Grub's Canucks & NHL News, Rumours, and & Fantasy GM | It's All Gone Pete Tong

[Vector]

 

[TruGr1t]

Allvin: "Kevin, we'd like to talk extension."

Lankinen: "Great, you heard about Mackenzie Blackwood?"

 

[ManVanFan]

This is basically my stance exactly, if management leaked this they're finally doing something right:

 

[TruGr1t]

I'll take Sat over Brough every day of the week on team reports.

 

[ManVanFan]

Next 10 games determine how the season is going to go?

 

[Vector]

I'll take Sat over Brough every day of the week on team reports.

Yup. Brough is just a radio guy. He's got opinions and says them and that's all he really is. There's no inside information with him.

 

[brock hughes007]

Dhaliwal reporting that the Canucks have touched base with Lankinen on extension talks.

Hope they get that done.Demko is broken.

 

[Hodgy]

I think the optimal course of action is to wait on Miller and Petey until the offseason too. Unless some desperate/dumb team offers something decent for Miller, in which case he can go now.

Yes, at the time of Allvin's hiring I was more in favour of a "rebuild" (though for me that would not include trading away Petey or Quinn). Took a lot heat for it at the time. Honestly I think Allvin has mostly proved me wrong and largely threaded the narrow window to make the team competitive quickly, but in the longer-term I think I'll be right that in the end their ceiling is capped and they can't be a true contender with the current direction.

Lots of posters preferred this route, myself included. But as you say, management, up until this summer, was hitting at like a 95% execution rate in implementing this plan, and it’s hard to ignore the results. And even as we currently stand it’s hard to critique their general approach although they’re obviously missing a defensemen or two. You can’t judge these things to a perfect standard when only four teams out of 32 make it past the second round. The reality, most rebuilds/retools or whatever you want to call it fail.

As someone who has been extremely pessimistic on this situation from the get go—I do recognize the slight possibility that they rise above their differences and go on an extremely formidable 2nd-half run.

I think it’s more than a slight possibility. The one thing one can grip onto is that while the team, and Miller and Pettersson in particular, have played poorly, this has also generally happened while the team has had significant injuries, and even ignoring the injuries, while the team has had a horribly ci structure defense that even management must appreciate.

So id think, before going nuclear, they wanted to see how the team does when healthy and/or an improved defense, and I think we’d have a better than a “slight possibility” of playing well at that point and things working out.

 

[ManVanFan]

I'll take Sat over Brough every day of the week on team reports.

I don't think I listen to any. Lol. I believe the person who first reports that something has actually happened. Haha.

 

[credulous]

I think the main question is Miller vs. Horvat, and it's a reasonable one. Up until this season, it looked like they made the right choice, obviously, but there's no telling what that may have done to the window etc. I don't think there was ever a chance they went full rebuild and moved a bunch of the core.

their handling of horvat really tests my confidence in them moving either miller or pettersson. i know everyone thinks that trade was good because it resulted in hronek but they moved horvat for a middling first, a cap dump (beauvillier) that was later turned into a 5th (i think, not gonna look it up) and a prospect on the fast track to busting (raty). they also swapped a 2nd for a 4th in the hronek deal

that's basically like trading miller/pettersson for k'andre miller (or schneider, but i think miller is better) and adam sykora

 

[TruGr1t]

Yup. Brough is just a radio guy. He's got opinions and says them and that's all he really is. There's no inside information with him.

Also, I think the local media has taken some unnecessary criticism on this situation, but if there's one guy literally trying to talk Pettersson out of town, it's Brough.

 

[LOFIN]

I'll take Sat over Brough every day of the week on team reports.

Brough made a pretty good argument though why this could be the case

 

[kanucks25]

I'm sorry but the notion (and I've read it here as well) that Pettersson doesn't actually want to be here but signed long-term anyway is simply asinine.

If he wanted out he could have pulled a Tkachuk and gotten it done.

 

[TruGr1t]

I'm sorry but the notion (and I've read it here as well) that Pettersson doesn't actually want to be here but signed long-term anyway is simply asinine.

If he wanted out he could have pulled a Tkachuk and gotten it done.

I didn't listen to Brough, but the only way I think this is particularly realistic is if management attempts to make him continue to play on the same team as Miller. If Miller is traded, I bet all of this is forgotten rather quickly.

 

[LOFIN]

I'm sorry but the notion (and I've read it here as well) that Pettersson doesn't actually want to be here but signed long-term anyway is simply asinine.

If he wanted out he could have pulled a Tkachuk and gotten it done.

Like Brough pointed out, in that instance

1. Who knows if that type of money would still be available in the future. Most likely, yes. But if his play had continued dipping or there was an injury?
2. He probably would've been traded, and not necessarily somewhere he wanted.

I'm not saying Petey doesn't want to be in Vancouver, but there is an argument to be made that he signed the extension without being fully committed.

 

[ChilliBilly]

Next 10 games determine how the season is going to go?

I posted something like this 4 - 5 days ago. And the next game is against Mont, who are 7 - 3 in their last 10. The only team in trouble of the next 10 is Buff.

I didn't listen to Brough, but the only way I think this is particularly realistic is if management attempts to make him continue to play on the same team as Miller. If Miller is traded, I bet all of this is forgotten rather quickly.

not sure how this ended up attached to my quote. Its not relevant to my post.

