Grub's Canucks & NHL News, Rumours, and & Fantasy GM | Christmas Presents

[Jerry the great]

Unfortunately I’m away on a work trip today so a recap won’t be coming until late in the afternoon.

I feel like Costanza when he tried to deposit however much money was in his big jar of loose change and the teller told him he had to roll it all himself. "what do you want me to quit my job!!"

 

[TruGr1t]

I think he's the most likely to move of the Nucks "Big 4" defensive prospects.

1. Willander - very unlikely to move esepcially as he's RHD
2. Mynio - seems like a steal and can play in all situations
3. EP 2 - Big, stay-at-home dman that I think mgmt and staff will love

So that leaves Kudryavstev who's style seems like the most likely to be "expendable" if in a trade for a player who fits more of the current team needs.

I don't see why you'd have an issue moving anyone not named Willander if the return is an established top-four NHL defenseman.

 

[Nuckles]

Unfortunately I’m away on a work trip today so a recap won’t be coming until late in the afternoon.

The punishment for this crime is *grimaces* posting Taj quoting the interview

 

[Vector]

Here’s a Bowen Byram trade proposal from trades of similar aged players: Byram & 4th for Hoglander, 1st, & 2nd

I’m working on an article that explains my reasoning. Right now it’s just 6 pages of jumbled thoughts. I looked at 7 fairly recent trades as comparables.

 

[Burke's Evil Spirit]

Here’s a Bowen Byram trade proposal from trades of similar aged players: Byram & 4th for Hoglander, 1st, & 2nd

I’m working on an article that explains my reasoning. Right now it’s just 6 pages of jumbled thoughts. I looked at 7 fairly recent trades as comparables.

God this would suck ass.

 

[Hansen]

I think Byram is getting undervalued in general here, he would be a tremendous value add to our team and possibly extend the window

 

[Nuckles]

Here’s a Bowen Byram trade proposal from trades of similar aged players: Byram & 4th for Hoglander, 1st, & 2nd

I’m working on an article that explains my reasoning. Right now it’s just 6 pages of jumbled thoughts. I looked at 7 fairly recent trades as comparables.

While I get there might be comparable trades in the past, I can't see Buffalo having any interest in that.

I know the idea you floated earlier was Buffalo could flip the 1st for another player, but I don't see Buffalo moving Byram unless they're getting a young-ish shutdown top 4 RD in return. And as we see in the current trade market they don't become available very often, otherwise the Canucks could just do that trade themselves.

 

[Jerry the great]

Here’s a Bowen Byram trade proposal from trades of similar aged players: Byram & 4th for Hoglander, 1st, & 2nd

I’m working on an article that explains my reasoning. Right now it’s just 6 pages of jumbled thoughts. I looked at 7 fairly recent trades as comparables.

I think we'd have to give them VD as well. they can deal with his leaky D.

 

[wonton15]

Connor Murphy, Jason Dickinson (max retention), Ilya Mikheyev
For
Hoglander, 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th

We get a top 4 RHD with term, 3C, and a top 6 winger all in one trade

 

[Deeds26]

Connor Murphy, Jason Dickinson (max retention), Ilya Mikheyev
For
Hoglander, 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th

We get a top 4 RHD with term, 3C, and a top 6 winger all in one trade

 

[MS]

God this would suck ass.

?????

That would be an utterly fantastic trade. A bunch of junk for one of the highest ES-producing top-4 defenders in the NHL who is only 23.

 

[bossram]

Agree with you about the concussions (and don't like Byram as a target), but this specifically doesn't concern me. That's just the Buffalo Suck Vortex™.

But it's not. His subsequent seasons in COL post Cup run were also much weaker than he had performed previously. His 5v5 underlying metrics took a big hit, even before he landed in BUF. This is partly why COL was comfortable trading him for Mittselstadt. If he was performing at the level he was in 21-22, there is no way they trade him.

He's got a lot of talent and we've seen the peak of his capabilities. And he's still 23(!). But there are a ton of red flags there too.

 

[bossram]

Here’s a Bowen Byram trade proposal from trades of similar aged players: Byram & 4th for Hoglander, 1st, & 2nd

I’m working on an article that explains my reasoning. Right now it’s just 6 pages of jumbled thoughts. I looked at 7 fairly recent trades as comparables.

Despite my reservations that I've listed extensively, that is automatic for VAN.

I just don't see why BUF would trade Byram, short of Willander in the return.

 

[credulous]

I think he's the most likely to move of the Nucks "Big 4" defensive prospects.

1. Willander - very unlikely to move esepcially as he's RHD
2. Mynio - seems like a steal and can play in all situations
3. EP 2 - Big, stay-at-home dman that I think mgmt and staff will love

So that leaves Kudryavstev who's style seems like the most likely to be "expendable" if in a trade for a player who fits more of the current team needs.

yeah i agree but i think kudryavtsev is the "safest" of the 4 prospects relative to value. i can't imagine him not being a useful nhl player

 

[MS]

But it's not. His subsequent seasons in COL post Cup run were also much weaker than he had performed previously. His 5v5 underlying metrics took a big hit, even before he landed in BUF. This is partly why COL was comfortable trading him for Mittselstadt. If he was performing at the level he was in 21-22, there is no way they trade him.

