 million with term.

 

[ManVanFan]

That's not really the scouting report I've read on him or from what I've seen. If anything he's got an underrated offensive toolkit and may be overrated defensively.

https://x.com/i/web/status/1857191035241369701

1) Marcus Pettersson
2) Yanni Gourde
3) Rasmus Ristolainen
4) Ivan Provorov
5) Frank Vatrano
6) Joel Farabee
7) Brandon Tanev
8) David Jiricek
9) Mike Matheson
10) Trevor Zegras
11) Dan Vladar
12) Cam Fowler
13) Mario Ferraro
14) Alexandre Carrier

That Frank copying your article. That grey haired bastard.

 

[ManVanFan]

It doesn't really matter what the cap is - I doubt teams are paying anything for a $1.5 million 3rd pairing D getting paid $5 million with term.

1.5M for a 3rd pairing D? That was the price when the cap was 72M maybe. There's a reason why VD and and DF are 2M or less and suck. Everyday 3rd pair D. 3M plus. 2.5M gets you a waiver wire D pick up now a days.

 

[Jerry the great]

The guy hasn’t gotten a real opportunity, he plays like 12 minutes a game, Frank was talking about him this morning on 650, basically said he’s been mismanaged

D+1 he played a couple games at the start of the season, was sent down for the bulk of the year then recalled for a couple games at the end of the season. He was godawful in the two games to start the year and less so at the end. no reasonable person could possibly say this development path was a bad one to take.

Last year he was told to find an apartment because he was starting the year in Columbus. He played ten of the first 11 games, sent him down to Cleveland for few games, brought him back up in mid November where he went on to play 26 of the next 27 games getting around 14 min/GP. He was healthy scratched a few times and they told him it would be best for his development if he played the rest of the season in the AHL and stressed the need to improve his gap control. he took the demotion in stride like any young player trying improve his game. Just kidding, he aired his grievances publicly like a devout festivanian:

"I played good hockey in the NHL," Jiricek told The Athletic's Aaron Portzline on Friday. "I'm an NHL player right now. That's my opinion: that I should be in the NHL right now."

I see guys from the same draft, like Simon Nemec and (Kevin) Korchinski ... they get a chance on the power play," Jiricek said. "They play a ton of minutes in the NHL. Those are different teams, so different situations, but I can compare with them. I just want a chance to play like that."

"They told me the last game was not good enough for me," Jiricek explained. "I told them I don't think so, but that's your opinion. I was out of the lineup after that."

and grumbled all the way to Cleveland where he led the Monsters in on ice ES goals against. gap control is for suckers yo! he did put up a bunch of points while he was there though.

He finished the season in Columbus where he played the final 7 BJs games, putting up an assist and going -3 in ~13min/GP

Things actually improved from there when he went to Cleveland and was a meaningful contributor on their playoff run.

Not sure it's reasonable to take issue with how the team treated him last year, as he was given a long leash to prove he could play at the NHL level and simply didn't. Jiricek's response was ridiculous though...IMO.

As for what's going on this season is anyone's guess. New GM, new coaching staff are probably trying to figure out what they have with him and whether he's a fit with the club. They apparently broke down his film shift by shift to show him exactly what he needed to fix and I see they're finally sending him to the AHL. How he responds to this (assuming he shows up!) will be telling IMO. Maybe he'll hear this this wake up call and work his ass off to eliminate the deficiencies....maybe he can't and he just isn't good enough.

 

[Bojack Horvatman]

That ranking of Rasmus Ristolainen is comical. Dude has 3 years left on a $5.1 million AAV deal and is a 3rd pairing defender who needs a babysitter. He would almost certainly clear waivers right now.

Don’t disagree on your thoughts on Ristolainen, but GMs lose their minds on big RHDs. I mean Erik Gudbranson got a 4x4 a couple years ago. It wouldn’t surprise me if he gets a positive return next year when the cap goes up.

 

[MS]

1.5M for a 3rd pairing D? That was the price when the cap was 72M maybe. There's a reason why VD and and DF are 2M or less and suck. Everyday 3rd pair D. 3M plus. 2.5M gets you a waiver wire D pick up now a days.

Ristolainen absolutely sucks. I'd put him about on par with Forbort.

 

[thecupismine]

Here's the main issue with the picks and prospects argument right now: how long do people believe the Canucks window is open for? Is it until Petey and Hughes hit their 30s? Can they get contributions from their young players that outweigh the inevitable decline of Miller & Boeser?

Let's say they keep their 1st round this year, and they make the playoffs. The pick is in the 16-32 range. Since the *2019 draft, there's maybe 5-10 guys that have been picked in that range that are currently top 6/top 4 contributors, and 2 of them are because the Dallas scouting staff under Jim Nill (and Detroit before then when he ran their scouts) >>>> everyone else.

I'm not saying deal the pick for a rental like Lindholm, the team would have to be on a president's trophy-esque pace like last year for them to do that again. But while you're in contention for the playoffs, and have a franchise center & dman smack in the middle of their prime, you absolutely deal that 1st round pick if you get someone who can be a major contributor for 3-4 years. And if you make that pick, that prospect immediately is on the table for an upgrade the next year.

Willander was likely the last first round pick this team has made that will be a major contributor during this team's contention window, unless something miraculous happens that extends their contention years beyond Boeser and Miller's prime.

*Using the 2019 draft to show the odds of getting a contributor in the next couple drafts that might contribute before Petey/Hughes turn 30.

 

[ManVanFan]

Ristolainen absolutely sucks. I'd put him about on par with Forbort.

I watched two Philly games last week and I thought this is not the player from Buffalo (4 years removed I'd hope not). He's still not good but I'd say he's an everyday defender. My first thought when reading Frank's article is half retained for a 4rd and Linus Karlsson. I'd go with ahead of VD but not even near Myers. Is that Luke Schenn with NHL avg skating? Lol.

 

[credulous]

Here's the main issue with the picks and prospects argument right now: how long do people believe the Canucks window is open for? Is it until Petey and Hughes hit their 30s? Can they get contributions from their young players that outweigh the inevitable decline of Miller & Boeser?

it'd be malpractice to assume hughes is extending here before he does it. i don't think he's likely to leave but it would be absolutely disasterous to prioritize seasons where there's a very real chance hughes is no longer on this roster over ones where he will be on this roster. he's the best player the canucks have ever had and they probably won't see another like him for decades

while this season might not be an all-in season they should still be prioritizing this season and the next two over anything past that

 

[valkynax]

it'd be malpractice to assume hughes is extending here before he does it. i don't think he's likely to leave but it would be absolutely disasterous to prioritize seasons where there's a very real chance hughes is no longer on this roster over ones where he will be on this roster. he's the best player the canucks have ever had and they probably won't see another like him for decades

while this season might not be an all-in season they should still be prioritizing this season and the next two over anything past that

If things went SO sideways to the point where Hughes does not want to be here anymore, it will go beyond just a firing level offense for management - they might as well sell the team and move it to Alaska or something.