 

[Quinning]

I think the team will be better off trading Miller over Pettersson, both because of age and locker room dynamics. I don't see Pettersson has the catalyst for all of this.

 

[kanucks25]

I didn't listen to Brough, but the only way I think this is particularly realistic is if management attempts to make him continue to play on the same team as Miller. If Miller is traded, I bet all of this is forgotten rather quickly.

Pettersson signed here knowing his alleged bully was already locked in long term.

So unless something serious happened between then and now (which all reporters have said they don't think is the case, or at least haven't heard anything about) I don't see how that would be the case.

Unless management promised Petey during negotiations that Miller would be traded sometime soon, which would be bizarre especially considering Miller has the NMC.

 

[TruGr1t]

Pettersson signed here knowing his alleged bully was already locked in long term.

So unless something serious happened between then and now (which all reporters have said they don't think is the case, or at least haven't heard anything about) I don't see how that would be the case.

Unless management promised Petey during negotiations that Miller would be traded sometime soon, which would be bizarre especially considering Miller has the NMC.

Something has obviously changed in the past 6 months or so, based on the leaks. It seems the situation has become untenable for one, or both, this season.

 

[Quinning]

This is something we've all speculated about for a long time. He was done with this team after the Tanev/Markstrom/Toffoli fiasco and dealing with Benning, he planned on pulling a Tkachuk but he got pressured into signing a contract (likely by his agent who wants to maximize his own payday, and management via the media) and now he regrets it.

If the season hadn't gone so well up until January last year, we wouldn't be here right now.

 

[Hodgy]

He's the only center who is even close to breakeven without Quinn.

For all the heat Petey takes, he's their only player that is good enough to not get crushed when playing with non-Hughes disasterclass this D-core is. That's honestly impressive.

Impressive until you account for the fact he’s the fifth highest paid player in the NHL.

 

[kanucks25]

Like Brough pointed out, in that instance

1. Who knows if that type of money would still be available in the future. Most likely, yes. But if his play had continued dipping or there was an injury?
2. He probably would've been traded, and not necessarily somewhere he wanted.

I'm not saying Petey doesn't want to be in Vancouver, but there is an argument to be made that he signed the extension without being fully committed.

1. Petey signing in the summer instead of when he did probably would have hurt his case for getting the money that he did but it's too small of a sample size to tank his value. The difference likely wouldn't have been large enough for him to sign somewhere he didn't want to be.

2. He could have been traded anywhere but like Tkachuk, a team wasn't going to trade for him if he wasn't going to commit there long-term. Petey would have made it known which teams he was willing to re-sign with and only those teams would have made serious pitches for him.

This is something we've all speculated about for a long time. He was done with this team after the Tanev/Markstrom/Toffoli fiasco and dealing with Benning, he planned on pulling a Tkachuk but he got pressured into signing a contract (likely by his agent who wants to maximize his own payday) and now he regrets it.

Petey has one of the power agents in the NHL in J.P. Barry, get serious.

 

[ManVanFan]

This is something we've all speculated about for a long time. He was done with this team after the Tanev/Markstrom/Toffoli fiasco and dealing with Benning, he planned on pulling a Tkachuk but he got pressured into signing a contract (likely by his agent who wants to maximize his own payday) and now he regrets it.

He was never going to get 11.6 in a lower tax market. Van is one of the higher tax markets in the league. He gets traded to another team. Get's more money. Carolina is the only team that was named (that I can remember) that made an offer for Petey. That would save Petey about 1.3M a year in taxes to go there.

 

[Lat]

Allvin's plan is crumbling around his inability to fix the d. I agree with you that we should keep both JT/EP unless forced to move one.

Other than the weirdness around JT, I think the entire conversation around our forwards is nonsense and we're getting victimized by the complete lack of a 2nd pairing and injuries.

Hughes is incredible but even so, there shouldn't be a gap of contender while he's on the ice, bottom feeder when he's not, it's a massively exaggerated deficit because of how bad the d is and it's a marked failure by PA that we're 3 years into his tenure with a pile of futures and buyouts used up and still only have two legitimate top 4 d.

My take is that there was a plan to address it by management...but injuries hit.
I think any team that loses it's 1D and 2D to injury is going to be in for a tough time.

The plan would have been to accrue cap so by the TDL, there would be enough cap space to take on the hit associated with a decent top 4 dman. There is probably also an expectation that Willander should be ready to jump in after his NCAA season.

Hughes-Hronek
Top 4 from TDL-Willander
Soucy-Myers
Forbort/Deharnais/Juulsen as 7th

Obv. Willander would be sheltered a bit, but Soucy and Myers are both capable of playing as the 4-5D and without being forced into top minute munching roles, they both fare much better.

If we didn't unexpectedly get hit with injuries to both Hughes and Hronek, I think the plan would have been fine and the team could've treaded water with the D until the TDL.

 

[kanucks25]

Something has obviously changed in the past 6 months or so, based on the leaks. It seems the situation has become untenable for one, or both, this season.

I mean that's the thing. I've heard several people including Sat and Seravalli say multiple times that they cannot find any evidence of something significant happening that has changed things.

Perhaps something did happen and nobody knows, but there's been nothing leaked.

I'm not sure what to believe but I do know that it wouldn't be as big of a deal if the team and both players weren't struggling this season.