He's got a lot of talent and we've seen the peak of his capabilities. And he's still 23(!). But there are a ton of red flags there too.

His 'pre-concussion' results were also in a 30-game sample size of the softest/fewest minutes he's received in his career.

I don't see the red flags. He's pulling positive goal differentials this year and a positive Corsi from 23 minutes/game of mid-leverage on that Buffalo tire fire with a PDO of 100.

 

[credulous]

I think Byram is getting undervalued in general here, he would be a tremendous value add to our team and possibly extend the window

byram is really good but i do kinda think he's kind of a flight risk and might be tough to sign even as an rfa. if they're gonna make one big trade i think i'd prefer they look elsewhere

 

[LickTheEnvelope]

His 'pre-concussion' results were also in a 30-game sample size of the softest/fewest minutes he's received in his career.

I don't see the red flags. He's pulling positive goal differentials this year and a positive Corsi from 23 minutes/game of mid-leverage on that Buffalo tire fire with a PDO of 100.

He's a great D-man. The only concern with Byram is if he can stay healthy.

 

[wonton15]

byram is really good but i do kinda think he's kind of a flight risk and might be tough to sign even as an rfa. if they're gonna make one big trade i think i'd prefer they look elsewhere

I don’t think he’d be a flight risk if he came here. I don’t know anything about his thought process but I’d assume he’d love it in Vancouver.

What scares me is his concussion history, similar to Hronek’s shoulder. If we lock him up, it’s scary. But it’s probably a risk we’d take if we were even able to acquire him

 

[VanillaCoke]

Again, no. He has more injury risk. Especially with concussions (of which he's had multiple), where we know there is an elevated risk of re-injury and the recovery timelines are murky. This is a fact. It has to be taken into consideration.

Like I said, if we're excluding Williander or Lekk, there aren't really many tradeable assets to even make a deal that BUF might be interested in. Are they moving Byram for a 1st + 2nd? I don't think anymore picks are that valuable to them.

And again, like I said, his Byram's current level of play is a concern. He's never come close to reaching his performance during the Avs Cup run.

Okay you're concerned about his elevated injury risk and current play, I am not.

Given their circumstances idk if his price is that high anymore, we shall see shortly I'm guessing, but surely mgmt has done their own risk and value assessments, including the concerns you have.

Majority of my frequent Byram viewings have been positive and I think the fit here is very good, not that he's the only option. But Buf and VAN seem to have mutual interest in each others rosters.

 

[pitseleh]

His 'pre-concussion' results were also in a 30-game sample size of the softest/fewest minutes he's received in his career.

I don't see the red flags. He's pulling positive goal differentials this year and a positive Corsi from 23 minutes/game of mid-leverage on that Buffalo tire fire with a PDO of 100.

Dahlin is having a Hughes-like effect on Buffalo though. Byram’s running a score adjusted 57% with Dahlin, but only 47% without him, while Dahlin is at 61% without Byram.

That said, Hoglander, a first and a second is not much to give up and value-wise is good enough that you probably pull the trigger. The biggest issue is the opportunity cost of using those assets for Byram instead of a player who is a more sure-fire bet to help this year’s team.

 

[Canucker]

I don't dislike Byram at all and I'd be happy to have him, but I would really much rather try to use our most vital and tradeable assets towards a RHD...if a 1st, a 2nd and Hoglander can get Braden Schneider, or someone similar, instead of Byram, I think I'd prefer that route.

 

[VanillaCoke]

Connor Murphy, Jason Dickinson (max retention), [redacted]
For
Hoglander, 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th

We get a top 4 RHD with term, 3C, and a top 6 winger all in one trade

I read a hawks fans suggested Murphy & Hall@50% for Hoglander & Desharnais and whatever, and I'm into something like that.

Murphy Vlasic has looked too legit, and I think Hall has gas left, especially in this winning, competitive, much more enjoyable environment.

 

[Vector]

Despite my reservations that I've listed extensively, that is automatic for VAN.

I just don't see why BUF would trade Byram, short of Willander in the return.

Of all the trades I looked at, not a single top prospect was given up. Only one actual prospect was even traded. The return almost always ended up being draft picks and occasionally a young player.

That’s what I’m working with when coming up with the trade proposal.

 

[Just A Bit Outside]

I don't see Buffalo having any interest in Hoglander.

So maybe it's possible there are two deals?

One to trade away Hoglander and another to acquire Byram?

 

[Burke's Evil Spirit]

?????

That would be an utterly fantastic trade. A bunch of junk for one of the highest ES-producing top-4 defenders in the NHL who is only 23.

I think I devalue Byram due to his concussions more than others.